What's going to get us to leave the car.

[Hobbit]

It's just always the way tho. Just come up with an idea that really doesn't affect the generation of the person coming up with it and trying to force it onto another generation who have their own issues.

Yes we need to change but technology will help and innovation will come.

For example how long before a person buys an electric car.. gets solar panels for their house then gets some old electric car Batteries on the side of their house (this is what nissan are working towards)

Solar charges the batteries up during the day then at night the batteries charge up the car

That person's travel would become cost neutral as would their carbon footprint for that car ..

I want to get onto stage one which is lease myself a leaf.. not committing to the buy yet as the tech isn't fully proven

I do 50 miles a day round trip so 2 days before a charge

Use that for work would make me much better

I can work on the wife with the solar panels as she doesn't want them

Little changes like that from everyone can add up

If you don't drive many miles per year and don't use more than 100 miles in a go you should look at an electric car. That would help for sure .

For example another thing we are doing is cutting down on meat slightly. Not a lot.. every other day is veggie for dinner.. helps slightly

Everyone can do little bits and it makes change

Rather than right your under 25 you shouldn't drive

Your over 65 you should get a bus

I agree with pretty everything bar your concluding para. Why penalise any generation? Should the older generation stand in a bus queue? And what percentage difference would banning either generation from the roads? But as SR says, we're being a little narrow with our focus. The changes need to be more encompassing and dramatic.

Better technologies, better infrastructure, changing mindsets and habits. The changes ripple through so many aspects of life. The changes to manufacturing, and what industries would die or grow from those changes. What would the infrastructure need to look like? Changes from High Street shopping to more internet shopping, but what would the High Street look like? What tax breaks would help, e.g. dumping a gas boiler for alternative technologies even though there's plenty of life left in the boiler?

 

[Deleted member 21784]

I agree with pretty everything bar your concluding para. Why penalise any generation? Should the older generation stand in a bus queue? And what percentage difference would banning either generation from the roads? But as SR says, we're being a little narrow with our focus. The changes need to be more encompassing and dramatic.

Better technologies, better infrastructure, changing mindsets and habits. The changes ripple through so many aspects of life. The changes to manufacturing, and what industries would die or grow from those changes. What would the infrastructure need to look like? Changes from High Street shopping to more internet shopping, but what would the High Street look like? What tax breaks would help, e.g. dumping a gas boiler for alternative technologies even though there's plenty of life left in the boiler?

that was the point.. its a generalization that shouldn't be used .. everyone should change rather than make one generation suffer

 

[Deleted member 21784]

Any suggestions or thoughts I have made are simply in respect of somehow not getting car-use established as an essential part of an individual's life. Once car-use is established I am thinking that it is very hard to break - since many aspects of that person's life will be based upon have readily available car use. We have moved from a position where a car was a luxury (when my dad first got a car in 1963), then a bit of a luxury and status thing - to it being a day-2-day essential.

It may never now be possible for car-use to not be essential for some things - but how do we make car-use less essential for more things.

thing is even without a car people will still relay on cars. Taxis to take them to work.. parents giving them lifts..

still cars

then they will be like could save myself some cash.. drive myself

 

[Deleted member 21784]

Who deems what is acceptable use though. Not all 17 - 25 year old expect to own a car. Many people of that age need access to a car to get to work, its not as simple as restricting number of cars per household. We need a minimum of 2 cars in my house due to where we live, how far we are from nearest towns, work and absolute lack of public transport. If my oldest daughter lived with us that need would go up to 3 cars due to all the above, due to shift patterns being often opposite and fact myself, my wife and daughter all work in separate towns so no feasible way to give lifts.. This is a common theme in rural areas like ours, its not expectation its purely necessity. Under your idea of higher taxing that would simply put my daughter out of work and college, then what she becomes a drain on welfare.

What needs to happen is transport links need massively improving to allow better access to towns, city's etc., part of that needs to be more affordable as well. I'd love for us to be able to have less use of cars. Hopefully with Mrs Wolf progressing her change of career and mine by the end if the summer we will be in a position to lose one of our cars and next year when mines due for renewal change to a hybrid. These are small changes effectively but requires big lifestyle change to put into place unfortunately for us.

a guy at work tried to convince me I could get by with just 1 car. Which in theory I could but in practice is a massive pain

wife works 3 days a week so id have to leave the car for her the other 2 days.. taking my travel time from 45 mins each way to hour and 45

at a weekend imagine doing 12 hour shifts with 2 hours each way.. because the car would have to be at home for the wife to use with the family

so a cheap second car is much better option

hence why im pushing for a leaf.. I don't need a flash motor to get to work.. and if I can save some cash and lower petrol use why not

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Yes I know - but many get their provisional licence and learn to drive - waiting to turn 17 when they can get a car and drive themselves. I was suggesting that many girls (and lads) could drive a parents car once they have passed their test. They don't need to own their own.

Better idea....why don’t we ban anyone who qualifies for a free bus pass from owning or driving a car.....they obviously have access to free transport.

I didn’t think you’d like that idea....

 

[Wolf]

a guy at work tried to convince me I could get by with just 1 car. Which in theory I could but in practice is a massive pain

wife works 3 days a week so id have to leave the car for her the other 2 days.. taking my travel time from 45 mins each way to hour and 45

at a weekend imagine doing 12 hour shifts with 2 hours each way.. because the car would have to be at home for the wife to use with the family

so a cheap second car is much better option

hence why im pushing for a leaf.. I don't need a flash motor to get to work.. and if I can save some cash and lower petrol use why not

There in lies the issue some people don't understand, everyone circumstances are different and why a blanket ban approach simply isn't feasible. Wife and I both work shifts that can start as early as 530am and Finish at 11pm. We work rolling shifts of 5 days out of 7 due to industry we work in. However work in towns about 20 miles apart. There is no feasible way to share a single car as there is no public transport at times required we have no choice but to run 2 cars. If my daughter came to live with us instead of with her mum she'd have to learn to drive and get a 3rd car in our household as she works 4 days and attends college 3 days, and due to work patterns we simply couldn't take her.

If we had better transport links it could perhaps be feasible but would be more costly and double the time.

Once our new jobs are hopefully sorted we can drop a car and get a hybrid as still wouldn't be feasible to go full electric due to other journeys we'd still have. But it would be a start.

 

[MegaSteve]

Simply changing the motive power won't be enough... It will be wholesale changes in attitude and lifestyle that will be required... I've seen photographs of workplaces, in the 50's, with a mere handful of cars parked up but with rows and rows of bike sheds stacked full of pedal cycles... I can just about remember it being near impossible to cross the main road when it was kicking out time for the local factories and everyone got on their cycles and pedalled home...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I don't think we can change us very much - maybe a bit incrementally. But I do think we can - and have to - change the starting point in respect of cars and living/working habits of new drivers. So that when the next generations of drivers get to their mid-late 20s when they could afford a car and the insurance - they do not have the same need - and hence desire - to have one.

But we of older generations have to support them along the way to reach that point - by demonstrating our own willingness to adopt change - albeit incrementally. We must also show that we accept many of the arguments of climate change that the younger generations are willing to take on board - and not just hammer them for 'being so naive' and disruptive with their protests....

 

[Deleted member 21784]

There in lies the issue some people don't understand, everyone circumstances are different and why a blanket ban approach simply isn't feasible. Wife and I both work shifts that can start as early as 530am and Finish at 11pm. We work rolling shifts of 5 days out of 7 due to industry we work in. However work in towns about 20 miles apart. There is no feasible way to share a single car as there is no public transport at times required we have no choice but to run 2 cars. If my daughter came to live with us instead of with her mum she'd have to learn to drive and get a 3rd car in our household as she works 4 days and attends college 3 days, and due to work patterns we simply couldn't take her.

If we had better transport links it could perhaps be feasible but would be more costly and double the time.

Once our new jobs are hopefully sorted we can drop a car and get a hybrid as still wouldn't be feasible to go full electric due to other journeys we'd still have. But it would be a start.

See that's perfect , having a plan to change is great. If every house hold could do it some how what a change it would be

I'm noticing young people wanting to change more..and more so slowly change could come

Wasn't it Volvo who said all their new cars will have a hybrid battery?

 

[Wolf]

See that's perfect , having a plan to change is great. If every house hold could do it some how what a change it would be

I'm noticing young people wanting to change more..and more so slowly change could come

Wasn't it Volvo who said all their new cars will have a hybrid battery?

Exactly right, people seem to want radical changes though and think that's the answer it really isn't. We are planning small steps to start and gradually that will evolve into further improvement forus. If everyone did that we would all get there as a collective.

It was indeed Volvo all new cars to be minimum of hybrid with full EV options also

 

[MegaSteve]

Exactly right, people seem to want radical changes though and think that's the answer it really isn't. We are planning small steps to start and gradually that will evolve into further improvement forus. If everyone did that we would all get there as a collective.

It was indeed Volvo all new cars to be minimum of hybrid with full EV options also

I am going to suggest it is radical changes that are required... Small steps appear to be getting 'us' nowhere...

The question posed was "What's going to get us to leave the car?"... Seems to me most of the responses are excuses as why we can't rather reasons why we can...

Denial, denial, denial...

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I am going to suggest it is radical changes that are required... Small steps appear to be getting 'us' nowhere...

The question posed was "What's going to get us to leave the car?"... Seems to me most of the responses are excuses as why we can't rather reasons why we can...

Denial, denial, denial...

I rather agree - why I can only see a solution coming from a dramatic change for the next generations of drivers, with these drivers being supported by incremental but real changes in the behaviours of existing drivers - and supported by our support in the climate causes that will enable the next generation to accept the significant changes.

For us long as 'we' dismiss 'their' climate change concerns and protests as 'naive' and 'wrong-sighted', many of those younger folks will reject suggestions that 'they' - not 'us' - should shoulder the load of significant change.

 

[GB72]

The trouble is that a lot of proposed policy comes from those living in cities. If I lived in London or any of the major metropolitan areas where you can hop on some form of public transport pretty much when you want and get to where you want then I would use it. Would be mad not to and perhaps the first target should be restricting car ownership in major cities or restricting ownership to small and electric vehicles. Nobody really takes rural communities into account. My village literally has 2 buses about 8.00 in the morning and one back at about 5.00 and if the bus companies could ditch those then they would. A cab home is between £15 and £25 depending on time and normally need some form of booking in advance. What bus company is going to put on regular services which would not even have enough on most of them to cover the fuel costs.

 

[pendodave]

If everyone drove around in a ford fiesta with a 650cc engine, pollution in all its forms would be reduced by a lot (half?) overnight. There would be almost no significant changes required to our current living, working, shopping and leisure practices. Yet even that is impossible, because we have a combination of political disfunction, corporate lobbying and individual 'specialness' that would prevent it.
So let's not even talk about talk about the other stuff that would only happen in some sort of apocalypse.

We're *****d

 

[upsidedown]

Correct. My two have been through this recently and you can not get on the road in a car until you are 17. Bizarrely, a useless fact for you, you can drive a tractor on the road at 16! Not just on a farm, actually on the highways.

Only if you've passed your test and it's under 2.45m wide .
Where we live public transport is not an option,nearest town is 4 miles and there is talk of the one bus service being discontinued from there to 3 bigger towns down to just 2

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Only if you've passed your test and it's under 2.45m wide .

I'm going off a farmer we know nearby. Her son was driving a tractor at 16 on the A1. His test was judged by someone else within the farming community who knew him and his family well, he was never going to fail. His mother was appalled. Maybe things have moved on, the bloke is in his mid 30's now.

Saying that, why 16 and not 17 as with other 4 wheeled vehicles?

 

[drdel]

I just wonder who the 'They' are that will give up their cars and/or travel by bus or downsize to a small vehicle ?

Surely you don't mean 'ME' and 'WE' !!!

I've got a PHEV but at the end of the day; across the globe we'll all need to modify our behaviour and therein lies the biggest challenge.

 

[upsidedown]

I'm going off a farmer we know nearby. Her son was driving a tractor at 16 on the A1. His test was judged by someone else within the farming community who knew him and his family well, he was never going to fail. His mother was appalled. Maybe things have moved on, the bloke is in his mid 30's now.

Saying that, why 16 and not 17 as with other 4 wheeled vehicles?

Don't know, guess it's to do with the weights ? I learnt to drive a tractor at 9, MF 135 which was fairly usual in the farming fraternity

 

[oxymoron]

I am going to suggest it is radical changes that are required... Small steps appear to be getting 'us' nowhere...

The question posed was "What's going to get us to leave the car?"... Seems to me most of the responses are excuses as why we can't rather reasons why we can...

Denial, denial, denial...

Its not denial i think it is a fact of modern life, we now work and live in a 24 hour , 7 day a week society and round where i live public transport stops around 23:00 only to restart at about 05:00
so it is pretty much useless to quite a few workers.And do not forget the society we live in was created by us , our desire to have everything on tap 24 hours a day from supermarkets to pubs .
We need a complete rethink on public transport , it needs to fit with the areas and public in those areas ,however this is never going to fly because the companies need to make a profit to keep going
and are not going to put a bus out at ,say 03:00 for just one person it is just not feasible .
Then again our power infrastructure is probably not up to a sudden take up of electric cars at the moment.

I am not making excuses its just how i see things .
And i would love to be able to have an electric vehicle but we have a terraced house but that is another topic for another day i suppose.

 

[SocketRocket]

Ah

I'm going off a farmer we know nearby. Her son was driving a tractor at 16 on the A1. His test was judged by someone else within the farming community who knew him and his family well, he was never going to fail. His mother was appalled. Maybe things have moved on, the bloke is in his mid 30's now.

Saying that, why 16 and not 17 as with other 4 wheeled vehicles?

I used to like tractors