Improving Your Lie

[Crazyface]

During a knock the other night one of the lads was in deep long grass and decided to play it. Big swish. Ball was drilled even further into the stuff. LOL He exclaimed from the pampas grass "I can't even see it now!" and began to wave his club about in the stuff in an attempt to find the thing. I called over to him "You can't do that it's improving your lie" as I thought this was the case, but thinking about it later (now) I realise I could be wrong as he was searching for his ball not actually attempting to improve his lie.

Was I right? (It was only a knock so didn't matter).

 

[clubchamp98]

I think you can move grass to look for your ball but any significant change must be put back before you play your shot.

 

[jim8flog]

From the book

If taking such reasonable actions as part of a fair search improves the conditions affecting the stroke:

• There is no penalty under Rule 8.1a if the improvement results from a fair search.

• But if the improvement results from actions that exceeded what was reasonable for a fair search, the player gets the general penalty for breach of Rule 8.1a.


Whether or a penalty applies I would say moving the grass about with his club would depend on exactly how he was moving the grass.

 

[Slab]

From the book

If taking such reasonable actions as part of a fair search improves the conditions affecting the stroke:

• There is no penalty under Rule 8.1a if the improvement results from a fair search.

• But if the improvement results from actions that exceeded what was reasonable for a fair search, the player gets the general penalty for breach of Rule 8.1a.


Whether or a penalty applies I would say moving the grass about with his club would depend on exactly how he was moving the grass.

Do the rules say whether it is the player or committee that determine what is reasonable/fair?

 

[jim8flog]

Do the rules say whether it is the player or committee that determine what is reasonable/fair?

From the book


a. Player May Take Reasonable Actions to Find and Identify Ball
A player is responsible for finding his or her ball in play after each stroke.

The player may fairly search for the ball by taking reasonable actions to find and identify it, such as:
Moving sand and water, and

• Moving or bending grass, bushes, tree branches and other growing or attached natural objects, and also breaking such objects, but only if such breaking is a result of other reasonable actions taken to find or identify the ball.

Like a lot of rules, for the committee to be involved it would up to another player to report the circumstances to them to form an opinion.

 

[clubchamp98]

Do the rules say whether it is the player or committee that determine what is reasonable/fair?

This is a rule where there are several answers.
One mans fair search is another’s scything the grass.
You can avoid a penalty by restoring the original lie but not if you break or cut anything.

 

[Crazyface]

Piggin' tricky one then.