would you miss your pro?

drawboy

drawboy

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Following on from a discussion in our lounge bar this morning on just how much a pro is needed these days, I would like to ask. How much would you miss your pro?
Bear in mind that he is probably on a retainer of approx 20 grand plus out of the clubs subs. That is just his basic wage, throw in a rent,electricity free shop and the fact that all purchases are his as are all earnings from any lessons.
Do you have a comp sec who checks the cards and works out the winners and handicaps on a voluntary basis and a night where you book on for the weekend so your tee times are pre booked he is not needed for those things.Filling out your card is easy enough. You can get your clubs,balls,gloves etc online or in the likes of AG or Direct golf, custom fit can also be obtained from all manufacturers free of charge. A drink and mars bar can be bought from a shop on route to the club also.
Don't get me wrong I'm not calling for any pro to lose his job, but considering these things would you genuinely miss him if he was not there and your club was making the savings for his wages. Pro's are traditional but are they really necessary anymore
 
And if the club were making the savings from his wages, where would they go???
I can guarantee they wouldn't be spent for the benefit of the membership.
The secretary would give himself a nice little hike in wages, and the secretary's secretary.
 
Talented people deserve reward for their skills and hard work. Our pros work very hard. I have 1 lesson a month and I see mine as more of a coach than a pro. He often can be seen out on the course in a marshall buggy too.
 
Talented people deserve reward for their skills and hard work. Our pros work very hard. I have 1 lesson a month and I see mine as more of a coach than a pro. He often can be seen out on the course in a marshall buggy too.
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Why couldn't he give lessons from his house like a driving instructor and rent time on the practice ground, and couldn't your greenkeeper or club official perform the marshalling?
Still a 20 grand saving!
 
Being a small club in a small place we dont have a club pro. A guy from Inverness GC comes up once a year for a couple of days and does lessons and takes a selection of new clubs. He's usually busy with lessons but we just dont have the income at the club to pay a pro's wages on a permanent basis.
 
I would. Lessons, free advice, demo clubs, banter, willingness to try and match Internet prices. I really value mine and his assistant.
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Our swindle (20 golfers) had this discussion as the OP states, Lessons from local range, free advise also local range,demo clubs the same place, internet prices are already on the net so no need to try to match them, still 20 grand saving with no inconvieniance to any golfer. Is a bit of banter worth 20 grand per year, if it was your firm would you pay someone that amount to give a bit of banter?
 
personally the pro at my club has never done anything for me.
ive never had a lesson with him and i dont plan to.

maybe other folk at my club would say that he is worthwhile, maybe they make some use of him.

my question is similar to yours drawboy, what does a course pro do for his salary? the shop and lessons are all outside of his salary so what does the salary account for?

but i do ofcourse see the need for pro/coaches,a friend is a pro and his brother too, i tend to spend an evening at the range per week with them for some tips banter and even a lesson if i decide i am ready for some new advice.

anytime i go to my course its to play 9 or 18holes, i cant imagine going for a lesson.

Phil
 
Yes!!!! 20k a year between a few hundred members isn't a lot. Lessons is number one of course and I can't believe you'd build up the same relationship with a pro from a range as you do with the guy you see virtually every time you go to the course. The chat/banter is important (getting a pro's views on what's new, is it any good, how's the course, who's playing well on the telly, etc, etc) and you can pop in the shop any time to get advice and give feedback on any little thing, be it equipment or your game. Can't imagine a club without a pro, should be right at the heart of a good club in my view.
 
You'd still have to pay someone to take the green fees and sell the mars bars which will probably cost you £12-15K per annum, might aswell pay the extra 5K and have a professional mars bar salesman! :)
 
Our club pro retired last year and between February and August we didn't even have a shop. We now have a shop selling all the basics but not clubs and handling booking etc with no pro.

During the period without a shop "the pro" was certainly missed. However, now we have a working shop there is very little difference to before. 90% of people I know did not use the pro apart from prizes and never booked lessons with him. He spent nearly all his time as a shopkeeper, an occupation which does not demand the golf skills he undoubtedly posessed. I know many clubs are looking critically at the value they get from type sort of deal described in the OP and I can see a day very soon when a lot of clubs will maybe ditch this setup. I don't necessarily think this is a good thing but savings will have to be made unless clubs can get more younger people to join. They can't just keep putting the subs up.
 
I'm with James. The retainer is little more than the cost of employing a staff member to do all the things the pro does. Also as an employee of the club, for which you are a paying member, he should feel he has a duty to you. If mine gave me duff advice he has to look me in the eye every time I go to the club. So far he's been great.

Also the pro at the range is probably on a retainer at the club it's attached to.
 
You'd still have to pay someone to take the green fees and sell the mars bars which will probably cost you £12-15K per annum, might aswell pay the extra 5K and have a professional mars bar salesman! :)
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£12-£15k per annum? Will they ony collect green fees and sell mars bars 5 days a week for only part of the day, for just 47 weeks a year?
 
I think a good pro is an asset to a club. If you have one with a good teaching reputation it attracts people to the club and that could be used as a way of attracting new members.

I'd miss mine as I get to try a lot of the new stuff on a regular basis on the course rather than just hitting on the range. I get great deals on my gear, free tips and decent service for things like club repairs.
 
Short answer -yes. Current pro is a nice guy, very proactive, regular email news letter and always quick to organise a comp if nothings on. Worth every penny and a bit more.
 
Yes. I have lessons with our pro, he's regripped my clubs, he checked the loft of a wedge of mine after a chipping lesson and re-lofted it(without charge)and was really helpful at suggesting playing partners during the week when the course is quiet. During the summer he must be at the club well over 60 hours a week (much less in winter obviously), and is definitely used a great deal by the members for lessons, club repairs etc.
 
In answer to the OP, yes.

I'm a little confused with some of the posts here that seem to question what worth a Pro brings to the club.
At our place, he operates as the starter, he deals with visiting parties and their bookings and requirements, he assists various sub committees on specific items, he provides coaching for the Junior Members (10-12 evenings in summer season) He does give lessons, but the competitive marketplace means that his charges for lessons certainly aren't going to take him to the Caribean on a cruise every winter. He's there to answer the calls to the pro shop to find out if the course is open, if it's closed. did anyone hand in... you know the sort of thing.
An average retainer isn't enough to run a business that has to operate 7 days a week, operate long hours during the summer and still be there in case someone wants something out the shop during the dead season in mid winter. Since the Pro is unlikely to be able to attend every day, he's also going to have to employ someone to cover the times when he is not available. That retainer isn't going to go very far when taking all that into account.

Very short sited view to try and dispense with his services IMO :(
 
Very interesting thought this.

I think most clubs would miss their pro but will golf clubs be able to sustain them?

I can only see their market for club sales getting smaller and smaller as the big chains and the internet eat away at their business.

Fyldewhite's experience of not having a pro for a little while may well be crucial. If club's don't have a pro for a while, they may well get used to it and decide not to have one.

Personally, I think it'd be a huge shame as most that I've come across are a key part of the fabric of their club.
 
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