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OK....tell me why you think Tiger is the GOAT then.
If Jack Nicklaus had only won..........
- Thread starter bobmac
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OK....tell me why you think Tiger is the GOAT then.
Kellfire
Blackballed
Read the thread. Dominated to such a degree in an era of higher quality and deeper fields.
It is a never ending discussion. Same as Pele, Maradona, Messi or Ronaldo. If players are from different eras then no discussion can ever be absolute.
Kellfire
Blackballed
George Best...
You see, on and on it goes...………..
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So you didn't read the link I posted then?
Orikoru
Tour Winner
That link was a bit of nonsense to be fair. Points 1, 2, 7 & 11 can be answered by Kellfire's reasoning above, points 3, 5 & 8 are irrelevant rubbish, point 4 is just a massaging of stats in Jack's favour, point 6 was literally just speculation & opinion of the writer, point 9 doesn't seem relevant, and point 10 he even says himself was likely just a platitude that anyone would have said.
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I agree with you on 3, 5, 6, 8 and 10 but the rest are factual and Kellfire's argument doesn't hold up against those facts. I have no idea how old he is but I suspect he got into golf during the Tiger era and knows very little about golf before then.
D
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Can you please list the players that make it a higher quality and deeper field from 99 to 08 when Woods was winning his majors please
Kellfire
Blackballed
Nope. I don’t care enough to make an argument that won’t be given serious time anyway. I don’t believe for one second that you really believe the average touring pro was of a higher standard in Jack’s pomp than Tiger’s so I really can’t be bothered giving it anymore air time on this occasion. But don’t worry, we’ll get other chances when Tiger does well again. Which I think he will.
D
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It’s been given plenty serious time
You are making some claims , others are making counter claims and providing the list of players who were around during 3 decades Nicklaus was challenging
You claim there was a higher quality of field during Woods time so will be interesting to see who you think these players are , it maybe would add some credibility to the claim and make people think a bit more
I can recall a few of players who won majors during the years Woods was challenging so be interesting to know your thoughts, unless of course you didn’t follow golf back then
IanM
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I am sure I remember an interview with Tiger a few years back, (Will try and find it!) where he said beating 18 Majors was what drove him on! So we know that he thinks!
But I dont remember Jack saying how lucky he was to play in an era where there were so few decent players!
ps - meant tongue in cheek............ comparing eras is always fun and blooming difficult!
So we know that he thinks! But I dont remember Jack saying how lucky he was to play in an era where there were so few decent players!
ps - meant tongue in cheek............ comparing eras is always fun and blooming difficult!
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I think Jack certainly played against more of the legends of the game. Whether he really competed with all of them for a sustained period of time is a little more debatable. His win in 86 elongated the timespan people use. Imo his dominance ended in 1980. An 18 year winning period, twice as long as Woods so it stands to reason that more names will be in that period. But also, there a lots of one win wonders there too (a stick used against woods).
For me, Palmer was at the end of his career whilst Jack started to excel. Imo, the greats he truly overlapped with were Player, Trevino and Watson. Players such as Faldo, Seve and Woosnam were outliers of that time.
my point being, if woods does manage to win one more time. Then all of a sudden, players like Spieth, DJ, Justin Thomas and Rory have to be added to the players that Tiger competed against and in the future all of those could be held in very high regard.
Grant85
Head Pro
With the Tiger v Jack debate kinda bubbling under...
Jack won more majors and also finished second in a LOT of majors. But he didn't tend to play as an aggressive game as Tiger did when he was dominant and I guess was not as popular a sportsman as Tiger was in the early 2000's.
At the moment, I think it is unlikely Tiger will beat or exceed Jack's 18 majors. I've thought that for quite a while and still think it. Tiger had a great chance on Sunday but not only did he not win, the guy who was playing with him and looking him in the eye all day did.
Can Tiger win more majors? Absolutely, and in a strange way Sunday proved that he could. But he has to win them a different way. He will probably not be as much of a front runner any more. He isn't really more powerful than many other guys out there and obviously all facets of his game are not as good as they were when he was the dominant player. Also, most other players are better now than they were at the turn of the century. But Tigers game is probably still good enough to get the job done in the right week.
He probably only has to improve slightly and he will be pretty close. Especially driving and putting.
But right now, he is probably a top 25 player meaning there are quite a few guys better than him. He doesn't have the intimidation factor and other players may actually be inspired to play better when he is challenging.
I'm surprised he's not playing a bit more often as well. It would be interesting to know if his health is limiting his practice, compared with how he would have practiced back in the day.
Jack won more majors and also finished second in a LOT of majors. But he didn't tend to play as an aggressive game as Tiger did when he was dominant and I guess was not as popular a sportsman as Tiger was in the early 2000's.
At the moment, I think it is unlikely Tiger will beat or exceed Jack's 18 majors. I've thought that for quite a while and still think it. Tiger had a great chance on Sunday but not only did he not win, the guy who was playing with him and looking him in the eye all day did.
Can Tiger win more majors? Absolutely, and in a strange way Sunday proved that he could. But he has to win them a different way. He will probably not be as much of a front runner any more. He isn't really more powerful than many other guys out there and obviously all facets of his game are not as good as they were when he was the dominant player. Also, most other players are better now than they were at the turn of the century. But Tigers game is probably still good enough to get the job done in the right week.
He probably only has to improve slightly and he will be pretty close. Especially driving and putting.
But right now, he is probably a top 25 player meaning there are quite a few guys better than him. He doesn't have the intimidation factor and other players may actually be inspired to play better when he is challenging.
I'm surprised he's not playing a bit more often as well. It would be interesting to know if his health is limiting his practice, compared with how he would have practiced back in the day.
shortgame
Tour Rookie
Tiger was unbelievable. No doubt about it. BUT the field used to capitulate whenever he got close. He didn't face the same caliber of COMPETITOR - good players though Els, Monty, Vijay etc were they were not competitors/winners like Player, Palmer and co.
That capitulation isn't happening any more - witness Francesco on Sunday. 15 years ago the field would have bottled it and Woods would have won comfortably on Sunday.
Oh and don't forget the many many millions spent by Nike etc promoting Tiger, and the impact that's had on public opinion - how many times have we seen THAT clip at Augusta, ad nauseam
That capitulation isn't happening any more - witness Francesco on Sunday. 15 years ago the field would have bottled it and Woods would have won comfortably on Sunday.
Oh and don't forget the many many millions spent by Nike etc promoting Tiger, and the impact that's had on public opinion - how many times have we seen THAT clip at Augusta, ad nauseam
Kellfire
Blackballed
Love when people say “Player, Palmer and co†or words to that ilk. My point proven.
D
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https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.usatoday.com/amp/2083049
:thup:
Woods says that Nicklaus was the best - that wins
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Not sure what you mean by this?
shortgame
Tour Rookie
Kellfire
Blackballed
“And co†= no one else was that great.
