First handicap and supplementary scores

[lawler]

Hello all,

I have very recently returned to golf and joined a club as a full member after not playing for around 18 years as a junior.

I have submitted 3 cards for handicap purposes and it is fair to say the scores were less than impressive as I am just getting back into the game - my last round was 'iron only' after a lesson with the pro where he completely changed my grip. I am now becoming more consistent but just lack distance without using a driver - something I am now working on.

I have been told by the pro at the club that after the 3 cards submitted, I have obtained a 34 handicap and I should feel free to continue to put cards in at my leisure, marking them as ‘supplementary’ as I need to reduce my handicap to 28 so I can play at any time.

Can someone please explain how long it would take me to reduce my handicap to 28? For example could this be done off one or two more supplementary cards submitted if I achieved a score of 28 or would there be a minimum number where an average would be taken?

Also now I have been given this handicap of 34, is this an official CONGU handicap that I can register with through the 'howdidido' online system? If so does anyone know usually how long this takes to view as my name is still not showing as having an entry by the club despite being told my handicap is 34?

I do feel that I maybe approached the submission of cards before I had the opportunity to get my game in order but now just want to work towards reducing my handicap so I can start playing in competitions and improve my game.

Many thanks for any help!

 

[backwoodsman]

First thing is that your handicap of 34 is an official handicap - but it is only valid within your club and your club competitions. It isn't a 'competition status' handicap that can be used elsewhere. Yes, your handicap should show on howdidido (if that is where your club posts them). Don't know how long it takes to show up on there- but i gather it takes a little while to show at first?

You can get it down by putting in more supplementary cards, or by entering club competitions. If you are getting back into the swing of things, and are improving, then a category 5 handicap (ie above 28) should come down quite quickly. Easiest way to work it out is convert your score to stableford points. Assuming the par for the course and the standard scratch score are equal, then "playing to handicap" is scoring 36 points. For every point you score over 36 your handicap will be cut by 0.5. You could be down to 28 after just two or three very "good" rounds. But realistically, probably wise to allow for a few more.

Averages don't come into it. Now you have a handicap, reductions are based on how much better than handicap you play in any given game.

Remember that for supplementary cards, your club will (or should) have a system by where you have to register the fact (before you go out to play) that you are going to put a card in. You can't just play then decide to submit the card because you had a good day.

 

[Kellfire]

Is there no allowance for you to play competitions with a handicap of 28 for the sake of the competition, but with any adjustments being made to the 34?

 

[rulefan]

As at today, a handicap of 34 (for men) is a CONGU Club Handicap. From 1 Jan 2018 it will be a fully fledged CONGU Handicap.

If you submit Supplementary Scores before Jan 1, your handicap will come down by 0.5 for each of the first 6 strokes below the course SSS and 1.0 for each additional stroke below.
After Jan 1, your handicap will come down by 0.5 for each stroke below the course SSS.

There is no change if you are in your buffer zone (ie within 5 of the SSS). And will go up a flat 0.1 if you are outside your buffer zone.

As you have a new handicap, your handicap committee should be keeping a close eye on your scoring record and if you perform better than your initial handicap suggests, they may make any further adjustment they feel necessary.


After Jan 1, your club should permit you to play in all handicap qualifying competitions but they may still limit prizes to certain limits.
Historically, many competitions have a limit of 18 or 24 to qualify for a prize or to go forward into a knockout. However this limit is only used for the prize or elimination. Handicap calculations and adjustments are based on the full handicaps of all players.

 

[lawler]

Thanks everyone for your advice so far - much appreciated!

On the course I play off the yellow Tees which give a par of 70 and sss of 69.

My understanding then is I am not limited in the amount of cards I submit now until I get to a handicap of 28 or less as long as I keep marking them as supplementary.

To obtain at least a 28 handicap, I therefore need to reduce my handicap by 6 strokes.

Practically how does this work? I note the comment above about reductions by 0.5 and 1.0 based on score but how quickly could this happen?

For example, say I go round the course tomorrow and it takes 100 strokes. If I then subtract my allocated handicap of 34, this leaves a net score of 66 (which is 3 under the sss) - would this result in a reduction and by how much?

I do want to do this properly and not rush my game but I just want to know the parameters and work I need to do to get my score down to 28 as quickly as possible.

Thanks again for any help.

 

[chellie]

Would you be able to submit Supp cards at this time of year at your course? We can't due to the winter works they do on it.

This may help http://www.englandgolf.org/page.aspx?sitesectionid=340

 

[duncan mackie]

The most relevant comments far, by Rulefan, was

As you have a new handicap, your handicap committee should be keeping a close eye on your scoring record and if you perform better than your initial handicap suggests, they may make any further adjustment they feel necessary.
Read more at http://forums.golf-monthly.co.uk/sh...-and-supplementary-scores#kISafTvfJy74wCKZ.99

The handicap committee have a responsibility to monitor initial allocations.

You need to sign into the supplemental card book before you head out, and return your card when you return. You could get 28, or better, from just one card if it's the right card in the first few weeks after an allocation!

Good luck.

 

[rulefan]

First, for any hole where you recorded more than a net double bogey, you must reduce that score to net double bogey. If that is the case it will reduce your 100 to something lower.
eg. you score 10 on a par 4, Stroke index 2. You will get two strokes there, so your net score is 8. But net double bogey is 6, so your effective score is 6.
Your 100 is now 96.
So 96- 34 = 62. SSS = 69. Net differential = - 7.

So from the figures in my post above: 6 x 0.5 and 1 x 0.6 = 3.6
Your new exact handicap is 34.0 - 3.5 = 31.5. Playing handicap 32

I hope my math is correct

 

[backwoodsman]

First, for any hole where you recorded more than a net double bogey, you must reduce that score to net double bogey. If that is the case it will reduce your 100 to something lower.
eg. you score 10 on a par 4, Stroke index 2. You will get two strokes there, so your net score is 8. But net double bogey is 6, so your effective score is 6.
Your 100 is now 96.
So 96- 34 = 62. SSS = 69. Net differential = - 7.

So from the figures in my post above: 6 x 0.5 and 1 x 0.6 = 3.6
Your new exact handicap is 34.0 - 3.5 = 31.5. Playing handicap 32

I hope my math is correct

Your maths is correct - but your typing isn't

I make it 34.0 - 3.6 = 31.4 Playing handicap 31

 

[rosecott]

Thanks everyone for your advice so far - much appreciated!

On the course I play off the yellow Tees which give a par of 70 and sss of 69.

My understanding then is I am not limited in the amount of cards I submit now until I get to a handicap of 28 or less as long as I keep marking them as supplementary.

To obtain at least a 28 handicap, I therefore need to reduce my handicap by 6 strokes.

Practically how does this work? I note the comment above about reductions by 0.5 and 1.0 based on score but how quickly could this happen?

For example, say I go round the course tomorrow and it takes 100 strokes. If I then subtract my allocated handicap of 34, this leaves a net score of 66 (which is 3 under the sss) - would this result in a reduction and by how much?

I do want to do this properly and not rush my game but I just want to know the parameters and work I need to do to get my score down to 28 as quickly as possible.

Thanks again for any help.

Although there is no annual limit for Supplementaries for players with Club Handicaps, there may well be a limit of no more than one per week. The CONGU manual is a little unclear on this as it says:

21.5 Unless the Affiliated Club decides otherwise, a Member is limited to the return of one
Supplementary Score per week. For the purposes of this clause a week is defined as
Monday to Sunday.

It does not say that this restriction does not apply to Club Handicaps so we have to assume that it does.

As an aside I processed 3 Supplementaries for a player recently so that he could have his "c" status next year. The software would not allow one of the cards as it was played in the same week as one of the others. There did not seem to be a way of over-riding this (as the clause above suggests a club can do), so I just asked him to submit another.

 

[rulefan]

Your maths is correct - but your typing isn't

I make it 34.0 - 3.6 = 31.4 Playing handicap 31

Oops

 

[lawler]

First, for any hole where you recorded more than a net double bogey, you must reduce that score to net double bogey. If that is the case it will reduce your 100 to something lower.
eg. you score 10 on a par 4, Stroke index 2. You will get two strokes there, so your net score is 8. But net double bogey is 6, so your effective score is 6.
Your 100 is now 96.
So 96- 34 = 62. SSS = 69. Net differential = - 7.

So from the figures in my post above: 6 x 0.5 and 1 x 0.6 = 3.6
Your new exact handicap is 34.0 - 3.5 = 31.5. Playing handicap 32

I hope my math is correct

Thanks this is very helpful!

So just to put this into practice, I have set out below a fictitious round to try and get my head around this:

*Yellow Tees - PAR 70 /SSS 69* *HANDICAP - 34*
[TABLE="width: 500"]
[TR]
[TD]HOLE[/TD]
[TD]PAR[/TD]
[TD]STROKE INDEX [/TD]
[TD]GROSS SCORE [/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]15[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]13[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]1[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]7[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]11[/TD]
[TD]9[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]7[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]9[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]17[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]11[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]16[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[TD]8[/TD]
[TD]8[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]13[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]2[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]14[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]15[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]12[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]16[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]6[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]17[/TD]
[TD]4[/TD]
[TD]10[/TD]
[TD]5[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]18[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[TD]18[/TD]
[TD]3[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

GROSS TOTAL 94
(MINUS HANDICAP) 34

NET SCORE 60

(9 STROKES UNDER SSS OF 69)

Questions:

1. Is this worked out correctly?

2. Based on this round, what could I expect my handicap to change to from 34 and could this be done from just one card on this round or require further cards to be submitted?

3. How does the 'Clause 19' - Net Double Bogey Adjustment affect this (if at all)?

4. I have not factored in the stroke index into this calculation. This is because I am not sure if this would be used for handicap purposes or just for when playing with others to level the playing abilities out?

5. Would the CSS be used or am I correct to use the SSS if it is just for the purposes of a supplementary card outside any competitors with the intention of trying to get my handicap down (although I recognise it could also increase)?

I apologise for the basic way this is set out. It just helps me properly understand how this works in practice and what kind of game I need to work towards to get my handicap down to 28 or better!

 

[Colin L]

The Nett Double Bogey adjustment does affect the calculation of a handicap adjustment. If your nett score at a hole is too high, it is reduced to a nett double bogey e.g. a nett 8 at a par 4 is reduced to 6. Or to put it another way, it is reduced to the lowest score at which you do not gain a stableford point. To work that out, you do need the stroke index. There are, however, no adjustments to be made to this score.

You are receiving 34 strokes which means 2 strokes a hole except for SI 17 and 18. For example, your gross 9 at the 7th may seem high, but with 2 strokes off it's a nett 7, which is a nett double bogey. Any gross score above that 9 would be reduced to 7.

If you are completing a card for handicap within a competition, your score is not counted towards the CSS and the SSS is used for your calculation.

That card would reduce your handicap to 28.
First 6 strokes at 0.5 reduction per stroke = -3 which takes you to 31
Next 3 strokes at 1.0 reduction per stroke = -3 which takes you to 28 and competition status.

 

[rulefan]

first, for any hole where you recorded more than a net double bogey, you must reduce that score to net double bogey. If that is the case it will reduce your 100 to something lower.
Eg. You score 10 on a par 4, stroke index 2. You will get two strokes there, so your net score is 8. But net double bogey is 6, so your effective score is 6.
Your 100 is now 96.
So 96- 34 = 62. Sss = 69. Net differential = - 7.

So from the figures in my post above: 6 x 0.5 and 1 x 1.0 = 4.0
your new exact handicap is 34.0 - 4.0 = 30.0 playing handicap30

correction in red

 

[backwoodsman]

correction in red

So ....
Turns out your typing and your maths was wrong?

And l can't read ...

 

[lawler]

The Nett Double Bogey adjustment does affect the calculation of a handicap adjustment. If your nett score at a hole is too high, it is reduced to a nett double bogey e.g. a nett 8 at a par 4 is reduced to 6. Or to put it another way, it is reduced to the lowest score at which you do not gain a stableford point. To work that out, you do need the stroke index. There are, however, no adjustments to be made to this score.

You are receiving 34 strokes which means 2 strokes a hole except for SI 17 and 18. For example, your gross 9 at the 7th may seem high, but with 2 strokes off it's a nett 7, which is a nett double bogey. Any gross score above that 9 would be reduced to 7.

If you are completing a card for handicap within a competition, your score is not counted towards the CSS and the SSS is used for your calculation.

That card would reduce your handicap to 28.
First 6 strokes at 0.5 reduction per stroke = -3 which takes you to 31
Next 3 strokes at 1.0 reduction per stroke = -3 which takes you to 28 and competition status.

Really helpful thankyou.

I now think I am beginning to understand the use of nett double bogey and how this applies. So based on this, my understanding is that you add the stroke (or strokes) on to your gross score before calculating what the nett double bogey is?

I. E.

The first hole above is a par 4 with a stroke index 3. On my current handicap (34) I get 2 strokes towards this hole. If my gross score on this hole was 10, I would first take off the two strokes I am entitled to which brings the nett score down to 8 but as the nett double bogey (2 above 4) is 6 I would be awarded a score of 6?

The confusion I have is based on this example from the CONGU website, which effectively adds another stroke on:

"A competitor playing from a handicap of 15 returned a nett score of 70 in a Stroke Play QualifyingCompetition.

This equalled the CSS of the day. The scorecard, however, contained an 8 at the par 4,5th hole which was Stroke Index 6.

In this instance, therefore, the nett double bogey score was 7(4+2+1) resulting in the 8 being reduced to 7 (for handicap purposes) with consequent reduction innett score to 69 and a handicap reduction of 0.3.

Had the competitor made a ‘no score’ at the 5th hole rather than an 8 e.g. he lost a ball and did notput another into play, the effect, for handicap purposes would have been exactly the same i.e. a nettdouble bogey score of 7.By taking advantage of this clause and completing subsequent holes, competitors have theopportunity to return scores below their handicap or within their Buffer Zone even though they do nothave a competition score."

I understand now that I would get 2 strokes for each hole above (apart from 17 and 18 which would be one) but I just do not understand how this applies to the following example as it adds a stroke on.

Also are the reductions in the calculation given to the first 6 strokes (0.5) and latter 3 strokes (1.0) linked to the buffer zone I am currently in?

Apologies for dumbing this down so much...

 

[Colin L]

It's to me an odd way of expressing nett double bogey but it makes sense. The 3 numbers are the compoment parts of the nett double bogey:

4 = par for the hole
2 = a gross double bogey
1= your handicap stroke added on to make your nett double bogey - your "allowance" for that hole - a stroke more than the gross.

 

[lawler]

It's to me an odd way of expressing nett double bogey but it makes sense. The 3 numbers are the compoment parts of the nett double bogey:

4 = par for the hole
2 = a gross double bogey
1= your handicap stroke added on to make your nett double bogey - your "allowance" for that hole - a stroke more than the gross.

Thankyou this now makes sense. I suppose it is just a case of going down each individual shot after a game and looking at if any individual hole is more than a gross double bogey, whether you can recalculate this with any further relief based on your handicap that may increase the score to give a nett double bogey.

The best case scenario therefore is that the highest score you can get for a hole is a gross double bogey and then including any handicap relief which may increase it for a nett double bogey - although the nett double bogey may be the same as gross (as in my score card above that does not have any examples of an increase above gross double bogey).

Is the calculation on the 9 shots (6x0.5) + (3x1) therefore based on the buffer zone for the category I am currently in for handicap purposes?