Postman Pat Power

[Crazyface]

My son, who is a Postie, told us that the parcels they have might not get delivered in time for Christmas Day. They have been swamped. Thing is, at their depot they are being "funny" about O/T payments so the lads have told 'em to shove it. Also the lads were asked to rock up on Sunday to get the parcels out. "Are you paying double time?" was the question. The answer was negative. "Shove that too".

Brilliant. If only the rest of the working population had done this then all shops that open Sunday would be paying the proper rate for Sundays.

 

[Rooter]

While i respect their resistance to do owt for nowt, and why should they! I fear the management will just outsource or get agency staff in to sort the backlog. Next time pay/pension/terms negotiations are on the table, i would be worried. Was no compromise available or explored?

 

[MegaSteve]

A race to the bottom benefits no one in the long run...

 

[Lord Tyrion]

A sudden surge of parcels at Christmas. Who could have seen that coming?

The problem for both sides in this is that there are now many alternatives to the post office and each time a dispute occurs people move to those alternatives. During the last national strike we stopped posting out invoices and swapped customers to electronic invoices. We also moved from sending small boxes with the PO to using a carrier for everything. We spend peanuts with them now and that move occurred due to their own actions. We are a small business but multiply that across all businesses of all sizes and you have a major problem for Royal Mail / Post Office and its staff.

 

[Hobbit]

Surely overtime payment terms are covered in their contract of employment?

Mrs Hobbit worked in retail for most of her working life, including before Sunday working. Her contract, pre-Sunday working, protected her rights, initially. However, those rights were soon 'bought' out. By the time she retired all working hours were paid at single rate.

Good luck on fighting it...

 

[jim8flog]

While i respect their resistance to do owt for nowt, and why should they! I fear the management will just outsource or get agency staff in to sort the backlog. Next time pay/pension/terms negotiations are on the table, i would be worried. Was no compromise available or explored?

The Post Office has always need extra deliverers at Christmas. My dad used to work for them most years because he was a 'man with a van' on his days off from his full time job.

 

[Crazyface]

Surely overtime payment terms are covered in their contract of employment?

Good luck on fighting it...

You'd think so, but it appears not as they've told them to a man (and woman) they're not doing it. RM is unionized, to outsource might not be an option.

 

[Hobbit]

You'd think so, but it appears not as they've told them to a man (and woman) they're not doing it. RM is unionized, to outsource might not be an option.

From my time with BT, 30 years ago, it used to be UCW and was very unionised. I hope they fight it and win.

As for outsourcing, there was an article a few days ago that said the private companies are also struggling with workloads.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

All carriers struggle at this time of year, shear workload particularly as more sales go online. The problem Royal Mail have is they are still a dinosaur in comparison to the new carriers who are very flexible and not tied to old fashioned work methods. Now you might argue those work methods were good for its employees but the problem is when you are up against a whole host of companies who are not trying to work with one hand behind your back it is tough going.

One example. On my estate on a Saturday morning I can see 3 Royal Mail vans delivering a mixture of post and parcels. If it was DPD or Yodel then one driver would be doing it, as they often are. Royal Mail is still clumsy and inefficient.

 

[Hobbit]

One example. On my estate on a Saturday morning I can see 3 Royal Mail vans delivering a mixture of post and parcels. If it was DPD or Yodel then one driver would be doing it, as they often are. Royal Mail is still clumsy and inefficient.

The reason you see 3x Posties is quite simple. They have by far the biggest customer base/workload. They are also legally obliged to deliver the loss making post that the carriers won't touch, and have a large infrastructure behind it.

 

[MegaSteve]

Cheap 'n cheerful doesn't always work...

Whistl lasted all of five minutes...

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Too much crossover though Brian. Three vans on one estate? Load one van with all of the post and the parcels, one and a half vans at most. It's a doddle of an estate to deliver to and there is no way a commercial carrier would deal with it in the same way.

I do accept your point about universal service :thup:. It's a killer for them.

 

[Bunkermagnet]

Letters wise, ours are now delivered at all times of the day, and often get neighbours mail as well as ours. Parcels wise, I dread it if it’s RM being used(although Parcel Farce aren’t that much better).
All the other carriers will try and leave a parcel with a neighbour if they can rather than take it back and have to re deliver another day. RM ,and PF to a degree, just use the proverbial feather to knock the door, ignoring the bell, and just stick a card through saying out every time. This then means you have to go to the actual P.O. to collect.
I have also seen them just walk to the front door with an out card leaving the parcel in the van. When challenged, the response was “I thought you were out......” It seems psychic powers are also part of their requirements.
Whilst I have no problem with workers protecting their rights, I wonder if those same RM workers go shoppping on a Sunday, or whether they boycott said shops because those workers who do work Sundays definitely won’t be on double time pay whether they choose to work or not.

 

[Hobbit]

Too much crossover though Brian. Three vans on one estate? Load one van with all of the post and the parcels, one and a half vans at most. It's a doddle of an estate to deliver to and there is no way a commercial carrier would deal with it in the same way.

I do accept your point about universal service :thup:. It's a killer for them.

Have you considered that those vans may have left the dept full? And that there may be a kpi for delivery or face penalties from Ofcom.

They're not perfect by any stretch but from what I've seen when collecting from a major independent several times a week for years, before flying a desk, I'll take the Royal Mail every time.

 

[MegaSteve]

Since RM started using part time staff, where possible, the service has gone down...
However, still well ahead of Hermes and Yodel to name two...

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Have you considered that those vans may have left the dept full? And that there may be a kpi for delivery or face penalties from Ofcom.

They're not perfect by any stretch but from what I've seen when collecting from a major independent several times a week for years, before flying a desk, I'll take the Royal Mail every time.

Yes but they are not big vans. Take a stretched transit as the others do and fill that once.

I appreciate things can be more complicated from the inside than they seem to us on the outside but having dealt with many carriers on a daily basis I still find RM living in a previous era.

 

[jim8flog]

One example. On my estate on a Saturday morning I can see 3 Royal Mail vans delivering a mixture of post and parcels. If it was DPD or Yodel then one driver would be doing it, as they often are. Royal Mail is still clumsy and inefficient.

That's probably because RM and Parcel Force are not the same company and timed deliveries always get delivered first, then back to the depot and load up with untimed deliveries if there is not enough room.
I know where I live a lot of the other companies either work out of Bristol or Exeter most of them do the timed deliveries on the way out and the untimed on the way back. We only get to see them once because we are at the end of the line.

 

[Hobbit]

Yes but they are not big vans. Take a stretched transit as the others do and fill that once.

I appreciate things can be more complicated from the inside than they seem to us on the outside but having dealt with many carriers on a daily basis I still find RM living in a previous era.

Royal Mail use there vans all year round. Using large vans for small deliveries throughout the year would be inefficient. RM have, in the main, permanent staff who get paid holidays and pensions. The independents use, in the main, self-employed some of which are on limited contracts and who don't get the sort of benefits many take for granted

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Royal Mail has always struck me as one of the last of the union led dinosaurs and a militant workforce looking for as much cash without necessarily busting a gut. I have a guy at the golf club who works for them and he'd be happy to do more shifts but often finds it hard to be allowed to do so

 

[Tashyboy]

Someone correct me if am wrong, but I was talking to our postie the other week. Delightful chappies who seems a bit of a socialist type chappie when toy talk to him. He told me they now have a Canadian chief exec who wants every house to pay a yearly fee to be on the mailing list.. Then you can have your mail delivered, which you still pay for three days a week. Eh. That's what they do in Canada he said. That's gonna go down well