Liverpool FC's dilemma

MadAdey said:
Yes but by my Employer giving you this type of training, I do not then have the excuse of "I did not realise I was being racist" This is why the PFA has always had these types of courses for young Pro's to teach them about equality and diversity. Now they are going to extend these courses to players arriving int his country after what has happened with Suarez.

When you work in a job that requires you to come into contact with many different races, and work in other countries it can be easy to do or say something that in your own culture would not cause offend. From what I know about this subject compared to someone who has never done it, you would be shocked by what you can get done for in the workplace. What you may think is acceptable, just may not be.
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Hello Adey... Thankyou for taking the time to expand on your original post... I just hope similiar training is in place for those that visit our tolerant shores...

Perhaps a scheme can be set up to educate those on the terraces as to whats acceptable in the way of chants... Can't be good for a footballer, in his workplace, to be advised his missus "takes it up the bum"...

Whilst I believe football is a whole lot less racist now than it has been in the past...This being due to society's perception of racism as whole... Other 'prejudices' have now found a place on the terraces...
 
Disregarding the incident with the "fan" (who will get a banning order if he's convicted), the way Liverpool FC have conducted themselves over the whole Suarez affair has been nothing short of embarrassing.

From publicly supporting the player via news conferences, press releases and the ridiculous t-shirt wearing, even after he has been suspended the club accept the suspension without an appeal but then go on to say the allegation is unsubstantiated. Add to that the player's "apology" which not only failed to be aimed directly at the player he abused, but also shamefully went on to agree that he will not use "the word" on a pitch in this country again. What about elsewhere?

The club should either put up, and come right out and say why the FA got it so badly wrong, as that is quite clearly what they are saying, or they should show some class and shut up.
 
DappaDonDave said:
Some players are worth big money, Rooney, beckham, ronaldo, messi...but not because of their football skills, but because the money they bring in through merchandise sales and advertising!

I think Liverpool have shot themselves in the foot and there's no way going back, we all know the majority of Liverpool fans are Neanderthals so will not be able to comprehend why racism has no place in the world!
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Thats just like saying all golfers from thornton-Clevelys are crap golfers.
 
DappaDonDave said:
Some players are worth big money, Rooney, beckham, ronaldo, messi...but not because of their football skills, but because the money they bring in through merchandise sales and advertising!

I think Liverpool have shot themselves in the foot and there's no way going back, we all know the majority of Liverpool fans are Neanderthals so will not be able to comprehend why racism has no place in the world!
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Dappa, is the irony not lost on you that you are offering up sweeping generalisations based on where a person is born/which footy team they choose to support.

And you ask people to comprehend rascism.

I think the bell tolls for thee.
 
Liverbirdie said:
Dappa, is the irony not lost on you that you are offering up sweeping generalisations based on where a person is born/which footy team they choose to support.

And you ask people to comprehend rascism.

I think the bell tolls for thee.
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Why take 2 posts when i summed it up in one :whistle:



Hope today went well!
 
I think there are two different cases here. The fan who abused the Oldham player is not the responsibility of the club and there is no onus on them to do anything. If he is found guilty he'll be treated as a race criminal in a court. Yes, Liverpool can comment and condone his behaviour and ban him but that is as far as they need go.

Suarez has been dealth with under the terms of his employment with the club and the FA as the governing body. Whether you think what he did "allegedly" was right or wrong or did or din't happen, the verdict has been made. Liverpool didn't agree and whilst I thought the shirt stunt was crass, at least the club are supporting him in what they see is an incorrect verdict. I think the John Terry verdict will be the real interesting one as he's being tried as a member of the public and not by the governing body the FA. What the FA do if he is found guilty is the question but I doubt they'll allow the manager to pick him for England as a matter of principle.
 
Scouser said:
Why take 2 posts when i summed it up in one :whistle:



Hope today went well!
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Nah, got beat 5/4. We were 2 up on the front nine (twice), all square after 9. Lost the next 5 to pars and birdies. Ah well, I can imagine Dubai is crap anyway (not).

West lancs is boss though, although slightly prefer S & A.

Yours captain caveman.;)
 
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Liverbirdie said:
Dappa, is the irony not lost on you that you are offering up sweeping generalisations based on where a person is born/which footy team they choose to support.

And you ask people to comprehend rascism.

I think the bell tolls for thee.
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Ah yes, the irony...I will be wearing a T-shirt to support myself on my next round of golf, followed by an apology but not directly to Scouser or yourself. Just in general.

Then I'll expect no other repercussions and the whole incident to be forgotten.
 
DappaDonDave said:
Ah yes, the irony...I will be wearing a T-shirt to support myself on my next round of golf, followed by an apology but not directly to Scouser or yourself. Just in general.

Then I'll expect no other repercussions and the whole incident to be forgotten.
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Good lad, welcome to the neanderthals club.

Which clubs do you use?
 
I think the worst thing to come out of any of this, is the fact that some "fans" are just looking to profit by using this as a thing to beat LFC with. I didn't know that football fans were so moralistic, so passionately against all forms of rascism, so anti-abuse and, by jove, such well meaning, hail fellow well met, thoroughly decent, salt of the earth, bastions of moral fortitude. It is so sad to see. If you want to campaign for all things right and proper go and do it elsewhere, because it just doesn't wash that you are beyond reproach, and the worse thing is the insincerity of it all. You aren't that bothered about racial issues, just a means to attack a rival. Sad,sad,sad.

I think it is proved by the amount of Man U fans on all internet forums who seem to represent 3/4 of the posters attacking LFC. BTW some Man U fans have also said some level headed comments also, sadly in the minority. I would say the majority of LFC fans, actually think that Suarez should have got a ban, although maybe not so lengthy, due to extenuating circumstances. 99% of LFC fans are abhorred with the divvy on Friday night, though.

Apparently Man U have had 2 supporters arrested for chanting racial abuse at OT this season, whereas LFC have only had one. Does that make them twice as rascist? - No it does not, but just shows how some things can be mis-represented and packaged up neatly to fit some people's aganda.

Are all the Chelsea/Arsenal fans going to be brought to book via CCTV for chanting Y***oes at Spurs? No.

I just hate all the faux concern, insincerity of it all, by footy fans/LFC rivals who want to beat us with it.
 
Liverbirdie said:
I think the worst thing to come out of any of this, is the fact that some "fans" are just looking to profit by using this as a thing to beat LFC with. I didn't know that football fans were so moralistic, so passionately against all forms of rascism, so anti-abuse and, by jove, such well meaning, hail fellow well met, thoroughly decent, salt of the earth, bastions of moral fortitude. It is so sad to see. If you want to campaign for all things right and proper go and do it elsewhere, because it just doesn't wash that you are beyond reproach, and the worse thing is the insincerity of it all. You aren't that bothered about racial issues, just a means to attack a rival. Sad,sad,sad.

I think it is proved by the amount of Man U fans on all internet forums who seem to represent 3/4 of the posters attacking LFC. BTW some Man U fans have also said some level headed comments also, sadly in the minority. I would say the majority of LFC fans, actually think that Suarez should have got a ban, although maybe not so lengthy, due to extenuating circumstances. 99% of LFC fans are abhorred with the divvy on Friday night, though.

Apparently Man U have had 2 supporters arrested for chanting racial abuse at OT this season, whereas LFC have only had one. Does that make them twice as rascist? - No it does not, but just shows how some things can be mis-represented and packaged up neatly to fit some people's aganda.

Are all the Chelsea/Arsenal fans going to be brought to book via CCTV for chanting Y***oes at Spurs? No.

I just hate all the faux concern, insincerity of it all, by footy fans/LFC rivals who want to beat us with it.
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I fully agree with the above, however, most of it could have been avoided if the situation had been handled just a little bit better by ALL concerned. The T shirts were pathetic though. I was there when they came out of the tunnel and the reaction of the crowd was pretty much one of bemused pity.. It is a shame that a great club like Liverpool is being singled out for coverage when it happens at most grounds every week....
 
bluewolf said:
I fully agree with the above, however, most of it could have been avoided if the situation had been handled just a little bit better by ALL concerned. The T shirts were pathetic though. I was there when they came out of the tunnel and the reaction of the crowd was pretty much one of bemused pity.. It is a shame that a great club like Liverpool is being singled out for coverage when it happens at most grounds every week....
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Thanks Bluewolf, for the level headed assessment. I was at Wigan that night and heard about the t-shirt thing whilst in the Asda cafe by the ground (nice pies BTW). My initial thought was it was a bad idea, but thought I would wait to see the t-shirts. I thought it may have an anti-rascism thing on them also (which they did not, sadly).

It was a bad idea, and although I think that LFC have generally handled a lot of things badly, I still think that you dont just cast people off and never forgive them. People have been talking about tolerant society, but there also does not seem to be much forgiveness about, although a direct apology to Evra would have probably helped. I think if John Terry's case had all been handled by now and say he would have had a 12 game ban, that more LFC fans would have gone ok, at least Suarez's case was proportional, but in the meantime this is all just trundling on and on.

I went to the match home and away in the 80's and football has moved on so much, but clearly it has much more to go. It has generally gone away from race towards more hurtful songs.

There are so many other examples - Arsenal fans song about Adebayor's parents washing camels!!!! However, Arsenal has always had a large following of black fans, but did this cause anywhere near a fuss, no it did not.
 
Liverbirdie said:
I think the worst thing to come out of any of this, is the fact that some "fans" are just looking to profit by using this as a thing to beat LFC with. I didn't know that football fans were so moralistic, so passionately against all forms of rascism, so anti-abuse and, by jove, such well meaning, hail fellow well met, thoroughly decent, salt of the earth, bastions of moral fortitude. It is so sad to see. If you want to campaign for all things right and proper go and do it elsewhere, because it just doesn't wash that you are beyond reproach, and the worse thing is the insincerity of it all. You aren't that bothered about racial issues, just a means to attack a rival. Sad,sad,sad.

I think it is proved by the amount of Man U fans on all internet forums who seem to represent 3/4 of the posters attacking LFC. BTW some Man U fans have also said some level headed comments also, sadly in the minority. I would say the majority of LFC fans, actually think that Suarez should have got a ban, although maybe not so lengthy, due to extenuating circumstances. 99% of LFC fans are abhorred with the divvy on Friday night, though.

Apparently Man U have had 2 supporters arrested for chanting racial abuse at OT this season, whereas LFC have only had one. Does that make them twice as rascist? - No it does not, but just shows how some things can be mis-represented and packaged up neatly to fit some people's aganda.

Are all the Chelsea/Arsenal fans going to be brought to book via CCTV for chanting Y***oes at Spurs? No.

I just hate all the faux concern, insincerity of it all, by footy fans/LFC rivals who want to beat us with it.
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Paranoid there Liverbirdie.

Fans have nothing against Liverpool, in fact most fans prefer you to Man Utd and Chelsea. Why would anyone want to beat LFC up? You're a fairly harmless club that doesn't win much these days. You're not that relevant. Fans across the board are more anti sides that continue to win things or buy success through sugar daddies. I'd rather see Liverpool win trophies than Man City for example.

This has nothing to do with bias. From what I've seen 80-90% of fans in general regardless of who they support believe your club has been in the wrong. Of the Liverpool fans, the vast majority believe Suarez shouldn't have even been banned, your view is a minority.

Saying the worst thing to come out of all this is Liverpool FC being attacked is laughable. Two players have been racially abused by your star player and then a fan. Nevermind that, poor Liverpool have been attacked :rolleyes:

Arsenal/Spurs fans do get charged for anti-semitic comments if caught. The issue is more complex as Spurs fans have reclaimed a certain term and chant it in support of their side. You can find cases of fans being charged with abuse against Spurs though.
 
A1ex said:
Paranoid there Liverbirdie.

Fans have nothing against Liverpool, in fact most fans prefer you to Man Utd and Chelsea. Why would anyone want to beat LFC up? You're a fairly harmless club that doesn't win much these days. You're not that relevant. Fans across the board are more anti sides that continue to win things or buy success through sugar daddies. I'd rather see Liverpool win trophies than Man City for example.

This has nothing to do with bias. From what I've seen 80-90% of fans in general regardless of who they support believe your club has been in the wrong. Of the Liverpool fans, the vast majority believe Suarez shouldn't have even been banned, your view is a minority.

Saying the worst thing to come out of all this is Liverpool FC being attacked is laughable. Two players have been racially abused by your star player and then a fan. Nevermind that, poor Liverpool have been attacked :rolleyes:

Arsenal/Spurs fans do get charged for anti-semitic comments if caught. The issue is more complex as Spurs fans have reclaimed a certain term and chant it in support of their side. You can find cases of fans being charged with abuse against Spurs though.
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Not paranoid fella, just railing agaisnt this sudden faux moral conscience that has suddenly come from most daft footy fans,as well as defending LFC, where I feel it needs defending, but not defending the indefensible.

If people want to campaign against rascism, good, I agree with it. But do it for the right reasons, not just to kick a rival. If people are suddenly jumping on a bandwagon, through insincere reasons, then it will only put a campaign back in the long run, as when all this blows over, they will just move on to something else.

Even though we are not winning things, I think you will still find LFC is a big scalp. I think I speak to more LFC fans than you on a daily basis, and probably more that go the match.

Do you not think there is an insincere aspect to thousands of Man U fans going on internet forums, mainly to stick the boot in, and using race as a vehicle for this. Probably the same hypocrites who sing loads of anti-scouse songs, but have Rooney as a hero.
 
A1ex said:
Paranoid there Liverbirdie.

You're a fairly harmless club that doesn't win much these days. You're not that relevant. Fans across the board are more anti sides that continue to win things or buy success through sugar daddies.
.
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What relevence does the above have to your point ?? the min i read this i just lost intrest in the rest of your reply , i did read it but this just put me off .. if you wana have a debate over something then debate whats going on & leave thesilly comments aside if you wana be taken seriously ..


Oh and let me sum up some footy fans for ya , players are abused when they play for their clubs by some oposing fans then supported by the same fans when they put in a good performance for their countries ..

Fans this worried about stuff , start in your own club (yes its in every club) & when ya fix it there then HELP out other clubs to do the same in a positive way ..
 
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