Swing speed

[chrisd]

Last weekend was an eyeopener for me. On the Friday night before the Sunday Open comp at our club, I was at the range trying to groove a slight swing change with my irons. I really slowed my swing down to what felt like half speed to try and feel the change and ... bingo, I was hitting the irons so sweet without any noticable loss of distance. I decided to take this to the course on Sunday and ended up -2 gross on the first 10 holes. The wind then got up and I think that my swing must have just sped up and I then struggled more

I cant find much on utube or anywhere talking about an ideal swing speed, they all want to talk about increasing the speed - any ideas?

 

[bobmac]

There are 5 things that directly affect the golf ball

1.Hitting the sweet spot
2.Club face direction
3.Angle of attack
4.Swing path
5.Speed

If you can increase your speed without affecting the other 4, you will hit it further.
If you have too much speed to the point where the other 4 suffer, you will lose distance.

 

[chrisd]

There are 5 things that directly affect the golf ball

1.Hitting the sweet spot
2.Club face direction
3.Angle of attack
4.Swing path
5.Speed

If you can increase your speed without affecting the other 4, you will hit it further.
If you have too much speed to the point where the other 4 suffer, you will lose distance.

Agreed Bob, but its rare to read or see anything that talks about the relationship between number 5 and the the other 4. When I played tennis the point where you moved from a pure hit to muscling the ball was obvious, so in may ways at football, a rhythmic and easy shot at goal would always seem to fly better than a deliberate hard kick. It does seem though, that there is little mentioned about finding the ideal swing speed, it is all about increasing speed. I know on Sunday for those 10 holes I hit the ball like a pro, I had the chance ( not gimmees) to birdie 9 of the 10 and actually made 3, but when the game went, as I sped up (I think) I got into more trouble and struggled.

Sadly I cant play this weekend to try to find the optimum speed for me but I have never had a pro ever talk about the importance of swing speed, or is it obvious to everyone else but me?

 

[Imurg]

I know what you're saying Chris...
Everyone has their optimum swing speed
I guess the best way to find it is to spend time on a monitor of some kind, determine which speed hits the ball the best and then try and stick to that.
I think tempo is as important, if not more so.
When you made a slower swing you were possibly swinging at a more even tempo rather than actually slower.
And better tempo leads to a better strike.

 

[chrisd]

I know what you're saying Chris...
Everyone has their optimum swing speed
I guess the best way to find it is to spend time on a monitor of some kind, determine which speed hits the ball the best and then try and stick to that.
I think tempo is as important, if not more so.
When you made a slower swing you were possibly swinging at a more even tempo rather than actually slower.
And better tempo leads to a better strike.

Spot on Ian. I tend to believe that swing speed and tempo are the same thing but it a question of "feeling" the speed rather than knowing what it is. On Sunday I felt that I was swinging at 50% although I doubt that I had slowed it anywhere near that much. I also think that I was slowing the start of the downswing and increasing through the impact zone which is what you are supposed to do!

My main point is that its hard to find anything online that talks about this as everyone majors on a faster swing speed which, as Bob says is ok if 1 to 4 are in place

 

[Minhoca]

Everyone has their optimum swing speed

I totally agree with this.

 

[MashieNiblick]

One tip is to pick something to say while you swing, E.g Luuuke Donald, and try saying it at slightly different speeds until you match what you are saying to the swing speed that works, then just practice that. Alternatively try different things e.g "Tiger Woods" for a quick tempo or "Francesco Molinari" for a slower one.

As for tempo and swing speed I think this was posted on here a while back.

[video=youtube;ykPsqBdjSXc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykPsqBdjSXc[/video]

Different tempo but I would guess the club head speed at impact isn't that different.

 

[Ethan]

One tip is to pick something to say while you swing, E.g Luuuke Donald, and try saying it at slightly different speeds until you match what you are saying to the swing speed that works, then just practice that. Alternatively try different things e.g "Tiger Woods" for a quick tempo or "Francesco Molinari" for a slower one.

As for tempo and swing speed I think this was posted on here a while back.

[video=youtube;ykPsqBdjSXc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ykPsqBdjSXc[/video]

Different tempo but I would guess the club head speed at impact isn't that different.

A comparions of John Daly and Alvaro Quiros was posted recently. Quiros is walking up the fairway before Daly has hit the ball.

Both of these just show there are a range of ways to get it done.

On the tip of saying 'Luuuuke - Donald' on the backswing-downswing to improve temp, there was a story some year ago from a golfer who read a similar tip which advised saying 'Severiano - Ballesteros'. He wrote in to say he was working up to that but couldn't get past 'Tom - Kite'.

 

[chrisd]

Great video Mashie


I started to walk round with a vision of Fred Couples in my mind. My natural rhythm is is quite quick as a person in whatever I do but my golf rhythm just need to slow down

 

[SocketRocket]

It's where the speed is created. If you take an easy backswing, make a small pause at the top then slowly increase speed coming down so that you max through the ball, you can create some decent head speed with what looks an effortless swing. This method also gives you good control of the clubhead into the ball. Many golfers reach max speed just after the transition which leaks away the power too early.

 

[chrisd]

It's where the speed is created. If you take an easy backswing, make a small pause at the top then slowly increase speed coming down so that you max through the ball, you can create some decent head speed with what looks an effortless swing. This method also gives you good control of the clubhead into the ball. Many golfers reach max speed just after the transition which leaks away the power too early.

I think that I may have been guilty of that

 

[duncan mackie]

I tend to believe that swing speed and tempo are the same thing but it a question of "feeling" the speed rather than knowing what it is. On Sunday I felt that I was swinging at 50% although I doubt that I had slowed it anywhere near that much. I also think that I was slowing the start of the downswing and increasing through the impact zone which is what you are supposed to do!

My main point is that its hard to find anything online that talks about this as everyone majors on a faster swing speed which, as Bob says is ok if 1 to 4 are in place

you are in danger of confusing the hell out of everyone IMO

no-one majors on 'faster swing speed' in the context of what you are slowing down - absolutely no-one!

the only 'speed' that's relevant in No 5 of Bob's post is "club head speed at impact"

as Socketrocket raises, the relationship between (let's call it) how fast you swing, and the club head speed at impact is the complex one because most amateurs screw up the mechanics and timing such that the two are entirely unrelated; and have an inverse function for most.

what you have done for yourself is illustrate that by slowing down your 'swing' (what ever that means) you are able to both release the club head properly and effectively and do it at the right time in the swing so that max speed is reached through impact with the ball.

it's only after that that the other 4 points become relevant to what actually happens to the ball from that point ie ball speed, spin, direction and trajectory.

 

[Mattyboy]

To create an optimum personal tempo I try to ensure I see the club hit the ball. Swinng to fast (or trying to hit the ball too hard) means I am 'up and out' of the swing too early and cant see the club hit the ball.

Might be worth a try if you couldnt do this previously.

 

[Phil2511]

I think tempo is as important, if not more so.
When you made a slower swing you were possibly swinging at a more even tempo rather than actually slower.
And better tempo leads to a better strike.

I would agree with this 100%, It is all about the tempo, it doesn't matter how fast you swing your arms the power comes from turning through the ball and therefore the optimum strike comes from striking the ball with the club head at the point when your body is turning at its fastest.

Think about those little helicopters on a stick you had as a kid that you rolled between the palms of your hands, how fast did the blades spin just from the spinning of the pivot and how fast could you get the blade just by spinning the blade itself.

If you think of the more powerful hitters in your club, do they swing their arms fast? Or do they use their body to hit the ball and have a nice tempo with their arms? Also think how short the guys who have static lower bodies but use their arms only hit the ball.

So in reality when you say you are slowing your swing down I would guess that you actually slowed your arms down and therefore improving your timing giving you a much better strike at the optimum time and the result was no loss in distance as you were allowing your body to hit the golf ball rather than just your arms. I usually find that if I try and swing too hard with the arms that I lose distance and accuracy.

 

[Shiny]

If I get too fast in the swing I might as well turn the club upside down and try to hit the ball with the handle, I lose distance, elevation, and lose balls to slices etc. For me tempo is king, somewhere I read you can hum to keep your tempo good but I prefer saying the words 'Strawberry Sauce' in my head (Used to say it out loud until the pother competitors fell about laughing on the first tee). Strawberry is my backswing and sauce is my downswing.

 

[chrisd]

you are in danger of confusing the hell out of everyone IMO

no-one majors on 'faster swing speed' in the context of what you are slowing down - absolutely no-one!

the only 'speed' that's relevant in No 5 of Bob's post is "club head speed at impact"

as Socketrocket raises, the relationship between (let's call it) how fast you swing, and the club head speed at impact is the complex one because most amateurs screw up the mechanics and timing such that the two are entirely unrelated; and have an inverse function for most.

what you have done for yourself is illustrate that by slowing down your 'swing' (what ever that means) you are able to both release the club head properly and effectively and do it at the right time in the swing so that max speed is reached through impact with the ball.

it's only after that that the other 4 points become relevant to what actually happens to the ball from that point ie ball speed, spin, direction and trajectory.

I might be a little bit dense but I dont quite get your point Duncan, I have had several goes on Trackman where swing speed is one of the stats that the guys have majored on and my new driver shaft came about as a result of reading stats which included swing speed and spin rates. Swing speed of the arms amongst other things, is what generates the club head speed surely?

To create an optimum personal tempo I try to ensure I see the club hit the ball. Swinng to fast (or trying to hit the ball too hard) means I am 'up and out' of the swing too early and cant see the club hit the ball.

Might be worth a try if you couldnt do this previously.

I do always see the ball away Matty

.

So in reality when you say you are slowing your swing down I would guess that you actually slowed your arms down and therefore improving your timing giving you a much better strike at the optimum time and the result was no loss in distance as you were allowing your body to hit the golf ball rather than just your arms. I usually find that if I try and swing too hard with the arms that I lose distance and accuracy.

I think that you have hit the nail on the head Phil and you can add the slower tempo, when I watched it on video, cut out some of the extraneous movement that I was doing. More compact, smoother and a really nice transition to the finish with no loss of distance

 

[DAVEYBOY]

I don't worry about speed, I just make sure all of the other components are working right. No point in a 110mph swing and topping it LOL

 

[kid2]

Last weekend was an eyeopener for me. On the Friday night before the Sunday Open comp at our club, I was at the range trying to groove a slight swing change with my irons. I really slowed my swing down to what felt like half speed to try and feel the change and ... bingo, I was hitting the irons so sweet without any noticable loss of distance. I decided to take this to the course on Sunday and ended up -2 gross on the first 10 holes. The wind then got up and I think that my swing must have just sped up and I then struggled more

I cant find much on utube or anywhere talking about an ideal swing speed, they all want to talk about increasing the speed - any ideas?

Chris i watch this every week before i play and all through the week....As well as watching anything else i can find on him......Its really helping me......
Its only something small but its rubbing off....


[video=youtube;rz6fLTbDcFI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rz6fLTbDcFI&feature=related[/video]

 

[JustOne]

[video=youtube;rz6fLTbDcFI]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rz6fLTbDcFI&feature=related[/video]

Nice vid... like the bit where he talks about making a 'fake turn'.... very appropriate for many amateur swings.

 

[kid2]

Nice vid... like the bit where he talks about making a 'fake turn'.... very appropriate for many amateur swings.

Ya i like it James.
The bit with the shoulders is good......There are heaps of him on you tube....Including some of the Shell's Wonderful World videos.... .Just the fact that everything is nice and relaxed and lazy looking with him.....I know that if i get snatchy with my swing i get too mechanical and fast through it...Where ill get away with it in my irons it messes something silly with the woods.....Its what i love about freddie......Everything just flows.....May not be technically correct but you'd struggle to find a golfer with better rhythm.....