Martin70
Head Pro
Greaves > Shearer > Lineker for me.
Discounting Charlton as he wan't a striker.
Discounting Charlton as he wan't a striker.
Rooney, greatest ever England striker?
- Thread starter Beezerk
- Start date
Pin-seeker
Well-known member
Not sure any of the other names mentioned(ones of my era at least) had the work rate of Rooney.
If he was more selfish he'd probably have got even more more goals.
If he was more selfish he'd probably have got even more more goals.
Beezerk
Money List Winner
Makes it even more of an achievement then doesn't it?
Maybe I should have titled the thread England's Greatest Ever Goalscorer rather than Striker.
freddielong
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I agree to score that many without being the goalscorer makes it more of an achievement not less.
evahakool
Challenge Tour Pro
Greaves for me to score 44 goals in only 57 games must make him the best, just think how many more goals he would have scored if he played the same number of games as Rooney or Charlton .
D
Deleted member 16999
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Greatest Goalscorer, undeniable once he breaks the record, best striker, not in my opinion, but then again he didn't choose when he was born, so unfair to compare era's and other players in the teams, ie, Greaves may not have suited the modern game and Rooney may not have made the grade in the 69's etc
Foxholer
Blackballed
Thee are all sorts of other factors that could or maybe should be taken into account. Number of games played; quality of team-mates and/or opposition; removal of Penalties from consideration; would provides something of an 'opportunities' factor. But it's all rather moot.
It does seem to me that Greaves (who is still, and likely always will be, in a pretty bad way) was the 'best' Striker though!
If he does break Charlton's record, the only definite statement that could be made is that he has scored the most goals!
I'm not sure I buy into the fact that games are harder now. Granted we play more games. So it's easier for a player to reach 100 caps. But looking online at our record in the sixties we still handed out quite a few beatings of more than 4/5 goals. So the opportunity to score wasn't any harder than it is now.
Obviosuly in stats. Greaves win. In the era I've watched (mid 90's). If England had once chance in a game I'd want Owen to be on the end of it.
Shearer was the prems ever striker imo, and had an awesome euro 96, but I feel Rooney has played in the poorest team of all of them mentioned. He also doesn't take too many pens. So could probably be nearer 60 now.
Obviosuly in stats. Greaves win. In the era I've watched (mid 90's). If England had once chance in a game I'd want Owen to be on the end of it.
Shearer was the prems ever striker imo, and had an awesome euro 96, but I feel Rooney has played in the poorest team of all of them mentioned. He also doesn't take too many pens. So could probably be nearer 60 now.
C
c1973
Guest
It has to be Greavsie, no?
His strike rate at international level is exceptional by any measure.
Didn't Charlton play mostly as a midfielder? If so, then his strike rate from that position beats Rooney hands down as well.
His strike rate at international level is exceptional by any measure.
Didn't Charlton play mostly as a midfielder? If so, then his strike rate from that position beats Rooney hands down as well.
Too few goals in tournaments when it matters and too many in qualifiers against soft, low quality teams. A fine striker, you don't get to that number by fluke, but not in the elite. Greaves and Charlton were before my time but they and Lineker, certainly my era, scored in the big games at big tournaments and against top opposition. That puts them above Rooney and other strikers, Shearer, Owen would also rank above him for the same reasons. Finney, Lofthouse and Mortenson scored well but I just don't know enough about that era.
D
Deleted member 16999
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Starting off I don't believe Rooney is Englands greatest striker, to me Lineker or Shearer would get the shout, regardless of goals scored.
But for those mentioning Greaves and Charlton and the quality of the opposition they both played when we had the Home internationals every year. Nearly 25% of Greaves international appearances were against the home Nations and a lot of his goals came against Scotland, N Ireland and Wales season after season, he scored hat tricks against Luxembourg, played in England teams that put 6 past Switzerland, 9 past Scotland, 6 past Norway, 8 past N Ireland. He only scored 4 goals in actual World/European cups and 3 came against Luxembourg
Over 30% of Charlton's goals came against the Home Nations. Only 14 of Charlton's goals came in Competition and 5 of them were against Luxembourg.
Wayne Rooney has scored 34 Goals in World/European Comps
But for those mentioning Greaves and Charlton and the quality of the opposition they both played when we had the Home internationals every year. Nearly 25% of Greaves international appearances were against the home Nations and a lot of his goals came against Scotland, N Ireland and Wales season after season, he scored hat tricks against Luxembourg, played in England teams that put 6 past Switzerland, 9 past Scotland, 6 past Norway, 8 past N Ireland. He only scored 4 goals in actual World/European cups and 3 came against Luxembourg
Over 30% of Charlton's goals came against the Home Nations. Only 14 of Charlton's goals came in Competition and 5 of them were against Luxembourg.
Wayne Rooney has scored 34 Goals in World/European Comps
Pin-seeker
Well-known member
Excellent post sir.
Perfectly well made point.
Paul - I doff my cap. Point well made........Still behind Lineker though in terms of goals of importance.
D
Deleted member 15344
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Rooney has scored a good number of EC/WC goals - mainly in qualifiers ( thinks is 5 in finals with 4 in 2004 when he burst through ) - England play a damn sight more qualifiers now than they did before - how many has Rooney plundered against the likes of San Marino etc ?
Edit -
Friendlies - 12
WCq- 16
WCF - 1
WCQ - 12
ECF - 5
Last edited by a moderator:
PhilTheFragger
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Well he equals the record with that penalty, you can't argue with success, but he needs to perform at the forthcoming euros and WC to really be up there
Blue in Munich
Crocked Professional Yeti Impersonator
The full list is here;
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_international_goals_scored_by_Wayne_Rooney
San Marino feature quite a lot, along with the mighty Macedonia, Liechtenstein, Andorra, Kazakhstan, Belarus, Lithuania, Estonai; the list of football's superpowers just goes on and on. He also got a couple against Scotland. There's a distinct absence of top notch teams in the list of who he has scored against.
Quite simply the words Rooney & greatest just don't sit right with me, his gross goals against the amount of games he's played is like saying that my nett scores make me a better golfer than a 6 handicapper playing to an average of 10, they simply don't equate with each other, I'd also take the person into account also, everyone else who's been mentioned are/were all round gentlemen IMO on and mainly off the park, Rooney is a petulant toe rag at times on and off the park :smirk:
D
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I count 5 at a push - two against Brazil 1 against Argentina and Holland but all four in friendlies and one against Uruguay in WC
A few against Croatia who are the next level down
1 dodgy penalty that nobody knows why it was given or the player booked and 1 own goal, really impressive this, not!!