Is the backswing important?

[stefanovic]

Seem to remember a famous golfer (Miller) saying it wasn't. You don't hit the ball with the backswing. Players like Daly and Trevino would appear to confirm this.
Yet most of our attention is on the backswing, lifting the club against the 'force of gravity'' then letting it drop (even though it's not dropping).
Thoughts, please.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

For decades I played with a rubbish backswing and got down to six - but only because I played so much that I completely grooved the rest of my swing.

Then I had to pretty much stop playing for a few years and now I'm going again that groove cannot be found.

My poor backswing is a horrendous blocker to me improving and getting back on track. I had grooved it in my mind so much that whenever I relax and don't concentrate my head instantly drops me back into my old backswing ways. And the old grooved rest of the swing just isn't there and it's just a mare.

I wish I had got my backswing sorted 25yrs ago.

 

[bobmac]

The backswing doesn't matter one bit.
Where it finishes however, does matter as thats where you pull from.

 

[stefanovic]

I'm not convinced that the backswing anyone had in the past can be replicated in the present. The bones and tendons for instance will not be as strong as you get older. Think of Lyle, short backswing, maximum power into the ball. I imagined this would be an enduring swing, but it wasn't. I think Lyle went down to being like a 4 handicapper.
The point I'm attempting to make is that the only part of the swing which is important is the hitting area. When I watch golf videos there is some guy making it sound easy, but it isn't. Not only that but I never get see just how good the shot really is. You are relying on what happens in the hit on what has happened in the backswing and first part of the downswing to provide the momentum and accuracy in accordance with one of the laws of physics. This is the 3rd Law of Motion where an action produces a reaction, in this case the club head hitting the ball.
If the backswing isn't important, or unsustainable, should I consider even the downswing and follow through to also be unimportant, and only the actual hit is important?

 

[Foxholer]

...
If the backswing isn't important, or unsustainable, should I consider even the downswing and follow through to also be unimportant, and only the actual hit is important?

That's the only thing that governs what the ball does! The Moment Of Truth!

But if you want the impact conditions to be as you intend, then other parts of the swing ARE important!

Actual follow-through only reflects what has happened earlier in the swing, though often worthwhile to use as a 'swing thought'.

 

[jim8flog]

I find if I do not back swing the balls goes nowhere.

 

[hairball_89]

It's an interesting question. For me, my backswing almost entirely governs what happens on my actual swing. Swing back too quickly, I get unbalanced and completely lose control of my body positioning. The result is virtually always a little white ball flying off to the next village on the right somewhere. Controlled back swing keeps me in control of my positioning, allowing me to really work through the ball. Result? Somewhere down the fairway (hopefully).

Yes, the important bit is c. 2" before the ball to c. 2" after, and what the clubhead is doing at that time. But for me, all the prep to get it doing the right thing, comes from being in control of my backswing and allowing myself to let rip on the actual swing.

 

[jusme]

I think it's critical. I can tell half way back on my back swing if I'm going to hit a decent shot. If I'm on the plane that works for me (and I know it very quickly on the takeaway) I know I can just continue and will hit a decent shot.

 

[Wolf]

It's an interesting question does back swing matter. In a way the answer is yes, because you need a back swing to create momentum to deliver the club to hit the ball.

I think the better way of perhaps wording it is: Does the style or technique of the back swing matter?.. to me the answer to this is categorically No!

All that matters is the ability to consistently deliver the club face square at impact. Look at swings like Rose, Adam Scott etc, and they get described as text book. Yet Furyk had more loops than the Nemesis ride at Alton Towers, Garcia, Fowler have big loops, DJ has an unbelievably closed club face at the top, Spieth is upright.

The list is endless of superb players with what would be classed as fundamentally flawed swings in the text books but they consistently deliver the face of club correctly at impact.

I understand why people go in hunt of swing rebuilds to get better, hasn't Leadbetter even created the 'A' swing methodology to do just this create a repeatable alternative action that does one thing, deliver club face correctly at impact, whether you like the guy or technique or not I like the idea that he wants to make it simpler to square the club.

But again it's purely matter of opinion and mist people want a swing that does both look good and performs good perhaps this is our gilolfing vanity. Personally I'm not worried about if it looks good just if it perform, I'd take a Furyk swing all day if it consistently worked.

 

[stefanovic]

Leadbetter described the 'move away' as the first part of the backswing by the rotation of the abdomen. So I tried it and it sort of worked but I got lost after that. Then there was Hogan's backswing - hands, arms, shoulders - proved too much and by the time I'd started the downswing with the hips I'd forgotten all about hitting the ball. The problem is the swing only takes about 2 seconds. I think that's the reason why you can't have more than 2 swing thoughts.
After I posted this thread I played 18 holes and tried to forget the backswing. It was encouraging. A few pars and a couple of birdies. Just concentrating on a centre of gravity point, but too early to draw a conclusion.

Because I like physics and also the golf swing I'm aware that what happens is never what you assume. You think you take the club away against the force of gravity, but there is no force of gravity. The club does not then drop with gravity once the backswing is complete. The mass of the Earth is moving up to meet it, so any additional force you use is most likely to accelerate the club too early. When the club head is arriving at the ball it's just as valid to say the ball is arriving at the club head. Once the ball has left the club head the follow through is of no significance.
No wonder the swing is complicated!

 

[Slime]

Because I like physics and also the golf swing I'm aware that what happens is never what you assume. You think you take the club away against the force of gravity, but there is no force of gravity. The club does not then drop with gravity once the backswing is complete. The mass of the Earth is moving up to meet it, so any additional force you use is most likely to accelerate the club too early. When the club head is arriving at the ball it's just as valid to say the ball is arriving at the club head. Once the ball has left the club head the follow through is of no significance.
No wonder the swing is complicated!

I must be either stupid or completely missing the point because what I've highlighted sounds like a load of old balls, to me.
There is gravity involved, there must be, otherwise my ball will never land, (assuming it got off the ground in the first place)!

 

[Bunkermagnet]

What does matter is the moment of impact, needing timing and tempo.
However my backswing will decide how my shot goes simply because if I know it doesnt feel right I'm goose'd straight away. Possibly even more important for me is that fraction of a second at address moving into take away. Too often I start as if I've been jolted with 450v

 

[stefanovic]

I must be either stupid or completely missing the point because what I've highlighted sounds like a load of old balls, to me.
There is gravity involved, there must be, otherwise my ball will never land, (assuming it got off the ground in the first place)!

So here's a question for you. At the end of a round, do your feet ache? I'll assume yes. This is not because you have been pressing into the ground, it's because the ground is pressing into you. If there ever was a force of gravity then the moon would have collapsed on to the earth. It stays in orbit because of the physics discovered by Einstein and others. When you hit the ball it is the warping of space and time caused by a large object, in this case the earth, which brings it back down to the ground. The moon on the other hand stays in its orbit because of its motion and distance away. There is no attraction between the ball and the ground. The ball is made of atoms and so is the ground and the ball never gets high enough to go into orbit. Every object moves in as straight a line as it can within curved space time.
What makes this more intriguing that every time you hit a golf ball you influence the furthest star.

 

[Imurg]

What's more important is whether you can get the club back to the ball properly.
A good back swing makes this easier but if you can do it with a Jim Furykesque swing then it doesn't matter at all.
In my opinion.....

 

[stefanovic]

Has anyone been able to successfully copy the swings of the great golfers? This would include Furyk. I know some people tried to copy Trevino but only with limited success.

 

[Wolf]

Has anyone been able to successfully copy the swings of the great golfers? This would include Furyk. I know some people tried to copy Trevino but only with limited success.

Check out Matt Wolf college player destined for big things and that's worse than Furyk but it works

 

[Slime]

So here's a question for you. At the end of a round, do your feet ache? I'll assume yes. This is not because you have been pressing into the ground, it's because the ground is pressing into you. If there ever was a force of gravity then the moon would have collapsed on to the earth. It stays in orbit because of the physics discovered by Einstein and others. When you hit the ball it is the warping of space and time caused by a large object, in this case the earth, which brings it back down to the ground. The moon on the other hand stays in its orbit because of its motion and distance away. There is no attraction between the ball and the ground. The ball is made of atoms and so is the ground and the ball never gets high enough to go into orbit. Every object moves in as straight a line as it can within curved space time.
What makes this more intriguing that every time you hit a golf ball you influence the furthest star.

So, gravity doesn't exist ................................. interesting.
I wish someone had told Isaac Newton.

 

[MadAdey]

The backswing doesn't matter one bit.
Where it finishes however, does matter as thats where you pull from.

As always a short, sharp answer that is straight to the point and on point. Positioning to me is what is important in the backswing. I know if I take it away past a certain point then it will be set right at the top, giving me a good shot. So in a way the backswing might be important.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Some interesting takes on the backswing here

 

[chrisd]

My new teacher says that he isn't so concerned with the way I backswing but that I get to where i can make a good down swing. I've seen both Furyk and Daly live, and their backswings, whilst not being orthodox both led to wonderful positions in the downswing and a very tidy sum of prize money each