Impact position - 2 part question.

[One Planer]

Have a look at these:

The one thing I notice about all these different swings is the position of the hips in relation to he hands at impact.

The hips have cleared and the arms and hands are in good position(s)

2 questons for the forum knowledgeable.

1. Can you rotate your hips too quickly?

2. Can you have to much arm speed in the downswing?

My reason for the question. I can only attain a similar impact position to the above if I rotate my hips through hard from the top, allowing my hips to clear and my arms to follow.

My bad shot (pull) comes when I get lazy wqith my hips and try and swing down, with my arms/shoulders, from the top and follow my hips in sync and my hands stay in front of my hips, or at least thats how it feels.

I had a very interesting converstaion with James last night, via PM, which cleared a few things up, but this I'm still a little hazy on.

Any help/thoughts appreciated :thup:

 

[virtuocity]

Good questions Gareth.

 

[JustOne]

Keep things simple.... just swing back and thru :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


(thought I might as well get that out of the way) :clap:

 

[One Planer]

Keep things simple.... just swing back and thru :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


(thought I might as well get that out of the way) :clap:

Thanks for that :thup:









Can I also have the techncal option please

 

[CMAC]

how close are you to the ball Gareth? .....no jokes pls

 

[JustOne]

Yeh, the technical part is that you won't achieve those impact positions above because your shoulders are too closed and your right shoulder is too high so you'll never be able to get your hands forwards of the ball (they all have their right shoulder down which is WHY their left hip clears)

But the answer to the questions are
1) Yes... and No.
2) No... and Yes.

 

[garyinderry]

hips too fast is called hips spinning out!

i think i may do this.

 

[Robobum]

Keep things simple.... just swing back and thru :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:


(thought I might as well get that out of the way) :clap:

That's a really sad post.

Chocolate - very apt.

 

[JustOne]

As I said in the PM, if your hips clear too fast (and you can't keep up with your arm swing) then you're going to leave your arms training miles behind and 'stuck' behind you. You CAN go fast (just look at Rory's hips) but the rest of you must be able to keep up.... and if your backswing puts the club too far behind you then you never will be able to.

Arm speed, is similar... you can't just swing your arms uber fast if your lower body can't get out of the way, but there's golfers who get 150mph club head speed (long drive guys) so they prove that you CAN swing your arms as fast as possible.

(I'm going to see if I can make a couple of pics for you in a bit) :thup:

 

[One Planer]

As I said in the PM, if your hips clear too fast (and you can't keep up with your arm swing) then you're going to leave your arms training miles behind and 'stuck' behind you. You CAN go fast (just look at Rory's hips) but the rest of you must be able to keep up.... and if your backswing puts the club too far behind you then you never will be able to.

Arm speed, is similar... you can't just swing your arms uber fast if your lower body can't get out of the way, but there's golfers who get 150mph club head speed (long drive guys) so they prove that you CAN swing your arms as fast as possible.

(I'm going to see if I can make a couple of pics for you in a bit) :thup:

Think this is my problem.

Because I have a lazy hip turn, my arms out race my lower half.

I know when I make a concious effort to clear my hips, I hit my best shots.

 

[JustOne]

Think this is my problem.

Because I have a lazy hip turn, my arms out race my lower half.

I know when I make a concious effort to clear my hips, I hit my best shots.

I see it the other way around, you can't clear your hips because you're too busy early extending (pushing them forwards) and getting the club too much behind you. You need to fix the early extension so that you CAN clear your hips properly... and to do that you need to understand posture and impact. It's nothing to do with a 'lazy hip turn' as you put it....

In person it's almost a doddle to fix... (although a proper swing would feel completely alien to you!), over the web (in writing) it's a lot harder.

 

[One Planer]

I see it the other way around, you can't clear your hips because you're too busy early extending (pushing them forwards) and getting the club too much behind you. You need to fix the early extension so that you CAN clear your hips properly... and to do that you need to understand posture and impact. It's nothing to do with a 'lazy hip turn' as you put it....

In person it's almost a doddle to fix... (although a proper swing would feel completely alien to you!), over the web (in writing) it's a lot harder.

Which brings me nicely round to a previous thread of nine.

http://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/showthread.php?59608-Turn-vs-Slide

 

[Foxholer]

You need to fix the early extension so that you CAN clear your hips properly

With you so far...

and to do that you need to understand posture and impact.

Not convinced about this bit - at least the word 'need'!

 

[JustOne]

'Need' because if you don't KNOW where your supposed to 'go' at impact it's like jumping in a cab without knowing your destination.

No different than the drill you're currently using Foxy, why weren't you just hitting down properly WITHOUT needing that drill?

 

[Foxholer]

'Need' because if you don't KNOW where your supposed to 'go' at impact it's like jumping in a cab without knowing your destination.

No different than the drill you're currently using Foxy, why weren't you just hitting down properly WITHOUT needing that drill?

Neither of those analogies help your argument. In fact, both work against it imo.

In the case of the Cab, the analogy is really about knowing my destination, but not the route. So I simply tell the Driver my destination and he gets me there - through his knowledge of the route, not mine. I'm satisfied when the result, my arrival, is achieved. If I was interested in the route, I might take note. But I could just as easily sleep all the way there! The result would be the same.

In the case of my drill, I understand no more about posture and impact because of the drill. I know I am hitting it better - by the results. I didn't need to understand why I wasn't hitting down properly, just that I wasn't. So I have improved without the need to understand impact and posture!

I'm not arguing that understanding posture and impact might be helpful. Just the necessity to understand it.

 

[CMAC]

miss my Q Gareth?

 

[JustOne]

In the case of the Cab, the analogy is really about knowing my destination, but not the route.

No, you don't know your destination.. and therefore the route doesn't matter either (swing the club around the back of your legs if you want).

Your drill only helps because you didn't know where you were going in the first place, you still don't, but at least the cab driver knows the rough vicinity. A good cabbie would tell you the route on the way so you could find your own way there in future

 

[Foxholer]

No, you don't know your destination.. and therefore the route doesn't matter either (swing the club around the back of your legs if you want).

Your drill only helps because you didn't know where you were going in the first place, you still don't, but at least the cab driver knows the rough vicinity. A good cabbie would tell you the route on the way so you could find your own way there in future

Wrong.

I know my destination. I want to hit the ball further and/or straighter and/or better. Your analogy is simply wrong - equivalent to saying 'teach me something - it doesn't even need to be golf'!

And, continuing the analogy, a good cabbie might explain why he/she was taking a certain route - because of jams at key point (equivalent to my lack of flexibility) - but I don't think they'd last long as a cabbie if they took folk through the route before they started the journey. And a good cabbie might tell me the route if I asked him to, he wouldn't do it as a matter of course!

 

[JustOne]

Wrong.

I know my destination. I want to hit the ball further and/or straighter and/or better. Your analogy is simply wrong - equivalent to saying 'teach me something - it doesn't even need to be golf'!

Hitting the ball further isn't a destination in the swing model, neither would be driving your car faster. You could tell the cabbie to go faster but it won't help if he doesn't know where he's going, or the route to get there, or whatever other spin you want to put on it.

Gareth needs to learn WHERE he has to be at impact... then achieve that. Not the other way round, or any other way you can think of.

 

[Foxholer]

Hitting the ball further isn't a destination in the swing model, neither would be driving your car faster. You could tell the cabbie to go faster but it won't help if he doesn't know where he's going, or the route to get there, or whatever other spin you want to put on it.

Gareth needs to learn WHERE he has to be at impact... then achieve that. Not the other way round, or any other way you can think of.

Ah. Now that's rather different to 'understand posture and impact'.

The 'understand posture and impact' is merely how/what you think is the best way to get him there - which is thoroughly reasonable, but, I would argue it's not essential.

Gareth. Apologies about the thread-jack.

What exactly what are you trying to achieve? And why? - and there may be another 'why?' or 2 to come as well. In other words, what is the fundamental thing you are trying to achieve?

And how will you measure 'success'?

I'm pretty sure hitting the ball further, better and more consistently, would be an appropriate set of metrics - for me at least.

In answer to your question in the OP, I believe the answer to both questions is 'Yes'. But in a 'good' swing they are in sync - whether that is Rory's rocket or the apparent snails of Ernie's.