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Brexit - The negotiations.

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Hacker Khan said:
Was just speaking to a colleague in Germany and fully appreciate that he in no way speaks for the whole of Germany or indeed Europe. But he said the mood is changing in the press over there to telling us to go and do one and leave without a deal if we start coming back with what they see as unreasonable demands (of course what is reasonable to one person will not be to another but there you go). He said they have much bigger issues to worry about now with getting economies back on their feet, and the mood is changing to 'calling our bluff'. And if we threaten to leave with no deal then they will let us do that a lot easily then they would have before the Covid stuff all kicked off. As they do not want to spend any more time on Brexit than the really have to.

Also interestingly he said Germany also has the same issues as us with regards to increasing numbers of people mostly ignoring the Covid restrictions and guidance now.
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I dont doubt the validity of your post or the source it came from but I struggle with understanding how putting tariffs on German made goods being sold to the UK, after the end of the year, is in any way going to help them get their economy "back on its feet". I've owned a few German cars but would not pay 10% more for the privilege of buying one in January 2021 than I'd pay in December 2020. Even a blind man can see that the EU negotiators are trying to stitch us up!
 
Hacker Khan said:
Was just speaking to a colleague in Germany and fully appreciate that he in no way speaks for the whole of Germany or indeed Europe. But he said the mood is changing in the press over there to telling us to go and do one and leave without a deal if we start coming back with what they see as unreasonable demands (of course what is reasonable to one person will not be to another but there you go). He said they have much bigger issues to worry about now with getting economies back on their feet, and the mood is changing to 'calling our bluff'. And if we threaten to leave with no deal then they will let us do that a lot easily then they would have before the Covid stuff all kicked off. As they do not want to spend any more time on Brexit than the really have to.

Also interestingly he said Germany also has the same issues as us with regards to increasing numbers of people mostly ignoring the Covid restrictions and guidance now.
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Fairly naïve way of thinking about things, brexit on WTO pus virus issues, only makes things worse. There is plenty of time and resources available to deal with both.

Hopefully the people negotiating have more sensible heads on.
 
Doon frae Troon said:
Toom Tabard has been used quite a lot recently in the Scottish press and media to describe a UK political leader, I shall let you guess who.:love:
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I cannot guess - and indeed I did not and do not know.

Fortunately for Scotland, Balliol was followed by Wallace and Bruce (amongst others) as guardians, and then in 1306 by King Robert I. So we learn from history that even in dark and leaderless times there is always hope...
 
Just seems to be another Mexican standoff between UK Govt and EU, see who blinks first. By definitively saying the UK will not extend the transition deadline Gove thinks that will force the EU's hand to give us an FTA double quick, meantime EU are still saying UK can extend the deadline even though we've now said we won't, they are probably thinking Johnson will weaken as the no deadline approaches and back down - not a great position for either side, bluffs and double bluffs, seen this over and over.
So clear that the UK Tory Govt has next to zero respect for any devolved administration, understand that - they were set up by Labour after all, so we get unconstructive point scoring and shenanigans (from all sides), devolution just doesn't really work unless the same parties are in power, hasn't been like that since 2008 for Scotland and 2010 for Wales......... and it shows.
Brexit remains as polarising as ever, politics always feels utterly frustrating, always negative.
Division and more division.
On top of the covid catastrophe.........plain Yuk.

Sorry for the moan, fed up.
 
maxfli65 said:
Just seems to be another Mexican standoff between UK Govt and EU, see who blinks first. By definitively saying the UK will not extend the transition deadline Gove thinks that will force the EU's hand to give us an FTA double quick, meantime EU are still saying UK can extend the deadline even though we've now said we won't, they are probably thinking Johnson will weaken as the no deadline approaches and back down - not a great position for either side, bluffs and double bluffs, seen this over and over.
So clear that the UK Tory Govt has next to zero respect for any devolved administration, understand that - they were set up by Labour after all, so we get unconstructive point scoring and shenanigans (from all sides), devolution just doesn't really work unless the same parties are in power, hasn't been like that since 2008 for Scotland and 2010 for Wales......... and it shows.
Brexit remains as polarising as ever, politics always feels utterly frustrating, always negative.
Division and more division.
On top of the covid catastrophe.........plain Yuk.

Sorry for the moan, fed up.
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Do the devolved powers include foreign policy?
 
maxfli65 said:
Just seems to be another Mexican standoff between UK Govt and EU, see who blinks first. By definitively saying the UK will not extend the transition deadline Gove thinks that will force the EU's hand to give us an FTA double quick, meantime EU are still saying UK can extend the deadline even though we've now said we won't, they are probably thinking Johnson will weaken as the no deadline approaches and back down - not a great position for either side, bluffs and double bluffs, seen this over and over.
So clear that the UK Tory Govt has next to zero respect for any devolved administration, understand that - they were set up by Labour after all, so we get unconstructive point scoring and shenanigans (from all sides), devolution just doesn't really work unless the same parties are in power, hasn't been like that since 2008 for Scotland and 2010 for Wales......... and it shows.
Brexit remains as polarising as ever, politics always feels utterly frustrating, always negative.
Division and more division.
On top of the covid catastrophe.........plain Yuk.

Sorry for the moan, fed up.
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Surely you understand the constitutional positions on devolved powers and UK powers, isnt that the point of the devolved nations having representations in Westminster.

It's so obvious the EU want us to keep funding as long as possible and for that funding to increase. Just imagine their position should we be a net beneficiary, they would have sown it up by now.
 
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Prime Minister Boris Johnson met the President of the European Council Charles Michel, the President of the European Commission, Ursula von der Leyen, and the President of the European Parliament, David Sassoli, on 15 June by videoconference to take stock of progress with the aim of agreeing actions to move forward in negotiations on the future relationship.

The Parties noted the UK’s decision not to request any extension to the transition period. The transition period will therefore end on 31 December 2020, in line with the provisions of the Withdrawal Agreement.

The Parties welcomed the constructive discussions on the future relationship that had taken place under the leadership of Chief Negotiators David Frost and Michel Barnier, allowing both sides to clarify and further understand positions. They noted that four rounds had been completed and texts exchanged despite the challenges presented by the COVID-19 pandemic.

The Parties agreed nevertheless that new momentum was required. They supported the plans agreed by Chief Negotiators to intensify the talks in July and to create the most conducive conditions for concluding and ratifying a deal before the end of 2020. This should include, if possible, finding an early understanding on the principles underlying any agreement.

The Parties underlined their intention to work hard to deliver a relationship, which would work in the interests of the citizens of the Union and of the United Kingdom. They also confirmed their commitment to the full and timely implementation of the Withdrawal Agreement.”
 
IMO It's time to set clear Red lines now along these guidelines:

The UK as an Independant Country would like a free trade agreement with the EU based closely to those already agreed with Canada and Japan and fair to both the UK and the EU

We refuse the ECJ having any precedence over UK Law.

The UK must have control of its coastal fishing grounds as set out by international law. All fishing quotas in these grounds will be under control of the UK Government.

The UK will not agree to EU standards in Trade, Finance, Taxation, Quotas or Tarrrifs being applied and controlled in any way that precludes UK sovereign control.

There will be no freedom of movement for people between the EU and the UK. All immigration to the UK will be as set out in the UK's immigration system.
 
I heard a clip today of verstofhat ranting asking for more cash from the member states , if I find it I'll post it up. the best clip of his at the mo is him celebrating Farage losing his job at LBC, although I thought he left over a conflict of interest s.
 
Doon frae Troon said:
It has always been an English Tory Brexit. :unsure:
During discussions the views of Scotland and NI have never been addressed or listened to.
We just have to suck up whatever Westminster decides will happen to us despite our nation voting 2 to 1 to remain in the EU.
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You seem to have forgotten that country less than 50 miles west of the part of England where you harvested your salary, then buggered off back home to throw insults at the country that allowed you to do so! :poop:
 
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Call me thick.. but i have stopped following Brexit as much as i have stopped listening to the daily Covid car crash briefings. There are some red lines with this political lot
1) There is one rule for us and another for the others
2) Do as I say, not as I do
3) If it serves the party (leader & his clique) and the next election then it is fair game
4) If the topic becomes too difficult, then change the narrative or give people something else to talk about
5) If you can score political points - within the country or against the EU - then do so
6) Experts - who needs them
7) Rest of the country - who needs them. Let the kids go hungry during summer - they cannot vote as yet.
 
Mudball said:
Call me thick.. but i have stopped following Brexit as much as i have stopped listening to the daily Covid car crash briefings. There are some red lines with this political lot
1) There is one rule for us and another for the others
2) Do as I say, not as I do
3) If it serves the party (leader & his clique) and the next election then it is fair game
4) If the topic becomes too difficult, then change the narrative or give people something else to talk about
5) If you can score political points - within the country or against the EU - then do so
6) Experts - who needs them
7) Rest of the country - who needs them. Let the kids go hungry during summer - they cannot vote as yet.
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8) attack the BBC
 
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