Wimbledon 2019

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I watched the men's final yesterday, great match but I feel like we got the wrong result, sadly. Federer was the better player throughout but for some reason struggled in all the tie-breaks. If they hadn't have changed the last set rules, I feel that Federer would have gone on to win for sure, as Djokovic had only broken him once or twice in the match I think. But Djokovic's tenacity is obviously one of his best attributes and means he can win matches even when being outplayed. Given Federer's age and Nadal mainly only winning the French Open now, I think it's quite likely that Djokovic will surpass the most majors in the next two years. There doesn't seem to be another guy coming through to challenge at that level does there? I don't watch much tennis so happy to be proven wrong there, but it does seem to be these same three guys competing for all the majors and they're all over 30.
 
Djokovic definitely not had his best and still got over the line, done well to stop the two match points at 40:15 on Federer serve.

I think DJokovic is probably the GOAT as in the past has hits highs that neither Fed or Nads have hit and have iirc positive player records against both of them. He beat Nads at the French open and won a French open, whereas Feds kind of got lucky on the year he won as he could never beat Nads at French open(often beaten into the ground by nadal).

Hope he goes forward to gets the most majors.

Still think it is a shame that they made the surfaces similar to each other tho
 
maxfli65 said:
Re GOAT, there is clear bias towards Fed from UK people simply because of Wimbledon, it's the only tennis tournament a lot of non-tennis people tune into here.
Djokovic is primarily a hard courts specialist, so US and Australian Opens suit his game more.
Fed is very much a grass specialist.
Ivan Lendl was a top player and won 8 grand slams at 3 venues but not Wimbledon as grass didn't suit him. John McEnroe only won 7 grand slams at 2 venues but three of those were wimbledon titles so he gets the plaudits here. Who was really the better player though?
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As popular as McEnroe is I would say more of that is due to personality. Very little is usually made of his game nowadays tbh.

I agree the public adore Federer, but that's not just here and is imo overall more down to his style and the fact he was the first to move it away from simply serve and volley, to claim he is a simply grass court specialist is false also imo. He's won more at Australia and the US than Novak so far too.

Bith of them are clearly fast court specialists with Nadal being the king of clay.
 
Lord Tyrion said:
Excellent post and you are spot on to highlight UK bias surrounding Wimbledon winners. Jimmy Connors won 8 Grand Slams, 1 more than McEnroe, 2 more than Becker, yet because 5 were US Opens he never gets mentioned in the same breath over here.

One point to raise, the bold bit. Going on that does it not make it more remarkable that Djokovic has now won 5 Wimbledons?
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Could it be argued that its mot eimpresive that Federer has won 11 on hard courts been as he's a grass court specialist?

These days it's only really the French open that's a real diference in regards to the styles. In fact it's been like that for some time. Only really hear the term clay court specialist when certain players would get to semis in France and then go out first round a week later. That was imo one reason they made the break longer between events. To give said specialists longer to adapt before Wimbledon.
 
DRW said:
Djokovic definitely not had his best and still got over the line, done well to stop the two match points at 40:15 on Federer serve.

I think DJokovic is probably the GOAT as in the past has hits highs that neither Fed or Nads have hit and have iirc positive player records against both of them. He beat Nads at the French open and won a French open, whereas Feds kind of got lucky on the year he won as he could never beat Nads at French open(often beaten into the ground by nadal).

Hope he goes forward to gets the most majors.

Still think it is a shame that they made the surfaces similar to each other tho
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I agree he will likely surpass their records, my only issue with the above is that he has 5 years or so on em. So you'd expect him to have a better record as when he leaked they were ageing.

Re the French open. I agree re Federer, it reminds me a little of when people harshly said Harringtons major wins would have an asterix as Woods wasn't playing...
That said, the year Djok beat Nadal he still didn't win the title so it was of little consequence.

I think in years to come we will all just be greatful we saw them all alongside one another.

My guess is that the goat will be whoever has the most between Rog and Djok as Nadals totals are so heavily weighted to one event.
 
Papas1982 said:
Could it be argued that its mot eimpresive that Federer has won 11 on hard courts been as he's a grass court specialist?

These days it's only really the French open that's a real diference in regards to the styles. In fact it's been like that for some time. Only really hear the term clay court specialist when certain players would get to semis in France and then go out first round a week later. That was imo one reason they made the break longer between events. To give said specialists longer to adapt before Wimbledon.
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Completely agree. They are both exceptional players, it is picky to suggest otherwise. It is a heck of an era.
 
Papas1982 said:
I agree he will likely surpass their records, my only issue with the above is that he has 5 years or so on em. So you'd expect him to have a better record as when he leaked they were ageing.

Re the French open. I agree re Federer, it reminds me a little of when people harshly said Harringtons major wins would have an asterix as Woods wasn't playing...
That said, the year Djok beat Nadal he still didn't win the title so it was of little consequence.

I think in years to come we will all just be greatful we saw them all alongside one another.

My guess is that the goat will be whoever has the most between Rog and Djok as Nadals totals are so heavily weighted to one event.
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Nadal is only one year older than Djokovic isn't he? It's just Federer who's a few years older.
 
Orikoru said:
Nadal is only one year older than Djokovic isn't he? It's just Federer who's a few years older.
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Orikoru said:
Nadal is only one year older than Djokovic isn't he? It's just Federer who's a few years older.
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Fair cop.

I basically meant their peaks never really overlapped with novak.

Djok started slightly later, I remember when he seemed to be weak willed and gave up too early. A great turn around from them days.
 
MegaSteve said:
Hard to believe, I know, but there were some great players before colour TV came along... And, Wiki never paints the full picture...
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Cheap dog, us young uns can't coment on what we've not seen. Could easily say nostalgia clouds your mind too....

I've never seen anyone play better than the three we have now. Doesn't mean none played better, but historical reports no matter how complimentary or detailed won't overall what someone sees...
 
Been watching tennis since the 80s(teenager) and its interesting how the game has changed in that time and how for the mens side they tend to win later on in years, as I assume the power has taken over.

Wonder how good some players would have been given the strings and courts now, from yester year ? and if they would have won so many more majors, so the likes of Lendl would he have won Wimbledon or would borg have been better than he was, and maybe becker/Sampras/Connors would have won the French open to complete the slams.

Can remember Pat Cash saying in an interview something along the lines off, if he had hit the ball as hard as they do now, the ball would have gone sailing over the baseline by 6 foot due to I think the topspin the strings now impart(?) Sounds similar story to golf and technology.:D
 
Mrs Hogan is not a fan of either player as for her they are just too dull and emotionless when they are playing (she's a big Nadal fan). But she swung behind Djokovic as the match went on as the obvious 'bias' of the crowd towards Federer got on her nerves...
 
Papas1982 said:
Fair cop.

I basically meant their peaks never really overlapped with novak.

Djok started slightly later, I remember when he seemed to be weak willed and gave up too early. A great turn around from them days.
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That's true. Nadal hit the ground running whereas Novak didn't seem to hit his peak until 4 years later.
 
Interesting seeing people say Djockovich is a hard court specialist, his slam record would suggest otherwise.

Yes he has 7 Australian open wins, but only 3 US Opens. So that's 10 total hardcourt slams, yet now has half of that alone at Wimbledon with 5. Could be argued that he is a decent all around player with the one exception of Nadal being virtually untouchable on Clay.

Also Novak taking longer to peak could just be he needed find his place in the game or that he realised how much better the other 2 were so found a way to apply himself and develop into the player he is now. I'm also fairly sure Federer has never beaten Novak in a Slam final when they've come head to head. I'd have to double check that stat but if I'm right that's a hell of a record.
 
Wolf said:
Interesting seeing people say Djockovich is a hard court specialist, his slam record would suggest otherwise.

Yes he has 7 Australian open wins, but only 3 US Opens. So that's 10 total hardcourt slams, yet now has half of that alone at Wimbledon with 5. Could be argued that he is a decent all around player with the one exception of Nadal being virtually untouchable on Clay.

Also Novak taking longer to peak could just be he needed find his place in the game or that he realised how much better the other 2 were so found a way to apply himself and develop into the player he is now. I'm also fairly sure Federer has never beaten Novak in a Slam final when they've come head to head. I'd have to double check that stat but if I'm right that's a hell of a record.
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I remember years ago reading about how Djokovic discovered he was gluten intolerant or something, totally changed his diet and his fitness improved tenfold afterwards. So that might have been a turning point for him.

Edit: Also Federer beat him in one final, but way back in 2007 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Djokovic–Federer_rivalry#Head-to-head_tallies
 
Orikoru said:
I remember years ago reading about how Djokovic discovered he was gluten intolerant or something, totally changed his diet and his fitness improved tenfold afterwards. So that might have been a turning point for him.

Edit: Also Federer beat him in one final, but way back in 2007 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Djokovic–Federer_rivalry#Head-to-head_tallies
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Wasn't sure whether I was right about that but still a stat that shows he has the better record between the 2 players.
 
Papas1982 said:
Cheap dog, us young uns can't coment on what we've not seen. Could easily say nostalgia clouds your mind too....

I've never seen anyone play better than the three we have now. Doesn't mean none played better, but historical reports no matter how complimentary or detailed won't overall what someone sees...
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Apologies... I can see why you have interpreted it as a 'cheap dig'... But, it genuinely wasn't my intention for it to be so...
 
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