TV replays and golf rulings

[Neilds]

The thread about Patrick Reed has raised quite a few comments about TV replays showing the ball clearly bouncing but no one else seeing this. Do people think that referees should use any TV coverage or carry on relying on players to self govern? Bearing in mind some of the issues raised previously when posts were condemning trial by TV when viewers texted in when they saw minute movements of a ball which subsequently got players disqualified or using replays to direct a search for a ball.
I am interested in what people think, do we refer to TV pictures or not?

 

[ScienceBoy]

I don’t think there is any argument for TV refereeing in golf as it is unlikely to be equally applied to all players. It works in Tennis, football, rugby etc as all the cameras point inwards onto a small playing surface.

Golf is played over a large area with lots of things to obscure view, not just the occasional prop’s posterior...

Having said that, knowingly (via TV) and unknowingly (no replay) is the closest we could get but is that enough?

 

[Neilds]

I don’t think there is any argument for TV refereeing in golf as it is unlikely to be equally applied to all players. It works in Tennis, football, rugby etc as all the cameras point inwards onto a small playing surface.

Golf is played over a large area with lots of things to obscure view, not just the occasional prop’s posterior...

Having said that, knowingly (via TV) and unknowingly (no replay) is the closest we could get but is that enough?

Tennis and football do not use technology equally. The FA cup only uses VAR on Premiership grounds and Wimbledon only uses Hawkeye on the show courts so not all players benefit from the use of challenges.
In my opinion, in a set competition the rules should be same for everyone. Either all use any technology or no one does.
Also, the argument here is that tv showed the ball bounced and that is what a lot of posters are mentioning- but are these the same people who complained when a player recently benefited when tv replays were shown to direct him to where his ball was likely to be in the rough?

 

[Captainron]

Tennis and football do not use technology equally. The FA cup only uses VAR on Premiership grounds and Wimbledon only uses Hawkeye on the show courts so not all players benefit from the use of challenges.
In my opinion, in a set competition the rules should be same for everyone. Either all use any technology or no one does.
Also, the argument here is that tv showed the ball bounced and that is what a lot of posters are mentioning- but are these the same people who complained when a player recently benefited when tv replays were shown to direct him to where his ball was likely to be in the rough?

You’re not going to get absolute coverage on a golf course. Undulations and size make it too difficult. Adding cameras to check rules is also ridiculous in terms of cost.

 

[Fabia999]

Did they not use TV replay to show that Jon Rahm hit the ball twice on his chip in at the memorial tournament last year?

 

[rosecott]

I seem to remember that they decided a couple of years ago that there would be no action taken after viewers had called in after spotting things on TV.

 

[USER1999]

It is difficult when the viewers can see on TV, and the people making the decisions can't. They make the wrong decision, witnessed by millions, and faith in the system is undermined.
I don't like the macro shots to see if the ball moved. They are unnecessary and the TV companies should agree not to use this technology.
TV can be a help. Kevin Na once had to get the media to replay his hole, and count how many shots he had taken (15?).

 

[rosecott]

Did they not use TV replay to show that Jon Rahm hit the ball twice on his chip in at the memorial tournament last year?

The penalty for a double hit was removed in 2019.

 

[Ethan]

I am not a fan of Reed but as far as I can see, based on the information available at the time, the ruling was reasonable and we should move on. TV replays should only be used as evidence of deliberate deception by a player rather than revisiting what happened 200 yards away from them.

 

[Golfnut1957]

While I understand that you are talking about trial by tv in general in this instance I don't see how it would have helped.
The doubt that people have regarding Reeds actions revolves around whether the ball was actually plugged or not. He didn't do anything that millions of other golfers do in these circumstances, I do it myself, obviously.
The ball appears to be plugged, the only way I can confirm this is by picking it up, I inform my PP and if it is I invite my PP to come and inspect it, generally they couldn't care less and decline, so I drop it and move on. Alternatively if it wasn't plugged I replace it.
The main difference here is that on the Tour they have access to a referee who generally gets called in for the most obvious of decisions (see, I can't take my stance on this tee because of a sprinkler head) usually before they touch the ball, almost never after they pick it up and poke around the hole.
In this instance there is not a replay in the world which could confirm that his ball was plugged, that is between Reed and his conscience.
To answer your general question, no. I prefer to believe that they are honourable.

 

[Orikoru]

Well VAR has worked brilliantly in football so I can't see why not!

 

[ScienceBoy]

Tennis and football do not use technology equally. The FA cup only uses VAR on Premiership grounds and Wimbledon only uses Hawkeye on the show courts so not all players benefit from the use of challenges.

I do see your point here, but one could argue that within the confines of the match it is applied equally to both sides, I do agree it isn’t equal across the whole competition in the examples you have provided.

Is a single days golf one match when compared to a game of football or a tennis match?

I am still very much for TV refs in Rugby League, where I have most experience of it but very much against it for professional golf.

 

[jim8flog]

I seem to remember that they decided a couple of years ago that there would be no action taken after viewers had called in after spotting things on TV.

True and and I think I also remember it was also decided that they would not use video evidence if it could only be seen by high definition slow motion.

 

[Deleted member 21445]

Just dont think this is viable for many reasons as it would need to be applied to all golfers, at all times on the golf course to make it fair.

Most of the time the TV just follows the key groups.

Who knows what slight breaches like the Reed incident go on in every tournament away from the cameras but its never seen or publicised.

 

[davidy233]

Did they not use TV replay to show that Jon Rahm hit the ball twice on his chip in at the memorial tournament last year?

On the 16th hole during the final round of the Memorial Tournament, the PGA TOUR ruled that Jon Rahm made a stroke from the greenside rough after having caused his ball to move. As a result, Rahm was notified by the PGA Tour that he was in breach of Rule 9.4 (Ball Lifted or Moved by Player), and because he did not replace the ball before making a stroke, he was assessed two penalty strokes.

 

[Fabia999]

On the 16th hole during the final round of the Memorial Tournament, the PGA TOUR ruled that Jon Rahm made a stroke from the greenside rough after having caused his ball to move. As a result, Rahm was notified by the PGA Tour that he was in breach of Rule 9.4 (Ball Lifted or Moved by Player), and because he did not replace the ball before making a stroke, he was assessed two penalty strokes.

Ah yeah, my bad. Did they use the TV replay to see this? I remember the discussion about being penalised because he has cameras on him constantly compared to somebody lower down, who might get away with it.