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AND HERE WE GO - THE 2019 GENERAL ELECTION THREAD

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drdel said:
Snobbish - I'd rather they studied Economics, Finance, Engineering, Computing etc instead of Latin and Classics, etc which philistine that I am, I consider as much use as a chocolate fireguard.
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No, not snobbish to know some Shakespeare and acknowledge his works as the greatest use of the English language there has ever been. It will never be equalled .
I agree that the modern world is better served with the subjects you mention being learned by today's children, but that doesn't mean that the best of the arts , or other subjects, should be neglected or derided.
Your post's tone can be taken as suggesting that.

An engineer can be brilliant in his field, but displaying a lack of basic general knowledge may undermine his standing amongst those he needs to influence professionally .
 
Beezerk said:
Well quite, when he does finally give a "meaningful" statement on Brexit it's just hot air and empty promises.
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He doesn’t, he is offering you an opportunity to renegotiate a deal and then make a choice between it and remain.
It’s time consuming and yes how many great deals have come out of Europe?
Dunno why no one has realised it yet but there is no great utopian deal, all will be worse than remain .. why would we get a better one?? Also what prep have we done for leaving, have we attempted to strengthen our economy, have we looked at trying to make ourselves a “go to” for some item that they all need ? Basically we have done nothing and achieved nothing in 3 years and some people are not bright enough to realise it.
So simple choice down the pan with Boris and forever having Herr Farage (Cos he has a German passport) saying it could have been this that and the other thing..
or just remain get on with it and make better preparations to leave in the future or try to fashion the EU .

Those are the choices
 
PhilTheFragger said:
Aha, now that is a technique known as deflection, are you standing for parliament as you are clearly a pro 😂

Fancy answering the question 👍
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The answer is easy mate, Corbyn could be the next PM of this country, but as he has never been in that position we can all only guess if he could do a better deal that get us out of EU.
Many many of us are stuck between a rock and a hard place, in that we’d like to see a Labour Government, but without him in charge.
edit: There are also many in the position I was over boris, ie, didn’t trust him at all when he said he’d get the EU to negotiate, but as hobbit rightly pointed out and I had to acknowledge, he did it.
 
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Swinglowandslow said:
No, not snobbish to know some Shakespeare and acknowledge his works as the greatest use of the English language there has ever been. It will never be equalled .
I agree that the modern world is better served with the subjects you mention being learned by today's children, but that doesn't mean that the best of the arts , or other subjects, should be neglected or derided.
Your post's tone can be taken as suggesting that.

An engineer can be brilliant in his field, but displaying a lack of basic general knowledge may undermine his standing amongst those he needs to influence professionally .
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You missed the point and context. I never said it was snobbish to study such subjects. Along the way I've studied and seen Shakespeare's work (not sure his work is the best!) and other literature and arty stuff. I was accusing SILH of making a snobbish comment wrt the politicians he mentioned.
 
Hobbit said:
If it didn't sell, it would no longer be in business. Don't think I've ever bought one let alone read one.
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Me neither, can’t believe anyone with any intelligence buys it.
 
pauldj42 said:
Any different to what TM did, ie, voted Leave then fought for a deal or boris voting to Leave and voting against TM’s deal.
Weird how these standards only apply in one direction.
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Yes it is. He wants to negotiate a new deal, put it to a referendum and then vote against his own deal what ever it is. What Twazzocks would contemplate that, you couldn't make it up.
 
SocketRocket said:
Yes it is. He wants to negotiate a new deal, put it to a referendum and then vote against his own deal what ever it is. What Twazzocks would contemplate that, you couldn't make it up.
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Then I’ll note your answer and disagree. I believe Thornberry is the only one to publicly say she’d vote against any deal, but if you can show me Corbyns Quote were he says that he vote against his own deal as I’d be interested to read it myself.(y)
 
PhilTheFragger said:
Can someone explain just how Corbin is going to be able to negotiate a better deal with Europe.

Extended use of the word “Non” springs to mind
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Both Labour and the Tories have made some rather fruity promises about Brexit. Labour are saying they would renegotiate a withdrawal agreement and then put it to the vote all within 6 months of being in government. And the Tories are claiming they will have Brexit done and dusted and be out of the EU by the end of the transition period in Dec 2020, by which time we would have agreed a deal on the future relationship. Both of which could be said to be rather fanciful.

I expect Labour's plans are imply to the EU that the withdrawal agreement they want to agree will be more favourable to the EU in terms of closer ties in customs unions etc etc, so the EU will reopen it. Whether other people will see that as 'better' is a matter of opinion, some will and some may well not. This may lead to rioting on the streets if some are to be believed, or most people just shrugging their shoulders as they are increasingly fed up with the whole thing.
 
Actually if labour go for a Norway deal, I think the point of debate is how much to pay ..as the rule set of the relationship are already laid out. So negotiations are purely about the payment. Anything less than current and maintaining independence would appeal to a lot of leavers and some remainers (if they have no chance to remain).
Not sure how much Norway pays, but it could be related to the level of trade. Sure there is someone on here who will tell me!
Although if you asked the Norwegians they would think we are crazy!!
 
Can I suggest to all that reading the book'2020 World Of War' by Paul Cornish and Kingsley Donaldson may!!
Please give a truly frightening and yet weirdly possible long game lateral thinking outcome that could come into play given the truly atrocious state of British politics and the lack of any credible, believable and people who can actually be trusted?
I was brought up in a Labour voting household and carried that on until I switched to SNP(not because I want/believe in independence)but after John Smith so tragically died then my faith/trust went as I really didn't trust Blair et al.
Can someone bring back John Smith to show what leadership,decency,honesty and real leadership quality is all about!!! (rather than the lying,drooling,bombastity of Johnston,the prfect vacumm of anything really of Corbyn,,,and don't get me started on Mrs.Krankie-the grand failure of ALL services in Scotland)
 
toyboy54 said:
Can I suggest to all that reading the book'2020 World Of War' by Paul Cornish and Kingsley Donaldson may!!
Please give a truly frightening and yet weirdly possible long game lateral thinking outcome that could come into play given the truly atrocious state of British politics and the lack of any credible, believable and people who can actually be trusted?
I was brought up in a Labour voting household and carried that on until I switched to SNP(not because I want/believe in independence)but after John Smith so tragically died then my faith/trust went as I really didn't trust Blair et al.
Can someone bring back John Smith to show what leadership,decency,honesty and real leadership quality is all about!!! (rather than the lying,drooling,bombastity of Johnston,the prfect vacumm of anything really of Corbyn,,,and don't get me started on Mrs.Krankie-the grand failure of ALL services in Scotland)
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Not quite sure, even with some of the cutting edge scientific breakthroughs that are occurring, we can bring the dead back to life. Although to be honest a promise like that would not look too out of place among the other claims in some parties manifestos.
 
Good point there Hacker,they would probably claim credit and then crap themselves as integrity and gravitas would be like something from another planet arriving.
Something none of them could understand/encompass so should be feared/cast into the wilderness!
But seriously everyone should read the book(I got it from my local library) I couldn't put it down then went back and read it again.
Think I'll get it from a bookshop or Amazon( only if I can't)and send to Mrs.Krankie to read,consider,learn from and then pass the message on to the misguided.
Jimbo
 
pauldj42 said:
The answer is easy mate, Corbyn could be the next PM of this country, but as he has never been in that position we can all only guess if he could do a better deal that get us out of EU.
Many many of us are stuck between a rock and a hard place, in that we’d like to see a Labour Government, but without him in charge.
edit: There are also many in the position I was over boris, ie, didn’t trust him at all when he said he’d get the EU to negotiate, but as hobbit rightly pointed out and I had to acknowledge, he did it.
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Probably Boris succeeded in getting the EU to negotiate because he had the, very real, leverage of “no deal”.

Corbyn had demanded “no deal” isn’t an option, So just wondering how he is going to succeed, if he gets the chance
 
pauldj42 said:
Then I’ll note your answer and disagree. I believe Thornberry is the only one to publicly say she’d vote against any deal, but if you can show me Corbyns Quote were he says that he vote against his own deal as I’d be interested to read it myself.(y)
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He has stated labour will campaign to remain in a referendum so will have to vote against his own deal. Simples.
 
PhilTheFragger said:
Probably Boris succeeded in getting the EU to negotiate because he had the, very real, leverage of “no deal”.

Corbyn had demanded “no deal” isn’t an option, So just wondering how he is going to succeed, if he gets the chance
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By negotiating , I mean surrendering to a BRINO Brexit, staying in the customs union, single market, freedom of movement and regulatory alignment.
 
harpo_72 said:
Actually if labour go for a Norway deal, I think the point of debate is how much to pay ..as the rule set of the relationship are already laid out. So negotiations are purely about the payment. Anything less than current and maintaining independence would appeal to a lot of leavers and some remainers (if they have no chance to remain).
Not sure how much Norway pays, but it could be related to the level of trade. Sure there is someone on here who will tell me!
Although if you asked the Norwegians they would think we are crazy!!
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And so we would be, Japan and Canada dont pay the EU for free trade and dont have freedom of movement.
 
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