anji71
Newbie
Please review my swing. Apologise for the video quality, had to rely on my 5yr old!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d8-PqpBJUQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_d8-PqpBJUQ
Swing Check Please?
- Thread starter anji71
- Start date
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
I'm guessing you hit a lot of shots left to right. You look like you come inside very quickly and are very flat on the way back and are then forced to throw (or cast) on the way down to get the to the ball. I can see you coming in steep on your drives from time to time and hitting across the line regularly and hitting at best a fade and at worse a slice. I stand to be corrected by those in the know (bobmac) but just my opinion
anji71
Newbie
Actually no, all my drives are with a draw. On my drives I close my stance a bit. My bad shot is a hook. I'm happy with the driver 270+, but my long irons can be a bit wayward especially on par three's where I have to tee them up.
anji71
Newbie
Ok it was my first post and I'll give you some more info.
My current handicap is 11, as I work away offshore, so probably only play about 3 times per month, but down the range maybe 3-4 times per month when I home.
No coaching, self taught and always tinkering with my set up and grip. Average score this year is between 80-85 with mostly 82. It hit the driver quite long with a flatish draw holding the club really lightly, but I tend to tighten the grip with my long irons as soft grip with these can be erratic for some reason.
My current handicap is 11, as I work away offshore, so probably only play about 3 times per month, but down the range maybe 3-4 times per month when I home.
No coaching, self taught and always tinkering with my set up and grip. Average score this year is between 80-85 with mostly 82. It hit the driver quite long with a flatish draw holding the club really lightly, but I tend to tighten the grip with my long irons as soft grip with these can be erratic for some reason.
bobmac
Major Champion
Anji, welcome to the forum.
Can I start by saying Homer has it spot on.
A very common fault in golf that can be tweaked to produce good results or cured with lots of time and patience.
If you want to see your out to in swing in more detail, you can download some free golf software.
It will help you slow down your swing on video, frame by frame, draw lines etc.
You can find it here and look to left where it says home basic free download
http://www.v1golfacademy.com/v1home.asp
If you want to know more, please ask.
Good luck
Can I start by saying Homer has it spot on.
A very common fault in golf that can be tweaked to produce good results or cured with lots of time and patience.
If you want to see your out to in swing in more detail, you can download some free golf software.
It will help you slow down your swing on video, frame by frame, draw lines etc.
You can find it here and look to left where it says home basic free download
http://www.v1golfacademy.com/v1home.asp
If you want to know more, please ask.
Good luck
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Hi and welcome to the forum.
At the moment you are having to make a huge effort with your body to keep the clubhead coming from the inside, which is making you lose all your posture and 'stand up' on the shots. Your swing is very flat. Try and keep your clubhead between the yellow lines at all times. In the picture your clubhead is actually about 3 FEET below where it should be
It doesn't matter if you are on the bottom line, the top line or somewhere inbetween - as long as it ISN'T above or below those lines....at the moment you are doing it the hard way!!
When you do that it will help you hit more solid and consistant strikes and your swing will be more 'on plane'.
Regards...
At the moment you are having to make a huge effort with your body to keep the clubhead coming from the inside, which is making you lose all your posture and 'stand up' on the shots. Your swing is very flat. Try and keep your clubhead between the yellow lines at all times. In the picture your clubhead is actually about 3 FEET below where it should be
It doesn't matter if you are on the bottom line, the top line or somewhere inbetween - as long as it ISN'T above or below those lines....at the moment you are doing it the hard way!!
When you do that it will help you hit more solid and consistant strikes and your swing will be more 'on plane'.
Regards...
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
This isn't a 'thrown from the top' position.
The right shoulder is dropped coming down inside the line bringing the club inside the line with it. The right elbow tucks into the right hip, the left shoulder moves up and away. Hard to hit and remain consistant though and very easy to shove it out to the right or roll the wrists and hook it off the planet.
Flat swings generally do make people throw the club over the top but you can still swing from the inside ...especially if you like getting jammed up on the right side. With long irons this position becomes almost unplayable as it's practically impossible to hit down onto the ball.
regards....
anji71
Newbie
Gents,
Can I thank you for your feed back. Certainly something to work on me thinks.
Anjum
Can I thank you for your feed back. Certainly something to work on me thinks.
Anjum
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Here's a video for you...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZuXp_qlNnw
OK it's not with a driver but it is a long iron. If you pause the video on the takeaway you can see that his clubhead is bang on where the bottom yellow line is RIGHT FROM THE INITIAL TAKEAWAY (infact I've drawn it in red here for you)... and it never goes below that line.
Watch ONLY the club head and see if it appears behind his legs as your does.
See how the clubhead stays within the 'V' of the two yellow lines. That's what you should be aiming for to make your swing consistant, and more solid strikes so you can use your body properly and release the clubhead powerfully through the ball.
Hope this helps.
Regards...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZuXp_qlNnw
OK it's not with a driver but it is a long iron. If you pause the video on the takeaway you can see that his clubhead is bang on where the bottom yellow line is RIGHT FROM THE INITIAL TAKEAWAY (infact I've drawn it in red here for you)... and it never goes below that line.
Watch ONLY the club head and see if it appears behind his legs as your does.
See how the clubhead stays within the 'V' of the two yellow lines. That's what you should be aiming for to make your swing consistant, and more solid strikes so you can use your body properly and release the clubhead powerfully through the ball.
Hope this helps.
Regards...
bobmac
Major Champion
Whatever, youre the expert. Bored
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
#Bless# Poor old Bob. Sold green fees for 3 years in a proshop and can't be wrong about a swing.
What is it that makes you so rude? Is it just the grumps or is it that your toes are getting trodden on? afterall it IS your forum, right?
I'd like to see you cut across the ball, impart left to right spin and draw the ball. I'm sure you can do it, PGA pro's can do anything!.... Meh
bobmac
Major Champion
I cant remember being rude to anyone?
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
There does seem to be a consensus that all that justoneuk says must be true and yet it is bobmac that has passed the exams and is PGA qualified. As it happens I think a lot of what Justone says and he is very helpful with the graphics etc but there are times when I've read replies that even with my limited swing knowledge I've felt maybe haven't been quite what I'd expect to see.
I think we are extremely fortunate on here to have a top 25 coach who regularly takes time out to analyse our mediocre offerings, a PGA qualified pro in Bob and Justone who has a good knowledge of the swing and has played to a very high standard. If I had to be pedantic and wanted a definite answer to a problem I'd always go with the PGA qualified response but that is just me and probably more to do with my golfing heritage which was always to seek professional advice rather than the well meant offerings of non-qualifieds. This was in the days before on screen software etc and that stance is definitely softening.
It does seem that there has been some historic tensions between bob and justoneuk and it's a pity. I think if either party has a particular view on the advice being given it would be beneficial to either resolve it privately via PM or if you have to debate it publicly explain why you have that opinion so others may at least make a more considered opinion on the advice being offered.
I'm not looking to start any sort of flame war as I actually respect the views and opinions of both parties.
I think we are extremely fortunate on here to have a top 25 coach who regularly takes time out to analyse our mediocre offerings, a PGA qualified pro in Bob and Justone who has a good knowledge of the swing and has played to a very high standard. If I had to be pedantic and wanted a definite answer to a problem I'd always go with the PGA qualified response but that is just me and probably more to do with my golfing heritage which was always to seek professional advice rather than the well meant offerings of non-qualifieds. This was in the days before on screen software etc and that stance is definitely softening.
It does seem that there has been some historic tensions between bob and justoneuk and it's a pity. I think if either party has a particular view on the advice being given it would be beneficial to either resolve it privately via PM or if you have to debate it publicly explain why you have that opinion so others may at least make a more considered opinion on the advice being offered.
I'm not looking to start any sort of flame war as I actually respect the views and opinions of both parties.
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Is there? Where?
I don't say things like "swing between the gates" which is outdated junk and doesn't work. PGA pro's would LAUGH at that if they saw you teaching it. The LAST thing you want to be doing is getting over to that gate on the right, stuck ontop of your right foot and somehow WITHOUT SLIDING YOUR HIPS get back to the gate on the left. How much movement do you NEED in a swing? That method died in the 90's as it doesn't work.
I don't hold a huge regard for any PGA qualification (can you tell?) I don't want to sell green fees, I don't want to fix clubs, I don't want to run a pro shop and I don't need repetative business from giving lessons. 3 years training to do that of which maybe 6 months is learning about outdated swings from a book written 15 years ago.
What I do hold high regard for is PGA pro's like the one I chatted to today who told me that 90% of what they get taught is utter garbage. Why golfers hold them in such high esteem is beyond me.
I try and show evidence of 99% of the things I post either with a picture or with a video where possible. Not only does it prove what I am saying but it also helps the person to picture what is being said. When someone SAYS they are hitting a draw then it's pretty straight forward that they are not cutting across the ball.
I'll post an example... as I'm good at those (Sorry to ruin your post Anjum). I posted my own Stack and Tilt swing and a comment from Neil (the top 25 coach) was that.... and I quote...
So here's Tiger Woods, Adam Scott and little ol' me over on the right with my stacked and tilted swing... who has the most space between their arms and head?
Would Neil tell Tiger Woods and Adam Scott to move their hands 10 inches to the right to get more width? I'm not so sure.
So if that's what we are lead to believe then it poses the question of who is right and who is wrong about anything?
As I said I generally try to prove everything I say and I'm open to questioning/criticism of that at any time, I have no qualms about it. Do I know everything? No. Do I claim to? No. Do I post what I do know? Of course. Do I get offended if someone posts...
"Whatever, you're the expert. Bored."
Of course. As it's totally pathetic.
Anyway.. I'm off to Disney in 6 hours so you can talk about me when I'm gone if you want. I'm not back until the 25th so I guess I'm going to have a lot to read. Thanks everyone also for your PM's... some are classics!
Homer, out of interest (basically because I've forgotten) do you hit a fade or a draw?
Regards....
HomerJSimpson
Hall of Famer
Draw although stock bad shot is overactive hands and big hooks
JustOne
Ryder Cup Winner
Exactly and yet you have a very flat backswing, causing an overswing, a tendancy to throw the club over the top of the plane you came up on etc etc and yet STILL manage to come from the inside and manage to hit a draw. Why is that? Do you know?
How come you are not slicing/fading it like you said as a response to the original post above? His swing is just like yours.
How come you are not slicing/fading it like you said as a response to the original post above? His swing is just like yours.
bobmac
Major Champion
Wow, I guess that's been brewing a while.
I think it was Arnold Palmer who once said 'there are many ways to play this game well' and each to their own. I respect that and if people want to do it differently than the way I learned, who am I to argue.I've spent my whole life playing golf and helping people with their game. I believe I am the patient sort so at 45, decided to teach golf professionally. I called 10 driving ranges and asked about teaching posts, EVERY SINGLE ONE insisted on the coaches being PGA qualified.
So yes, I sold green fees for 3 years, learned how to fix golf clubs, learned about running my own business, learned about sport science and bio-mechanics, learned about club technology, swing mechanics, learned how to teach juniors, able bodied people and even handicapped people and after 3 long years pssed all 8 modules of the degree. I am also a qualified first aider, a qualified custom fitter with Ping, CRB checked witht the police and a level II national coach affiliated with Birmingham University..
All the time being paid the basic minimum wage.
Now I have a qualification that is respected by most although not all as this thread has proved.
I will continue to teach people the way I know and will use the techniques I have tried and tested and do work.
James, I try and understand the stack and tilt method, but please dont think because someone doesn't like the method they must be wrong.
You accused me once of jumping on everything you write.
That was not true. You write lots of good stuff with good pictures and graphics, and we even agree on some stuff but just occassionally you get things wrong in my opinion. The advice on how to stop someone topping the ball was a recent example.
I'm not here to compete with you James in any popularity competition, I was just here to help people enjoy their game more and I believe in some cases I have done that.
I do however believe that if I'm ever not wanted somewhere, I'll not stay there.
So, I'll leave that job up to Neil Plimmer from now on. You can argue with him if you want.
I'm going back to the real world where people pay me £30 an hour for my qualified professional advice.
Good luck everyone and happy golfing. Bob
I think it was Arnold Palmer who once said 'there are many ways to play this game well' and each to their own. I respect that and if people want to do it differently than the way I learned, who am I to argue.I've spent my whole life playing golf and helping people with their game. I believe I am the patient sort so at 45, decided to teach golf professionally. I called 10 driving ranges and asked about teaching posts, EVERY SINGLE ONE insisted on the coaches being PGA qualified.
So yes, I sold green fees for 3 years, learned how to fix golf clubs, learned about running my own business, learned about sport science and bio-mechanics, learned about club technology, swing mechanics, learned how to teach juniors, able bodied people and even handicapped people and after 3 long years pssed all 8 modules of the degree. I am also a qualified first aider, a qualified custom fitter with Ping, CRB checked witht the police and a level II national coach affiliated with Birmingham University..
All the time being paid the basic minimum wage.
Now I have a qualification that is respected by most although not all as this thread has proved.
I will continue to teach people the way I know and will use the techniques I have tried and tested and do work.
James, I try and understand the stack and tilt method, but please dont think because someone doesn't like the method they must be wrong.
You accused me once of jumping on everything you write.
That was not true. You write lots of good stuff with good pictures and graphics, and we even agree on some stuff but just occassionally you get things wrong in my opinion. The advice on how to stop someone topping the ball was a recent example.
I'm not here to compete with you James in any popularity competition, I was just here to help people enjoy their game more and I believe in some cases I have done that.
I do however believe that if I'm ever not wanted somewhere, I'll not stay there.
So, I'll leave that job up to Neil Plimmer from now on. You can argue with him if you want.
I'm going back to the real world where people pay me £30 an hour for my qualified professional advice.
Good luck everyone and happy golfing. Bob
golf_bug
Head Pro
.........silence..............tumble weeds..................
Wow
Sorry you had to see that.
From my stance as a non expert, I didn't think your swing was that bad. Whether or not you ever suffer with casting from the top, your backswing does put you in a position where it is tricky to get all your oompf behind the ball at impact.
You do seem to have a sort of loop in your swing, which would, in most people, create that out to in swing, but by keeping your right elbow really tight, you keep the swing in to out. However I would be surprised if your swing was so tightly ingrained that you never drifted into that out to in position.
I have no fancy equipment ( ask my wife, she'll tell you ) but I took a freezeframe of your second swing at impact. However, being a techocraphacker of the 1st degree ( and that took a darn sight more than 3 years to perfect, I'll tell you ) I can't post it here.
It basically shows you being very cramped at impact, and having to 'lift' your body to create enough space to get the clubhead through. It also means you are purely swinging with your hands and arms, with virtually no body imput at all from the bigger muscles ( the ones that will add yards to your drives ).
If you want to get more body into your swing, I think you will need to get your backswing more on plane. If you keep your clubhead slightly in front of your hands on the way back you will hopefully find it easier to get into position at the top. I, personally, spend quite a lot of my range time checking my backswing half way back, because I have a tendancy to do the same as you and bring the clubhead back very, very flat, if left unchecked. ( in me it definately shows itself in that casting from the top slicers swing ).
It's amazing though how much freer the swing feels from a better position at the top of the backswing.
But if you're happy swinging with what you've got, then stick with it. There's more than one way to run it up the flagpole and see what sticks to the skinned cat.
Sorry you had to see that.
From my stance as a non expert, I didn't think your swing was that bad. Whether or not you ever suffer with casting from the top, your backswing does put you in a position where it is tricky to get all your oompf behind the ball at impact.
You do seem to have a sort of loop in your swing, which would, in most people, create that out to in swing, but by keeping your right elbow really tight, you keep the swing in to out. However I would be surprised if your swing was so tightly ingrained that you never drifted into that out to in position.
I have no fancy equipment ( ask my wife, she'll tell you
) but I took a freezeframe of your second swing at impact. However, being a techocraphacker of the 1st degree ( and that took a darn sight more than 3 years to perfect, I'll tell you ) I can't post it here.It basically shows you being very cramped at impact, and having to 'lift' your body to create enough space to get the clubhead through. It also means you are purely swinging with your hands and arms, with virtually no body imput at all from the bigger muscles ( the ones that will add yards to your drives ).
If you want to get more body into your swing, I think you will need to get your backswing more on plane. If you keep your clubhead slightly in front of your hands on the way back you will hopefully find it easier to get into position at the top. I, personally, spend quite a lot of my range time checking my backswing half way back, because I have a tendancy to do the same as you and bring the clubhead back very, very flat, if left unchecked. ( in me it definately shows itself in that casting from the top slicers swing ).
It's amazing though how much freer the swing feels from a better position at the top of the backswing.
But if you're happy swinging with what you've got, then stick with it. There's more than one way to run it up the flagpole and see what sticks to the skinned cat.
anji71
Newbie
I'm sorry to see some of the experts having a ding dong, but some good valid points anyway. I especially like the David Toms picture planes, however when I tried swinging like that it feels kind of loose and the thought is I might lose some power and length.
I'm going to get some coaching, but now I know where I am with your feedback, so thanks again gents.
Great forum by the way, I can see myself spending some time here now.
Regards
I'm going to get some coaching, but now I know where I am with your feedback, so thanks again gents.
Great forum by the way, I can see myself spending some time here now.
Regards
