Professional Golf 2024 & 2025

AussieKB said:
Has anyone answered is this the way to run the ET ?

Lose your top 10 every year.....yes some will come back but is this the future ?

Only get back those that don't keep their card.
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The solution is to offer prize money at the same level as the PGAT.

And, if that is not a feasible solution, then obviously the best DP World Tour players will look to go somewhere else to improve their earning potential. What would be your mastermind solution?

Until the European Tour can offer the same money (which will probably never happen), the people in charge could remain in denial and pretend that doesn't play a part, or they could embrace it, acknowledge the European Tour is effectively a feeder tour, but then maximise their opportunities from there.
 
As the American Women's tour shows the best players from around the world will always follow the money.
I have noticed more USA and Asian golfers playing the 'World' tour since it became stronger.
 
Arthur Wedge said:
Does it really ? They lost ten players last year and it didn’t have that much of an affect as there is more coming through behind them

And out of those ten I suspect many will be still playing a good number of ETs and some will be back full time when they can’t keep their PGAT card

The best Europeans will always move across

Those ten players will be filled by ten other players , out of the ten players who have moved - how many stood out ?!
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I’m not as certain that the talent pool of emerging Pros is quite as deep as you are. I think there’s a sustainability question and maybe 10 per year is perhaps too many/too often. It wont really be noticed in early years but if it is to continue...

Players cant be in two places at once so when they each take the chance to play in 14+ standard PGAT starts while still dabbling in selected elevated ET events, that's obviously 14+ ET std events they can’t play in that they would otherwise have attended had it not been for their limited pgat membership

Some of the annual 10 will play well enough to extend their pgat card, some wont but its still a nett reduction as another 10 are added each season

The best will always move across (as you say) but in all fairness to a fair few of the 30 players who've achieved it... they aren't the best or they would've got a pgat tour card via the older more traditional route
 
Slab said:
I’m not as certain that the talent pool of emerging Pros is quite as deep as you are. I think there’s a sustainability question and maybe 10 per year is perhaps too many/too often. It wont really be noticed in early years but if it is to continue...

Players cant be in two places at once so when they each take the chance to play in 14+ standard PGAT starts while still dabbling in selected elevated ET events, that's obviously 14+ ET std events they can’t play in that they would otherwise have attended had it not been for their limited pgat membership

Some of the annual 10 will play well enough to extend their pgat card, some wont but its still a nett reduction as another 10 are added each season

The best will always move across (as you say) but in all fairness to a fair few of the 30 players who've achieved it... they aren't the best or they would've got a pgat tour card via the older more traditional route
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Each year the tour has the same level of members - players will varying levels of rights to certain comps , there is a tour below the ET that offers cards for the players in their order of merit and also the cards from the qualifying

Yesterday you had players playing that went through the challenge Tour final last year - Reitan , Nergaard , Ayora - all players that came up from the Challenge Tour - and were able to play in events because others moved on

There is a healthy turnover of players
 
Arthur Wedge said:
Each year the tour has the same level of members - players will varying levels of rights to certain comps , there is a tour below the ET that offers cards for the players in their order of merit and also the cards from the qualifying

Yesterday you had players playing that went through the challenge Tour final last year - Reitan , Nergaard , Ayora - all players that came up from the Challenge Tour - and were able to play in events because others moved on

There is a healthy turnover of players
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But that doesn't guarantee the quality remains the same just because its numerically unchanged. The ET as a whole will gradually suffer in its product

And what happens to this ‘emerging talent’ mostly from the hotelplanner tour when some of the 10/20/30... players come back from the pgat into the ET after 1 or 2 seasons?
Likely most who went to the US are still more than good enough to hold their own on the ET, but that means some of the newly promoted guys are 'relegated' to try again or call it quits after sinking all their effort/cash into the chance to stay on ET.

Hope you enjoyed your taste of the good life boys but xyz players are coming back to the ET after their pgat hiatus, so its back in your box you go...
 
Slab said:
But that doesn't guarantee the quality remains the same just because its numerically unchanged. The ET as a whole will gradually suffer in its product

And what happens to this ‘emerging talent’ mostly from the hotelplanner tour when some of the 10/20/30... players come back from the pgat into the ET after 1 or 2 seasons?
Likely most who went to the US are still more than good enough to hold their own on the ET, but that means some of the newly promoted guys are 'relegated' to try again or call it quits after sinking all their effort/cash into the chance to stay on ET.

Hope you enjoyed your taste of the good life boys but xyz players are coming back to the ET after their pgat hiatus, so its back in your box you go...
Click to expand...

Will the quality suffer ? Maybe the players coming through may well be better than what’s leaving - there is no guarantees either way surely

We have seen the likes of Penge coming through replacing players

And those that go to the PGAT are still members of the ET with rights to play in events

And when players gain cards some aren’t access to every event

Some players bounce between tours , some just can’t handle the step up

But it’s promotion and relegation as such - play well enough and you get the rewards
 
Arthur Wedge said:
Will the quality suffer ? Maybe the players coming through may well be better than what’s leaving - there is no guarantees either way surely

We have seen the likes of Penge coming through replacing players

And those that go to the PGAT are still members of the ET with rights to play in events

And when players gain cards some aren’t access to every event

Some players bounce between tours , some just can’t handle the step up

But it’s promotion and relegation as such - play well enough and you get the rewards
Click to expand...

Some may eventually be better but its a guarantee they are not better now nor will they be when next season kicks off, it'll take a few seasons to find out and during that time the quality goes down

As good as its been to watch would Penge have had the season he did if the best of the rest hadn't left to play 14+ standard pgat events? We'll never know

Yes those that go to pgat still have ET membership and they exercise those playing rights mainly on the elevated ET events during their year in the US

I get it, its sport, winners and losers etc etc. The cream will always rise to the top and go to US, but if you keep milking it and let the next level of players go too... is it a sustainable model? You think it is, I hope it is but remain doubtful
 
I think we have to look at it like the football.
Basically the PGA is the Premier league and the European tour the Championship, with the tours below Leagues 1 & 2.

The PGA like the prem is the place with the biggest money so that’s where the players want to be.

I guess the LIV tour is the equivalent of the European Super league then 😂😂
 
Slab said:
Some may eventually be better but its a guarantee they are not better now nor will they be when next season kicks off, it'll take a few seasons to find out and during that time the quality goes down

As good as its been to watch would Penge have had the season he did if the best of the rest hadn't left to play 14+ standard pgat events? We'll never know

Yes those that go to pgat still have ET membership and they exercise those playing rights mainly on the elevated ET events during their year in the US

I get it, its sport, winners and losers etc etc. The cream will always rise to the top and go to US, but if you keep milking it and let the next level of players go too... is it a sustainable model? You think it is, I hope it is but remain doubtful
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So what’s the alternative?

People are complaining about the partnership between the PGAT and ET ? If the ET don’t work with the PGAT then what ?

When it comes to sustainability- the ET have just announced ten year long deals with DP world and Sky

Better players are always waiting in the wings to move up - that’s been the way for decades - there is a clear pathway for any young player in Europe or Asia or Africa -it’s path way that maybe stops the best young players jumping to US college and via the KFT - we get them on the ET
 
irip said:
I think we have to look at it like the football.
Basically the PGA is the Premier league and the European tour the Championship, with the tours below Leagues 1 & 2.

The PGA like the prem is the place with the biggest money so that’s where the players want to be.

I guess the LIV tour is the equivalent of the European Super league then 😂😂
Click to expand...

It’s as good an analogy as you can within golf

And the PGAT has the upper hand because of the majors and money
 
Arthur Wedge said:
So what’s the alternative?

People are complaining about the partnership between the PGAT and ET ? If the ET don’t work with the PGAT then what ?

When it comes to sustainability- the ET have just announced ten year long deals with DP world and Sky

Better players are always waiting in the wings to move up - that’s been the way for decades - there is a clear pathway for any young player in Europe or Asia or Africa -it’s path way that maybe stops the best young players jumping to US college and via the KFT - we get them on the ET
Click to expand...

Well the obvious alternatives might be to consider fewer than 10 or less frequent than annually.

If the strength in depth conveyor belt isn't quite what you imagine then either would lesson the impact on the ET product
 
Arthur Wedge said:
It’s as good an analogy as you can within golf

And the PGAT has the upper hand because of the majors and money
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It’s human nature to accept more money.
It really is as simple as that.

The money they are talking about is huge as well at least in potential.

It’s the only reason that a lot of players went to LIV.

I am not blaming them either, how many of us wouldn’t change who we work for to earn significantly more money for doing basically the same job?
 
Slab said:
Well the obvious alternatives might be to consider fewer than 10 or less frequent than annually.

If the strength in depth conveyor belt isn't quite what you imagine then either would lesson the impact on the ET product
Click to expand...

So what about the players on the pathway below if the spots are reduced that are available ?
 
irip said:
It’s human nature to accept more money.
It really is as simple as that.

The money they are talking about is huge as well at least in potential.

It’s the only reason that a lot of players went to LIV.

I am not blaming them either, how many of us wouldn’t change who we work for to earn significantly more money for doing basically the same job?
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Oh there is no doubt that money plays a big role - the majors do as well , it’s a touch easier to gain entry into the Masters, PGA and US Open by playing on the PGAT
 
The PGA for the top players is the easiest way to gain entry into Majors.

The LIV tour is the best way to earn quick money especially when it first started and especially for the players approaching the end of their careers.

What that did do was create space for players like JJ Spaun to sneak into the gap and do really well for themselves.
 
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