Sydney Siege

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Er. Let's get this incident in perspective!

It's a case of 1, probably insane, criminal going completely beserk, with horrific consequences.

There are obviously serious questions to be answered, and the Aussie PM has put that process on place. Indeed, the 2 questions I would ask are...How on earth was he allowed to acquire a firearm; How the heck was he allowed bail? :confused:

But some of the 'proposals' above, supposedly for prevention of similar incidents in UK in the future, are simply daft imo.
 
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In perspective, this was another to add to the escalating incidents through out the world, just look at the one in Pakistan this week! IMO it will get much worse with no outlook of improving. We cant stop it but we can do more to protect ourselves.

Regarding the terrorist in OZ (and that is what he was) having a firearm. Anyone can get access to a firearm if they want one.
 
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SocketRocket said:
In perspective, this was another to add to the escalating incidents through out the world, just look at the one in Pakistan this week! IMO it will get much worse with no outlook of improving. We cant stop it but we can do more to protect ourselves.
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Denying entry from those fleeing from such incidents is certainly not the right way to go about it imo.

The Taliban atrocity in Pakistan is a completely different topic to this one! The only thing the two incidents have in common is the likelihood to increase xenophobia!
 
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Foxholer said:
Denying entry from those fleeing from such incidents is certainly not the right way to go about it imo. But the Taliban atrocity in Pakistan is a completely different topic to this one!
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It's Islamic terrorism. Whats so different about it?

Denying entry from all in these countries may not be perfect but what is! I would prefer this than blindly letting them into the country. Countries like Pakistan have taken a soft line with the Taliban rather than to be seen friendly with the west.

History has shown us that taking a liberal stance with the enemy leads to much more pain later.

I noticed this morning the Police in Sydney have denied he had a Firearm Licence!
 
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SocketRocket said:
It's Islamic terrorism. Whats so different about it?

Denying entry from all in these countries may not be perfect but what is! I would prefer this than blindly letting them into the country. Countries like Pakistan have taken a soft line with the Taliban rather than to be seen friendly with the west.

History has shown us that taking a liberal stance with the enemy leads to much more pain later.
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The Sydney Siege, what this topic is about, was not 'Islamic Terrorism'!
 
Foxholer said:
Not according to my definition - as per an earlier thread!

He was simply a deranged criminal, who happened to be a Muslim.
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Did you not see the flags he hung in the windows of the cafe, they were not portraying Aliens invading the Opera House with ray guns.

We don't and never will agree on this issue so maybe its best we both agree on that!
 
SocketRocket said:
I agree that we shouldn't resort to their tactics but I also think we are being too soft on the situation. IMO we should stop all immigration from countries where Muslim terrorists are prevalent, we should also be very tough on anyone here found radicalising or being radicalised in Jihad. I have suggested setting up camps in places such as South Georgia where they can be isolated from us.

They are taking advantage of our decency and will continue to use it as a weapon against us. The situation has passed the critical point where we could have a chance of keeping our borders relatively safe and the Politicians who have allowed us to sleepwalk into this current situation have a lot to answer for.
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So which countries should we stop immigration from ? What about terrorists from this country ? Terrorists can come from any countrt - so do we stop all immigration ?

Do you stop a doctor from Saudi or Pakistan from immigrating into the UK because he is from a certain ?

Is it just Muslin terrorists we should stop- are they the only ones then ?

What about the majority of Muslims who lead peaceful lives - should they be punished ?

And these camps ? What would you like to call these camps ? Who is going to pay for them ? Who is going to work at the camps you want creating 8000 miles away on a peaceful Island rich with wildlife.
 
Liverpoolphil said:
So which countries should we stop immigration from ? What about terrorists from this country ? Terrorists can come from any countrt - so do we stop all immigration ?

Do you stop a doctor from Saudi or Pakistan from immigrating into the UK because he is from a certain ?

Is it just Muslin terrorists we should stop- are they the only ones then ?

What about the majority of Muslims who lead peaceful lives - should they be punished ?

And these camps ? What would you like to call these camps ? Who is going to pay for them ? Who is going to work at the camps you want creating 8000 miles away on a peaceful Island rich with wildlife.
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The answer to most of those questions is 'Yes' Those here already can stay if they don't want to be (or support) Jihadist. We know what countries most of them come from.

Regarding the Camps, I would call them Prisons and we would pay for them partially offset from the cost of these peoples benefits and never ending court appeals. Plenty of people would work there if the pay was good, maybe some Falklanders would like the jobs (Devils Island was never short of guards). We could also build some prison ships and moor them offshore. I doubt if the Penguins will be too fussed.
 
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SocketRocket said:
The answer to most of those questions is 'Yes'

Regarding the Camps., I would call them Prisons and we would pay for them partially offset from the cost of these peoples benefits and never ending court appeals. Plenty of people would work there if the pay was good, maybe some Falklanders would like the jobs. I doubt if the Penguins will be too fussed.
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Sounds a great idea .... Why has no one thought of that before.... Oh wait!!

Guantanamo seemed to work well :o site a prison off shore where international law, including inconvenient obstructions such as trials, can be ignored. Where torture is carried out in our name.

Fortunately it's academic because it will never happen in the uk because we're not all right wing nut jobs.

On a related note, why do you advocate stopping immigration when most of our terrorists are home grown?
 
SocketRocket said:
The answer to most of those questions is 'Yes' Those here already can stay if they don't want to be (or support) Jihadist. We know what countries most of them come from.

Regarding the Camps, I would call them Prisons and we would pay for them partially offset from the cost of these peoples benefits and never ending court appeals. Plenty of people would work there if the pay was good, maybe some Falklanders would like the jobs (Devils Island was never short of guards). We could also build some prison ships and moor them offshore. I doubt if the Penguins will be too fussed.
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So you are happy to lump a whole race and religion of people based on the actions of the minority !

Which countries are you intending on outcasting -? In fact how about you stop them from breeding - in fact why not go the whole way and kill every single one of then whilst you are judging a whole race based on the actions of one.

Ignore the fact that Muslims in the majority are peaceful people - ignore those Muslim doctors that have saved lives in the UK - just isolate them off

I remeber a certain bunch of other people created camps and put a certain race into those camps. Falkland Island people already have jobs - maybe take the guards from that other camp called Guantanamo - they appear to have a job you would be proud off.
 
therod said:
Sounds a great idea .... Why has no one thought of that before.... Oh wait!!

Guantanamo seemed to work well :o site a prison off shore where international law, including inconvenient obstructions such as trials, can be ignored. Where torture is carried out in our name.

Fortunately it's academic because it will never happen in the uk because we're not all right wing nut jobs.

On a related note, why do you advocate stopping immigration when most of our terrorists are home grown?
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We did have an offshore floating prison at Portland not so long ago. The French thought of it with their prisons (penal colonies) in the colonies. Guantanamo isn't a prison by the way, it's a detention camp.

Tough times require tough measures and no one has suggested prison without trial by the way. I suggest suspending immigration from certain countries (whose Governments are not doing enough to suppress the terrorists activities) to stop the problem escalating and . I am not that naive to believe this would be the complete solution but being overtly PC to it certainly will not solve anything. IMO of course.
 
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Liverpoolphil said:
So you are happy to lump a whole race and religion of people based on the actions of the minority !

Which countries are you intending on outcasting -? In fact how about you stop them from breeding - in fact why not go the whole way and kill every single one of then whilst you are judging a whole race based on the actions of one.

Ignore the fact that Muslims in the majority are peaceful people - ignore those Muslim doctors that have saved lives in the UK - just isolate them off

I remeber a certain bunch of other people created camps and put a certain race into those camps. Falkland Island people already have jobs - maybe take the guards from that other camp called Guantanamo - they appear to have a job you would be proud off.
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Thats a rather silly reply Phil. Who's exaggerating now?

Maybe you should start again and actually read what I post instead of letting your perceived prejudice take over.
 
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SocketRocket said:
We did have an offshore floating prison at Portland not so long ago. The French thought of it with their prisons (penal colonies) in the colonies. Guantanamo isn't a prison by the way, it's a detention camp.

Tough times require tough measures and no one has suggested prison without trial by the way. I suggest suspending immigration from certain countries (whose Governments are not doing enough to suppress the terrorists activities) to stop the problem escalating and . I am not that naive to believe this would be the complete solution but being overtly PC to it certainly will not sole anything. IMO of course.
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Semantics.. Prison/ detention centre.

Civil liberties are the first things to be sacrificed in 'tough' times. Maybe you'd advocate all Muslims wearing a symbol so we can tell who they are. Maybe a yellow crescent moon on their arm? We could mark their houses with it also?

We don't live in 'tough' times. It's no different to any other historical bogey man. The Cold War, republican terrorism etc. There's more chance of choking to death on a pickled walnut this Christmas than dying in an act if terror. I'm sorry for the few that have suffered but having your life ruled by fear and hate won't help them, infact it betrays their memory...IMO.
 
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