Colin L
Tour Winner
The only Rule I can think of that could be broken is 10.2 by asking for advice from a player in the other match. There is also Clarification 10.2a/2: you would need to stop a player in the other match from giving you advice.
2x2ball Matches in a group of four
- Thread starter SwingsitlikeHogan
- Start date
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
The club organiser is in error in my opinion.
You are playing a club competition where you are allowed to play at a convenient time.
Your match takes precedence over social games.
You should play as a two ball as that is the club competition.
Social games should wave you through if they are holding you up. You should ask (or tell them) to play through if they do not wave you through.
This is how it works at my club. Club competitions take precedence over social games.
I got waved through by 5 social games in recent years playing a scratch knockout game.
All it takes is for H&C to notify this as club policy.
You are playing a club competition where you are allowed to play at a convenient time.
Your match takes precedence over social games.
You should play as a two ball as that is the club competition.
Social games should wave you through if they are holding you up. You should ask (or tell them) to play through if they do not wave you through.
This is how it works at my club. Club competitions take precedence over social games.
I got waved through by 5 social games in recent years playing a scratch knockout game.
All it takes is for H&C to notify this as club policy.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
Not really practical when it’s coming into winter and there is already a finite amount of winter tee times for the members - especially at the weekends when the tee sheet is full
We have been joining up matches in the winter out of consideration for all and it’s worked fine
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
We don't have club knockouts during the winter and that works fine. So our rules for knockouts works fine.
A two ball knockout in a club competition being required to play with two others playing social golf is not something I have ever encountered and seems very odd to me that a club demands members accept this.
I would find the other game very distracting and if I were one of the social players I would feel ill-at-ease getting in the way of the club competition competitors.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
If you don’t have club KO’s in the winter then there is no issues for your club
And we don’t pair a KO with social golf - it’s two KO’s together and dont were someone has said that they are “demanded” to be pair with social golfers
I have played KO in 4ball before and it’s not bothered either of us - it’s just a club KO
And we have removed the idea that a KO has priority weekend mornings
Couldn't disagree more. A club knockout competition has no more right to be on the course than a social game. Play your game, wait your turn.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
Different ethos at my club where club-organised comps and matches take precedence. Been that way for 50 years - possibly more.
I can't imagine a vote ever occurring to change it.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
What if that club organised match is holding everyone up - do they still have the precedence ?
The only people that should have any precedence on the course is when a group is playing at a quicker pace and should be allowed through
There is nothing worse than a 4 ball being in a comp holding up a 2 ball
D-S
Well-known member
This can be a recipe for all sorts of entitled behaviour.
“We are coming through, despite their being no gap, as we are playing a Club 4BB knockout”.
“You cannot play though, despite the huge gap in front of us, as we are playing a Club knockout”.
“We are coming through, despite their being no gap, as we are playing a Club 4BB knockout”.
“You cannot play though, despite the huge gap in front of us, as we are playing a Club knockout”.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
Imagined scenarios.
At our club we adhere to club policy. This does leave scope for common sense.
I am not aware of any such entitled behaviour at our club.
Your club may be different.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
If you turn up as a two ball behind an organised team match that has had tee reservations clearly posted for over a week, do not expect to be waved through.
That does not preclude being waved through.
Scope for common sense prevails.
Club policy is very clear and does not cause these problems that you are imagining.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
Club policy should never dictate that a 4 ball has the right to hold up a golf course just because they are playing in a competition
one of the biggest issues in golf is pace of play , and lack of general etiquette- a group not letting quicker players through because they are playing a competition is typical of old mentality within certain areas of the golf club
We removed any rights for a competition on the golf course to ensure everyone has the same rights and pace of play is adhered to
If someone can only play at a certain time and it’s behind a KO match then I would expect the KO match to let people through
D-S
Well-known member
No not imagined, remembered instances. Fortunately my club does not have any of this nonsense.
doublebogey7
Head Pro
I don't particulalrly like club rules that allow one group of people precedence over another, however some good sence by all does needs to prevail. If a Better Ball team match, consisting of 24 players, has been scheduled for late afternoon, then a a two ball playing social golf cannot expect to be let through unless the group in front has lost at least a hole from the group in front of them. Team matches are diaried months in advance so if you are a two ball wishing to play after a mastch either you need to except a slowish round or find gaps to move around the course to enjoy your practise. On the other hand if you are playing in a single BB match in the morning and a two ball is following you with gaps in front of you simply let them through, you will enjoy your game rather more when not worrying about the group bihind. Competitive golf is the lifeblood of most golf clubs and without it, it's doubtfull many clubs would exist.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
I'm trying to imagine the case against my club policy being put in the ways done here at an AGM to persuade my club members to vote for a change in its policy.
Organised club competitions take precedence over social games within reason.
No one has ever put a case for social golf to have equal precedence on the course at an AGM as far as I know. Tee time booking has often been discussed.
But players in club comps accepting to not be let through slower social games in front of them - would not get anywhere as a case for AGM discussion.
Playing a club scratch knockout semi-final on a weekday evening behind a social fourball who do not let you through because, "We are keeping up with the 4-ball in front of us", thankfully does not happen. Members know, or should know, the club policy. Let the quicker club comp players through.
It works. No one is seriously disadvantaged. It encourages courteous behaviour. It enhances our reputation as a club with plenty of competitive play as well as social play.
Organised club competitions take precedence over social games within reason.
No one has ever put a case for social golf to have equal precedence on the course at an AGM as far as I know. Tee time booking has often been discussed.
But players in club comps accepting to not be let through slower social games in front of them - would not get anywhere as a case for AGM discussion.
Playing a club scratch knockout semi-final on a weekday evening behind a social fourball who do not let you through because, "We are keeping up with the 4-ball in front of us", thankfully does not happen. Members know, or should know, the club policy. Let the quicker club comp players through.
It works. No one is seriously disadvantaged. It encourages courteous behaviour. It enhances our reputation as a club with plenty of competitive play as well as social play.
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
A very good description of the working and practicalities of my club policy.
@Voyager EMH you keep making the assumption that the club comp players will be quicker. Why? If a match is holding up social players, do you keep holding them up for 18 holes?
If a match is quicker, then let them through. However, you let them through because they are quicker, not because they are in a match. The match is irrelevant, or should be irrelevant, to the decision.
If a match is quicker, then let them through. However, you let them through because they are quicker, not because they are in a match. The match is irrelevant, or should be irrelevant, to the decision.
Arthur Wedge
Well-known member
I’ll ask again
What if the comp group is slower ?
You appear to have a thinking that the comp group will be quicker ?
“Quicker comp players”
“Slower social games”
Voyager EMH
Slipper Wearing Plucker of Pheasants
The OP is about a 2-ball match among 4-ball social games.
At my club the 4-ball social games are obliged to let the 2-ball matchplay club comp through.
The 2-ball is never obliged to join with another two ball to have their 3-hour game slowed to a 4-hour game.
This is how it is done at my club. Social games are obliged to give way to the club comp and not hold them up. The club comp takes precedence.
All other tiresome comments and question were answered in my previous posts, if they are read carefully enough. Can't be bothered addressing them in any more detail - too tiresome.
If you don't like this approach from me - make you own answers up.
I did state,
eg: Within reason. Common sense prevailing.
At my club the 4-ball social games are obliged to let the 2-ball matchplay club comp through.
The 2-ball is never obliged to join with another two ball to have their 3-hour game slowed to a 4-hour game.
This is how it is done at my club. Social games are obliged to give way to the club comp and not hold them up. The club comp takes precedence.
All other tiresome comments and question were answered in my previous posts, if they are read carefully enough. Can't be bothered addressing them in any more detail - too tiresome.
If you don't like this approach from me - make you own answers up.
I did state,
eg: Within reason. Common sense prevailing.
jim8flog
Journeyman Pro
We have the opposite club rule
Matches do not have priority on the course. Introduced simply because matches are likely to be slower than social games. Usual faster game should let a slower game through apply.
