Quick etiquette question (newbie)

[virtuocity]

So during my round, my partner was off the green and I was on the green. However, my ball was farther from the hole.

I looked at him to hit his shot and he seemed surprised to be offered the chance to hit first.

Was I wrong?

 

[PhilTheFragger]

No you would normally expect him to play first if he is off the green

 

[chrisd]

It's quite normal to invite someone to play onto the green first. It makes for less in and out of the flag.

 

[duncan mackie]

Phil just did it with Brandt - absolutely normal.

Of course, if the other player suggests you go ahead first - just do so.

 

[virtuocity]

So I should take the initiative and 'invite' the player to hit on to the green first?

 

[SocketRocket]

So I should take the initiative and 'invite' the player to hit on to the green first?

Yes, thats the polite thing to do. Technically you have the right to the next shot if you are further away though.

 

[jimbob.someroo]

Yes, thats the polite thing to do. Technically you have the right to the next shot if you are further away though.

Agreed. Only time I wouldn't do it was in a serious matchplay comp if I was trying to put pressure on. Even then, more often than not ill invite the guy to play on.

 

[CMAC]

So during my round, my partner was off the green and I was on the green. However, my ball was farther from the hole.

I looked at him to hit his shot and he seemed surprised to be offered the chance to hit first.

Was I wrong?

not in strokeplay, in matchplay however furthest away plays first, if you play out of turn your opponent can ask you to retake the stroke

 

[Foxholer]

In both Strokeplay and Matchplay, the competitor furthest from the hole would normally be due to play first.

Quite common in Strokeplay for practicality to override this as there is no penalty - except for collusion.
http://www.randa.org/en/Rules-and-Amateur-Status/Rules-of-Golf.aspx#/rules/?ruleNum=10&subRuleNum=2

Different for Matchplay though.

 

[virtuocity]

"the Committee determines that competitors have agreed to play out of turn to give one of them an advantage, they are disqualified. "

Struggling to think of what advantage could be gained? Perhaps if 3 of your 4-ball were backing you to win the comp and they decide to hit on to the green out of turn to give you an idea of green speed?!

 

[MashieNiblick]

"the Committee determines that competitors have agreed to play out of turn to give one of them an advantage, they are disqualified. "

Struggling to think of what advantage could be gained? Perhaps if 3 of your 4-ball were backing you to win the comp and they decide to hit on to the green out of turn to give you an idea of green speed?!

Could happen with 2 players with a tricky putt on the same line. Player nearest the hole is having a bad day and is effectively out of the comp but agrees to putt first to show his mate (who has a chance to win) the line.

 

[bobmac]

Don't assume just because you're off the green you can 'just come on' especially in Matchplay.
If you chip in without asking to come on, tough, you're opponent WILL ask you to replay the shot when it's your turn

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Could happen with 2 players with a tricky putt on the same line. Player nearest the hole is having a bad day and is effectively out of the comp but agrees to putt first to show his mate (who has a chance to win) the line.

In which case were I playing in that 4 Ball I'd give that player (opponent) nearest the hole his putt.

 

[rosecott]

Could happen with 2 players with a tricky putt on the same line. Player nearest the hole is having a bad day and is effectively out of the comp but agrees to putt first to show his mate (who has a chance to win) the line.

In which case were I playing in that 4 Ball I'd give that player (opponent) nearest the hole his putt.

I think Mashie was talking about 2 fellow-competitors colluding in a strokeplay comp. Your strategy would not work in that case.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I think Mashie was talking about 2 fellow-competitors colluding in a strokeplay comp. Your strategy would not work in that case.

Ah - OK - sorry. Context is all in such things.

So in the context. I may well have been in the situation in a competition and not a 4 ball pairing where me and my buddy have putts on same line with me putting first. And after I have putted I may have said something like 'you saw (or alternatively, did you see...) the borrow on that at the end?'

Now I don't think I've explicitly given advice to my buddy as I am fully aware that I am not allowed to, but my implication (maybe just in the tone of my questioning statement - is clearly along the lines of 'be aware that whatever you think the borrow on your putt to be - my putt showed you what the borrow actually is'

Am I breaking any rule on giving advice to a fellow competitor who is not a playing partner?

 

[Kellfire]

http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/...-americans-with-bad-sportsmanship-635955.html

The most famous instance I can remember of this ruling biting someone on the behind.

 

[MashieNiblick]

Ah - OK - sorry. Context is all in such things.

So in the context. I may well have been in the situation in a competition and not a 4 ball pairing where me and my buddy have putts on same line with me putting first. And after I have putted I may have said something like 'you saw (or alternatively, did you see...) the borrow on that at the end?'

Now I don't think I've explicitly given advice to my buddy as I am fully aware that I am not allowed to, but my implication (maybe just in the tone of my questioning statement - is clearly along the lines of 'be aware that whatever you think the borrow on your putt to be - my putt showed you what the borrow actually is'

Am I breaking any rule on giving advice to a fellow competitor who is not a playing partner?

Good question and not an easy one to answer definitively. It depends on what you say and why.

Decision 8-1/8 Comment About Club Selection After Stroke says

"Q. After playing a stroke, a player says: “I should have used a 5-iron.” Was the player in breach of Rule 8-1?

"A. If the statement was made casually, there was no breach. If the statement was made to another player who had a shot to play from about the same position, there was a breach. "

So if you make a casual remark such as "wow, didn't expect it to turn like that!" that's Ok in my book. If you are trying to assist a fellow competitor, e.g saying "see that, you need to borrow more than you think" then I think you would be in breach of the Rules.

Can be a grey area with room for interpretation.

If any comment I make could influence another competitor then I try to keep quiet until everyone has played.

Colin or Duncan might want to comment or elaborate on that. There have been a few interesting discussions on this in the past including whether the well worn "take your time" when someone has a tap in counts as "advice".

 

[duncan mackie]

Good question and not an easy one to answer definitively. It depends on what you say and why.

Decision 8-1/8 Comment About Club Selection After Stroke says

"Q. After playing a stroke, a player says: “I should have used a 5-iron.” Was the player in breach of Rule 8-1?

"A. If the statement was made casually, there was no breach. If the statement was made to another player who had a shot to play from about the same position, there was a breach. "

So if you make a casual remark such as "wow, didn't expect it to turn like that!" that's Ok in my book. If you are trying to assist a fellow competitor, e.g saying "see that, you need to borrow more than you think" then I think you would be in breach of the Rules.

Can be a grey area with room for interpretation.

If any comment I make could influence another competitor then I try to keep quiet until everyone has played.

Colin or Duncan might want to comment or elaborate on that. There have been a few interesting discussions on this in the past including whether the well worn "take your time" when someone has a tap in counts as "advice".

8-1/8 covers both this, and the tap in situation completly. It makes it clear that intention is relevant.

'you see the borrow on that at the end' hardly requires us to go as far as intention though - it would constitute advice if another player had the same, or similar, shot to make. unless you were permitted to give advice to that player it would be a breach.

in the same way, 'take your time' is not a breach 99% of the time but would be if you were trying to convey something other than the underlying 'don't rush on our behalf' message normally associated with it's use.