Impact position - 2 part question.

[One Planer]

Gareth. Apologies about the thread-jack.

No worries bud, I like to see a reasoned debate.

What exactly what are you trying to achieve?

I'm trying to understand why I keep hitting a pull. Last night was a prime exampe. When I get slow with my hips, I can 'feel' my shoulders swing across the ball sending it left.

I dont curve the ball in the air much at all. Very rarely hit a slice or a hook, but have a tendancy to block and pull (... In straight lines). What I have found is that when I make a concious effort to rotate my hips so that they are through the shot before impact, I hit exactly the shot I'm after (A ball that travels arrow straght to the peak of it's flight, then falls to the right on its way down. A 5-10 yard fade max)

Hence my question(s)

And why?

To have a swing that repeats more frequently minimising my bad shot (pull). Effectivley taking the left side of the course out of play.

what is the fundamental thing you are trying to achieve?

The fundimental thing I want to change is the club face in relation to the path and resulting shot shape (... As described above)

how will you measure 'success'?

When the pull shot is no longer a worry. I have no issue hitting one every now and again, after all I'm a handicap, club golfer, but not as frequently as I do now.

I'm pretty sure hitting the ball further, better and more consistently, would be an appropriate set of metrics - for me at least.

Your metrics are sound. The one proviso I do have is I am willing to lose distance in order to achieve my goal.

 

[CMAC]

still invisible............I'll share my secret elsewhere......muhahaha

 

[JustOne]

Ok Foxy (humour me, should be easy!! ) ..... here's 10 impact conditions.... ONE of which is a perfect golf shot......

Pick one... any number...

 

[JustOne]

Any one.....

Reach out a hand and pick up a nice cold beer, any of the 10, yum yum, soooo refreshing, one is the perfect golf shot....


which one did you choose?

 

[JustOne]

The beer's gonna get warm at this rate.....

Might have to let someone play through in a minute if you can't decide on your 'shot' :rofl:

 

[One Planer]

still invisible............I'll share my secret elsewhere......muhahaha

Not the best picture as you cant see the ball

 

[JustOne]

Would anyone like to pick a beer?

(and see if they can hit the perfect golf shot)

 

[Foxholer]

I'm trying to understand why I keep hitting a pull. Last night was a prime exampe. When I get slow with my hips, I can 'feel' my shoulders swing across the ball sending it left.

I dont curve the ball in the air much at all. Very rarely hit a slice or a hook, but have a tendancy to block and pull (... In straight lines). What I have found is that when I make a concious effort to rotate my hips so that they are through the shot before impact, I hit exactly the shot I'm after (A ball that travels arrow straght to the peak of it's flight, then falls to the right on its way down. A 5-10 yard fade max)

Well, I think you may have already worked out the cause and correction. Did you need to understand impact and posture to do that? Perhaps a little bit, but that feeling is enough.

Doesn't mean that understanding impact and posture isn't good thing though. And you may be compensating for an earlier issue, but who cares on that one.

To have a swing that repeats more frequently minimising my bad shot (pull). Effectivley taking the left side of the course out of play.
The fundimental thing I want to change is the club face in relation to the path and resulting shot shape (... As described above)

I think you may have 'fundamental' and 'immediate' goals around the wrong way.
What you describe as fundamental is merely the adjustment to achieve the true fundamental goal.

Seems to me that you already know enough about posture and impact. All you need to do now is get them in sync.

Your metrics are sound. The one proviso I do have is I am willing to lose distance in order to achieve my goal.

Yeah. That's why I described them as a 'set'

The S&T guys have described a different set of 'fundamentals' that are undeniably sound.

My purpose in asking the 'why' was really to get to the real question. If you ask 'why' often enough the real question/fault emerges!

Just keep that thought of getting the hips cleared before impact. Of course, when you start to block and slice it......

 

[One Planer]

Ok, let me phrase it a different way.

If I make an aggressive move with my shoulders/arms in the downswing, should I make an equally agressive movement with my hips?

Just to keep everything in sync?

 

[Foxholer]

Ok Foxy (humour me, should be easy!! ) ..... here's 10 impact conditions.... ONE of which is a perfect golf shot......

Pick one... any number...

What are you trying to achieve James?

Is this another dodgy analogy?

Until I know where your Cab is headed, I'm not getting in!

 

[JustOne]

Until I know where your Cab is headed, I'm not getting in!

Indeed, until you know which beer you're going to choose (destination or IMPACT) you can't reach out your arm (backswing) to pick up the beer (downswing).

You could randomly pick one of course by just reaching out and seeing what you get (hit and hope!), you could reach out to number 10 (which is a hook because your arm went out to the right too much)..... you could pick number 2 (but that's a fade because your arm went too far left on the screen).....

OR

I could tell you that the perfect bottle (destination or IMPACT) is bottle number 4... in which case you could reach your arm towards it (downswing) EVERY SINGLE TIME.



I thank you. Feel free to argue that.


nb: Picking one at random (just making a swing) or picking one FAST isn't going to change the fact that you don't know where 'impact' is.

nnb: This beer one is much better than the taxi one!

 

[Foxholer]

Indeed, until you know which beer you're going to choose (destination or IMPACT) you can't reach out your arm (backswing) to pick up the beer (downswing).

You could randomly pick one of course by just reaching out and seeing what you get (hit and hope!), you could reach out to number 10 (which is a hook because your arm went out to the right too much)..... you could pick number 2 (but that's a fade because your arm went too far left on the screen).....

OR

I could tell you that the perfect bottle (destination or IMPACT) is bottle number 4... in which case you could reach your arm towards it (downswing) EVERY SINGLE TIME.



I thank you. Feel free to argue that.


nb: Picking one at random (just making a swing) or picking one FAST isn't going to change the fact that you don't know where 'impact' is.

nnb: This beer one is much better than the taxi one!

I was right

Absolutely rubbish analogy. So much wrong with it.

You do yourself a dis-service with them.

 

[JustOne]

I was right

Absolutely rubbish analogy. So much wrong with it.

You do yourself a dis-service with them.

Very good from the man who needs LAG explaining to him.



I'll back out so you can fix Gareth's swing for him...

Just keep that thought of getting the hips cleared before impact. Of course, when you start to block and slice it......

:rofl:

 

[chrisd]

I'm confused!

Is it a Hackney Black Cab or one of those rogue mini cab drivers?

 

[Foxholer]

I'm confused!

Is it a Hackney Black Cab or one of those rogue mini cab drivers?

Driver or iron swing?

There's plenty of use for the Cab analogy. Whether it's worth taking short-cuts for example.

Rogue ones must be the unqualified ones - that charge of course!

 

[SocketRocket]

Gareth.

To the point of boring you by repeating this stuff. You probably pull the ball as your rotation slows and your arms and hands flip through.

Remember my post about skipping the pebble across the lake and throwing the golf club down the fairway? Our bodies have been programmed to carry out these actions over history, they needed to so we could throw stones, spears and things with maximum power and without harming ourselves. Just do it, or skim an imaginary pebble over an imaginary lake and notice how your hips and arms don't need to be educated to do this in the most efficient manner. For some reason if it's Golf then it has to become more complicated

[video=youtube;qwMkxR2Iem0]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qwMkxR2Iem0[/video]

 

[Foxholer]

Remember my post about skipping the pebble across the lake and throwing the golf club down the fairway? Our bodies have been programmed to carry out these actions over history, they needed to so we could throw stones, spears and things with maximum power and without harming ourselves. Just do it, or skim an imaginary pebble over an imaginary lake and notice how your hips and arms don't need to be educated to do this in the most efficient manner. For some reason if it's Golf then it has to become more complicated

I don't believe it's just Golf. It's any activity where the object is not directly linked to the body. So Tennis, Cricket, Hockey, Baseball, Billiards/Snooker etc. Golf is just the one that has the least tolerance for error - the stationary ball doesn't really come into it except in the head.

 

[SocketRocket]

My post was to explain to Gareth that his pulls were probably created by his rotation stalling and his hands flipping through. The throwing analogy was to demonstrate the rotation relationship between the hips,torso and arms.

 

[SocketRocket]

I don't believe it's just Golf. It's any activity where the object is not directly linked to the body. So Tennis, Cricket, Hockey, Baseball, Billiards/Snooker etc. Golf is just the one that has the least tolerance for error - the stationary ball doesn't really come into it except in the head.

I think we can get the kinetic sequencing messed up when our focus is too much at the ball instead of through the ball to the target. If we are requesting our brains to make suitable motion that allows us to strike the ball then it sees no reason for the hips and torso to rotate past it, or the arms to release forwards. Whereby if the request is to drive the ball downwards/forwards then we will naturally continue our turn.