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3 minutes to find ball

Captainron said:
3 minutes is 3 minutes on the course. Once the time is up you have to continue with your provisional and that is just that. No I was only 12 seconds over or I thought I was inside 3 minutes.

No issues with what Phil wrote about telling someone that they were over their time limit as some people will take liberties with this.

I think I know him well enough to say that should the situation ever arise where someone exceeded the limits and played their ball which should have been declared lost under the new rules that he would refuse to sign the card. He is a stubborn bugger but I would do the same too
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I don't think anyone has an issue with that.

As I say I've never played with anyone who has a stop watch (unlike some very "organised" people on here) some glance at a watch. They give or take the 3 minutes. If it's 1441 they give or take at 1444.

That is an industry standard at club level golf from my experience.
 
Jacko_G said:
I don't think anyone has an issue with that.

As I say I've never played with anyone who has a stop watch (unlike some very "organised" people on here) some glance at a watch. They give or take the 3 minutes. If it's 1441 they give or take at 1444.

That is an industry standard at club level golf from my experience.
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In a comp it is always best to have a stopwatch or something to time your 3 minutes.

Everyone has a phone which has this capability. Just takes away any chance of being labelled as a cheat.

This is a very very simple rule to police and it just takes one moment of thought to get it right
 
Liverpoolphil said:
Just to clarify as it seems this has evolved

Whenever I go searching for my own ball I start my own timer on the trolley - that’s for my own benefit , I’ll take a glance when I think it’s three mins - if it’s over I stop and then go play my provisional

When going to help search for someone else’s ball - a quick glance at the time then search - after what I think his 3 mins a quick check and if it’s over just say it’s over three mins but by then I expect most will have already declared it lost etc

When someone finds the ball I’ll quickly check and if it’s over three I’ll say it looks like it’s over 3 mins - no issue

The problem with the comments on the thread is when someone suggested that if they knew the ball was found after the 3 mins they would be ok with ignoring it if it’s 20 seconds over then limit - that’s ignoring a clear rule in golf and a DQ

This is in competition golf - when playing with mates etc it’s a lot more relaxed etc

But if in a competition we need to follow the rules - it really is that simple surely
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But if you go to look for someone else's ball isn't the time starting when that player gets in the estimated area and starts looking not when you begin. It could be you get there before the PP looking for th ball and so you calling it three minutes may not be three minutes for them looking.
 
Colin L said:
If he carries on without correcting the wrong ball, he is disqualified in singles stroke play. In singles match play, he loses the hole when he plays his original (wrong) ball. In Stableford he scores no points for that hole. In Four Ball (stroke and match play) he is disqualified from the hole only but his partner isn't.
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this was a real incident in a comp (stroke play) so should we have told him he was DQ there and then (8th tee)and refused to sign the card..?
 
Captainron said:
In a comp it is always best to have a stopwatch or something to time your 3 minutes.

Everyone has a phone which has this capability. Just takes away any chance of being labelled as a cheat.

This is a very very simple rule to police and it just takes one moment of thought to get it right
Click to expand...

And by the time I go into my bag and grab a phone, switch it on, find the app, stick on the stopwatch the guys looking have already had 30/40 seconds so by the time I start it they've had time and I'm back to guessing.

Never once on all my life have I thought "has the winner cheated by having 3 minutes 3 seconds to find a ball.
 
The definition says it all... if it's lost, it's lost. Just play by the Rules.
Lost

The status of a ball that is not found in three minutes after the player or his or her caddie (or the player’s partner or partner’s caddie) begins to search for it.

If the search begins and is then temporarily interrupted for a good reason (such as when the player stops searching when play is suspended or needs to stand aside to wait for another player to play) or when the player has mistakenly identified a wrong ball:
  • The time between the interruption and when the search resumes does not count, and
  • The time allowed for search is three minutes in total, counting the search time both before the interruption and after the search resumes.
 
Wolf said:
Surely making the leap from someone not wearing a watch and calling what they think is time which even if a few seconds late then making monumental leap to saying that person would cheat in other ways such as leather wedge is in golfing vernacular equally as ludicrous.
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No-one has said that: it is a complete invention. To put the same point as was being made in a different way: do we have a hierarchy of rules ranked according to how much it matters to apply them fully, or to some extent or maybe not at all?
 
rulie said:
The definition says it all... if it's lost, it's lost. Just play by the Rules.
Lost

The status of a ball that is not found in three minutes after the player or his or her caddie (or the player’s partner or partner’s caddie) begins to search for it.

If the search begins and is then temporarily interrupted for a good reason (such as when the player stops searching when play is suspended or needs to stand aside to wait for another player to play) or when the player has mistakenly identified a wrong ball:
  • The time between the interruption and when the search resumes does not count, and
  • The time allowed for search is three minutes in total, counting the search time both before the interruption and after the search resumes.
Click to expand...

Not really difficult is it?
 
rulie said:
The definition says it all... if it's lost, it's lost. Just play by the Rules.
Lost

The status of a ball that is not found in three minutes after the player or his or her caddie (or the player’s partner or partner’s caddie) begins to search for it.

If the search begins and is then temporarily interrupted for a good reason (such as when the player stops searching when play is suspended or needs to stand aside to wait for another player to play) or when the player has mistakenly identified a wrong ball:
  • The time between the interruption and when the search resumes does not count, and
  • The time allowed for search is three minutes in total, counting the search time both before the interruption and after the search resumes.
Click to expand...

Again nobody is disputing when a ball is lost.
 
Colin L said:
No-one has said that: it is a complete invention. To put the same point as was being made in a different way: do we have a hierarchy of rules ranked according to how much it matters to apply them fully, or to some extent or maybe not at all?
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Fortunately the answers lie in Rule 1...so that's sorted! 🤔
 
rulie said:
The definition says it all... if it's lost, it's lost. Just play by the Rules.
Lost

The status of a ball that is not found in three minutes after the player or his or her caddie (or the player’s partner or partner’s caddie) begins to search for it.

If the search begins and is then temporarily interrupted for a good reason (such as when the player stops searching when play is suspended or needs to stand aside to wait for another player to play) or when the player has mistakenly identified a wrong ball:
  • The time between the interruption and when the search resumes does not count, and
  • The time allowed for search is three minutes in total, counting the search time both before the interruption and after the search resumes.
Click to expand...
Haha, everyone knows what the rule is mate. The discussion has evolved to how people interpret/evaluate/estimate/whatever that 3 minutes has past. For the vast majority an approximation is good enough while others are saying you need to time it to the exact second somehow.
 
Colin L said:
No-one has said that: it is a complete invention. To put the same point as was being made in a different way: do we have a hierarchy of rules ranked according to how much it matters to apply them fully, or to some extent or maybe not at all?
Click to expand...
I think it's more than not every rule is as black and white as some people would like to believe, when you actually apply them to real life golf situations.
 
Orikoru said:
So you would wait until they find the ball, and then break the news that they are just over the 3 minutes so have to play their provisional anyway? Wow. And you reckon they have no issue with that? Do people generally want to play rounds of golf with you?? If someone did that with me I'd think they were a tosser. Sorry but that's the truth.

I'll try and put it another way just so I'm not repeating myself any more than I probably have already. When my wife says she'll be home in half an hour, and she arrives home 32 minutes later, I don't ask her where the hell she's been and why she's later than the parameters that were outlined - but I imagine you would. No, in my mind 32 minutes is about half an hour so she was fine. So by the same token, if someone finds their golf ball in about 3 minutes, they're fine, and to my mind they haven't broken any rules. That's the way I choose to look at it, because life is too short to be faffing around with stopwatches just so you can take joy in penalising somebody, when the primary aim of golf, even in a competition, is to enjoy the round. I could not enjoy my round playing with someone who had a bloody stopwatch out when I'm trying to find my ball - just as I'm sure my wife would not enjoy being married to someone who yelled at her for being 2 mins later than the half an hour stated. ;)
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I think you need to read what I posted

So I’ll be helping someone search for their ball , a quick glance to see if it’s 3 mins whilst searching , but I’m not there timing as such - when they find the ball a quick glance if it’s over 3 mins then what else am I supposed to do ? If I ignore the rule break I’m DQ’d

Plenty play golf with me and ask me rules advice etc and we have had times where people think they have took longer than 3 mins and they have just gone and played their provisional

Why would you think someone is a tosser because they play to the rules ?

Your wife timings are irrelevant - it’s not a competitive sport where rules apply to everyone

No one has said anyone gets “joy” from applying penalties

And just because a primary aim is to enjoy the golf - it also needs to be done within the rules set out by the governing bodies - your actions affect not only yourself but the whole field

I’m sure you would allow any other rule break so why the timing on searching for a ball
 
Liverpoolphil said:
I think you need to read what I posted

So I’ll be helping someone search for their ball , a quick glance to see if it’s 3 mins whilst searching , but I’m not there timing as such - when they find the ball a quick glance if it’s over 3 mins then what else am I supposed to do ? If I ignore the rule break I’m DQ’d

Plenty play golf with me and ask me rules advice etc and we have had times where people think they have took longer than 3 mins and they have just gone and played their provisional

Why would you think someone is a tosser because they play to the rules ?

Your wife timings are irrelevant - it’s not a competitive sport where rules apply to everyone

No one has said anyone gets “joy” from applying penalties

And just because a primary aim is to enjoy the golf - it also needs to be done within the rules set out by the governing bodies - your actions affect not only yourself but the whole field

I’m sure you would allow any other rule break so why the timing on searching for a ball
Click to expand...
How are you 'just glancing' but you know if he's a few seconds past the three minutes or not?? That's not glancing that's rigid timekeeping.

The crux of my point is that the vast majority are not like you, they will estimate or approximate whether it's been three minutes or not, so they'd have to be quite far beyond the 3 minutes for that to be fairly declared as lost I would think. Not just a few seconds past as nobody could definitely state it was past the time. So in that sense they get the benefit of the doubt. Again, that is how 90% of people are going to go about it. And those 90% of people are not to be branded cheats because they may have inadvertently played a ball they found after 3 mins and 5 seconds - it's called courtesy.
 
Orikoru said:
How are you 'just glancing' but you know if he's a few seconds past the three minutes or not?? That's not glancing that's rigid timekeeping.

The crux of my point is that the vast majority are not like you, they will estimate or approximate whether it's been three minutes or not, so they'd have to be quite far beyond the 3 minutes for that to be fairly declared as lost I would think. Not just a few seconds past as nobody could definitely state it was past the time. So in that sense they get the benefit of the doubt. Again, that is how 90% of people are going to go about it. And those 90% of people are not to be branded cheats because they may have inadvertently played a ball they found after 3 mins and 5 seconds - it's called courtesy.
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If you know it's over time it's actually called cheating 😉
 
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