you don't like it then???
Foresomes - Oh What Fun!
- Thread starter mikejohnchapman
- Start date
KenL
Tour Rookie
I really don't like foursomes.
rulefan
Tour Winner
The original - matchplay surely?
ScienceBoy
Money List Winner
Purest golf is 1v1 matchplay.
Stroke play is just a way to have a competition involving lots of people with multiple tee slots. It has many complications over just straight matchplay to allow it to happen.
rulefan
Tour Winner
Matchplay. The first reference to 'medal' play was in 1807. Over 60 years after the first Rules.
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Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
So you don't think that asymptomatic A touching an object with a hard surface and which is then handled by B -and C pose any realistic risk to either B or C.?
Bearing in mind that you are a medical chap, are we being told wrongly about this disease being transmitted by touching objects with the virus on them.?
Because either we can pick it up by touching such objects, or it is not going to happen, or an extremely unlikely thing to happen.
You are clearly saying the latter scenario. Yet, we are told for some long time now, that colds etc are mostly caused by touching objects with the virus on them.
chrisd
Major Champion
Nothing worse than a game where you hit someone else's ball ??
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
Why must it be? Because you want it to be?
Do you shake hands? Why not?
Straight out questions - Do you think the virus transfers from human to object and from object to human by touch?
Does the virus live longest on hard surfaces?
We've been told as a nation that the answer is yes.
What do you believe?
Ethan
Money List Winner
Outside is the key part. Social distancing and masks are much more important indoors. The virus survives for variable periods on different sorts of surfaces, but dies much faster outdoors. It is probably sensible to avoid close contact for prolonged periods, but the risk of passing someone on a pavement is minimal unless they sneeze in your face as you pass. Even then, it is highly unlikely a random person has the virus, <!% almost everywhere and a lot less in some places.
mikejohnchapman
Challenge Tour Pro
Well we played and despite it feeling a little strange it worked remarkably well.
Only query related to whether using hand gel to clean a ball was legal or not.
Only query related to whether using hand gel to clean a ball was legal or not.
Swinglowandslow
Well-known member
You haven't answered the questions though. I know and agree about "close contact " etc. I'm not talking about airborne droplets way of passing on the virus, and neither is Mike Chapman. This discussion is about touching objects which may carry the virus.
For someone castigating government for Covid cases, your last sentence is somewhat puzzling. You are saying it is hardly a risk at all?
backwoodsman
Tour Winner
I think you miss the point.
Of course if Person A is infected, but asymptomatic, and touches something, then there is risk of them leaving virus particles behind. And there is a risk of person B touching the same thing and picking up the virus. But, the chances of person A actually being infected in the first place is pretty low. So the chance of there being virus particles left behind is pretty low. And the chance of person B touching the very same spot is also low. And if person B is taking appropriate precautions, even if they have touched a viral source, they may not actually become infected or become a carrier. Multiply two or more low risks and you get an even lower risk. Yes there is risk of virus being transferred by touching objects. But unless the objects are being touched very frequently by lots of people, the actual risk of viral transfer is pretty small. Or infinitessinal to use a word ...
chrisd
Major Champion
My regular playing friend is a doctor and reckons the chance of catching Covid from a ball is so small we should not be in the least worried
Ethan
Money List Winner
My last sentence is a statement of the bleeding obvious. You can only catch the virus if it is in the environment. In areas of low prevalence, your chance of meeting someone that has the virus is low. It ain't rocket science.
As for me castigating the Govt, there are some 60,000 examples of where their policy has been disastrous. The fact that right now, the risk to the average person from a brief or chance encounter with another person who isn't obviously coughing stuff, or their golf ball, is low does not forgive those mistakes.
Droplet transmission is a probability game. You can never say there won't be a rogue droplet intent on your annihilation around, but the more of outdoors, masked and social distanced you are, the lower your risk, and in areas of low prevalence, that is pretty low.
evemccc
Well-known member
IMO half-right
Individual Match-Play is the best and purest form of the game
Strategy is at an absolute premium: playing the course’s defence, your own strengths + weaknesses, and most importantly, you’re playing your opponent and responding / attacking him or her
Doon frae Troon
Ryder Cup Winner
Totally agree with Kaz and Patricks that Scratch foursomes is the purest form of golf.
4BBB like Scrambles etc is just an ego stroking means to allow poor/average/high handicap payers to look better than the actually are.
Some may only need to hit two or three decent shots per round to finish on a winning team.
There is no hiding place in scratch foursomes every shot is a pressure shot. More pressure than singles as any decent player will know.
Play a poor shot in singles and you only let yourself down, play a poor shot in scratch foursomes and you let yourself AND your partner down.
4BBB like Scrambles etc is just an ego stroking means to allow poor/average/high handicap payers to look better than the actually are.
Some may only need to hit two or three decent shots per round to finish on a winning team.
There is no hiding place in scratch foursomes every shot is a pressure shot. More pressure than singles as any decent player will know.
Play a poor shot in singles and you only let yourself down, play a poor shot in scratch foursomes and you let yourself AND your partner down.
Colin L
Tour Winner
Could any of you who is talking about the purest form of golf please clarify what you mean by pure in the context of playing golf?
Judging by the language I have heard on golf courses there's nothing very pure about any of it.
Judging by the language I have heard on golf courses there's nothing very pure about any of it.
evemccc
Well-known member
Don’t know about anyone else, but what I mean is by ‘purest form’ is that Match-Play is only about beating your opponent. Where to hit, what club to use, whether to be aggressive or defensive, is based on only beating your opponent.
Golf (like running) allows individuals to improve their handicap / PB run times, but in essence, the whole point of competing is to try to beat their rival. No runner really cares what time an Olympic Marathon race is run in, but they care if they win or not. Their time will be partly based on their ability / conditions of the day of course, but also by their strategy.
The same for golf. No one cared how many birdies were sunk in the Miracle of Medinah, but that the Europeans were winning
The point of sport is to defeat your opponent in fair competition. Running PBs and improving your best score / handicap is just a way to mark self-improvement, but it’s not the purest form of sport
rulie
Head Pro
And match play was the original form of the game - one against one. I recall Scottish friends saying, 'the odd and the even" when talking about strokes taken - they may not have known the total number of strokes taken by either, but they knew how they stood versus their opponent.
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Swango1980
Well-known member
Not sure how you define purest, but surely it should be related to the form of the game that most closely resembles the origin of golf, before it was diluted by other factors. It is my understanding Match Play was the original format of golf, and therefore could be defined as the "purest"
It appears some on here define "purest" as most difficult, but I can't see them being the same. Otherwise I could invent another format, medal play, in which your fellow competitors are allowed to throw eggs at you during your downswing. That would be tricky, but I doubt I'd call it a purer form of the game.
Your perception of Scrambles is a little harsh. They are just a fun format of golf that take the pressure off somewhat. And, I don't think anyone is describing them as the "purest" form anyway. Not sure how it makes high handicappers better than they actually are!? If it is a team of high handicappers, in my experience they have virtually zero chance against a team of low handicappers (based on the usual handicap adjustments). Whereas, if you are talking about a high handicapper in a team of low handicappers. Then, yes, they may well end up in a winning team with a fantastic score. But, if they have only had to his 2/3 decent/safe shots in the round, I can imagine they would actually walk off thinking they've barely contributed at all, to the detriment of their ego. I guess there is nothing more demoralising for a high handicapper, who after their partners play their second shot on a long par 4 or par 5, decide there is no point at all at hitting their own effort, as they've zero chance in even reaching the green that the lower handicapper has just hit.
