What's going to get us to leave the car.

[bobmac]

You've literally summed up my issues with going full EV. Even if things go as planned for us this year meaning we can go down to 1 car, we still will need the main car to be a 7 seater ideally. The Nissan is literally the commercial van but instead they've simply swapped the rear panels for windows. Plus the max range isn't long about to drive and visit family, if you factor in stops it takes nearly an hour for an 80% charge which could possibly mean a 2nd stop, so a 2.5hr drive I can do non stop currently becomes 4.5hrs.

How far is it in miles to your familly?

There's no way im buying 2nd hand because of battery degradation you simply don't know what life is left in the battery. So new becomes the only option which isba whole other dilemma of nothing is affordable. People keep saying the price wilk become lower than comparative ICE cars, but that's not simply being shown by manufacturers, if anything each new one that comes out the cost of buying one is getting significantly higher than other cars.

EV batteries are guaranteed for 8-10 years, depending on the manufacturer.

Haven't seen the episode but I guess coukd be possible they got one ofnthe early Japan/US releases that came out in December 2010. Even so would still have only been a 9 year old car. But that's a severe degradation of battery life though.

1. Are they telling porkies?
2. The batteries don't degrade that fast and even if that one did, it would have been replaced free of charge after 8 years under guarantee

 

[pool888]

My plan if I do get an EV is to get on the Octopus Tariff or similar, 5p per KW/h between 00:30 and 04:30 so 4 hours of cheap charging should give around 100 miles range which should last me a two or three days. This should work out around 500 miles for the cost of a gallon of diesel at the pumps. Supercharging on long trips is 24p per Kwh so roughly 100 miles per gallon. Several charge points are free currently but this will likely change over time. Some companies are apparently charging as much as 69p per Kwh which is much more expensive than diesel. This is not answering the question of how we get people out of cars but at least cuts the emissions and costs.

 

[clubchamp98]

with the massive amounts of tax raised on fuel, i can't help wondering where they can replace this sum...... ????

The price of electricity will be taxed to compensate .
That’s pretty clear , so the numbers quoted today to run an EV will rise significantly to match the price of a ICE car.
Private companies will provide the charging points and will charge accordingly.
But I still maintain we need more power stations to service all the new charging points.

 

[Wolf]

How far is it in miles to your familly?



EV batteries are guaranteed for 8-10 years, depending on the manufacturer.



1. Are they telling porkies?
2. The batteries don't degrade that fast and even if that one did, it would have been replaced free of charge after 8 years under guarantee

Depends which family members i visit my oldest daughter is about 160 miles, I've a very spread out family, but parents are currently moving even further away down to Cornwall this year so that would become monumental drive with stops.

The issue is choice of cars as well currently for me is either the nissan van or hugely jumping in prices beyond anything affordable.

 

[clubchamp98]

My plan if I do get an EV is to get on the Octopus Tariff or similar, 5p per KW/h between 00:30 and 04:30 so 4 hours of cheap charging should give around 100 miles range which should last me a two or three days. This should work out around 500 miles for the cost of a gallon of diesel at the pumps. Supercharging on long trips is 24p per Kwh so roughly 100 miles per gallon. Several charge points are free currently but this will likely change over time. Some companies are apparently charging as much as 69p per Kwh which is much more expensive than diesel. This is not answering the question of how we get people out of cars but at least cuts the emissions and costs.

The only problem I see in your plan is if the 00.30 04.30am prices rocketed because this then becomes the most used time in the day for electricity, it’s only cheap now as most people don’t use electricity at these times.
All the running costs quoted at the moment will change ,everyone knows that. Or in denial.
Government will need to recoup what they lose in fuel tax Thats basic economics.
As the price to buy an EV comes down the running costs will rise imo.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

BIK is 0% for 20/21 then 1% 21/22 then 2% 22/23, could be raised back to "normal levels" after than, but no doubt this will push company car sales towards EV's, employee will save thousands over the 3 years comapred to petrol/diesel.

The lease cost is much higher for the company though. Employee wins big time, employer loses.

 

[clubchamp98]

The lease cost is much higher for the company though. Employee wins big time, employer loses.

As a business man !
Do these EV cars make sense to reps who do a lot of miles and may spend more time in the day waiting in service stations for the car to charge.

 

[pool888]

The only problem I see in your plan is if the 00.30 04.30am prices rocketed because this then becomes the most used time in the day for electricity, it’s only cheap now as most people don’t use electricity at these times.
All the running costs quoted at the moment will change ,everyone knows that. Or in denial.
Government will need to recoup what they lose in fuel tax Thats basic economics.
As the price to buy an EV comes down the running costs will rise imo.

Totally agree but only going by what is available just now. Don't think prices will rocket at 00:30 - 04:30 they will just go to standard rate otherwise people will just charge at different times of the day. But once EV's are popular the costs will be totally dictated by the government and the electricity companies just the same as they are dictated by the government and oil companies just now.

 

[bobmac]

Totally agree but only going by what is available just now. Don't think prices will rocket at 00:30 - 04:30 they will just go to standard rate otherwise people will just charge at different times of the day. But once EV's are popular the costs will be totally dictated by the government and the electricity companies just the same as they are dictated by the government and oil companies just now.

Unless you have solar panels.
I'd like to see Boris try and tax the sun

 

[pool888]

Unless you have solar panels.
I'd like to see Boris try and tax the sun

I'm sure he'll find a way, they tax everything else.

 

[clubchamp98]

Unless you have solar panels.
I'd like to see Boris try and tax the sun

Give him time.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

As a business man !
Do these EV cars make sense to reps who do a lot of miles and may spend more time in the day waiting in service stations for the car to charge.

Funnily enough I am wrestling with this right now. Pure electric makes no sense, in your example, unless it is a Tesla as they can go all day realistically. The rest are not up to it. Effectively there is 1 choice of car, very high lease price.

Plug in hybrids are the half way house but once you have used up your 30 mile charge you are dragging a very heavy car around with a 1.4l petrol engine. I am trying to find out the real life mpg in those circumstances as that would be me at times. I have heard anything from 30-40mpg on petrol engine alone in those circumstances. If you are doing 20-40k per year then that is a lot more fuel used compare to a 2.0d giving you 50-55mpg (this is what I get from my Skoda Superb auto). From a business perspective you pay a higher lease and will pay more for fuel. It does not add up. Cold hard facts there, not factoring in environmental concerns.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

I'm sure he'll find a way, they tax everything else.

That idiot would tax air if he could

I've just noticed octopus energy are doing a tariff

14.5p kwph for 04:30-00:30

5p kwph for 00:30-04:30

So if you drove 50 miles a day and scheduled your car to charge every night at 00:30 until full you would pay £1.40 (assuming it charged for all those hours rather than be charged before that)

Bargain

 

[USER1999]

I am still not convinced solar power in the UK is going to add much. There is just not enough hours of sunshine for about 6 months of the year.

A lot of dispute over the mis selling of roof panels going on at the moment.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

I am still not convinced solar power in the UK is going to add much. There is just not enough hours of sunshine for about 6 months of the year.

A lot of dispute over the mis selling of roof panels going on at the moment.

That's more to do with the tariffs and who owns the roof

Some were put on leases that meant the roof isn't there's anymore as such
.and others tariffs they were promised changed

 

[clubchamp98]

That idiot would tax air if he could

I've just noticed octopus energy are doing a tariff

14.5p kwph for 04:30-00:30

5p kwph for 00:30-04:30

So if you drove 50 miles a day and scheduled your car to charge every night at 00:30 until full you would pay £1.40 (assuming it charged for all those hours rather than be charged before that)

Bargain

If and when the EV cars are in the majority and people are charging their cars on this off peak tariff how long before it’s not off peak.
The more that is used the more needs to be generated .
This means more staff, maintenance crews etc , that not the case at the moment .
So the cost of running these cars will rise to match ICE cars .
I would say when this is up and running there will be no off peak tariffs as there will be a drain on the grid 24/7.

 

[pool888]

That idiot would tax air if he could

I've just noticed octopus energy are doing a tariff

14.5p kwph for 04:30-00:30

5p kwph for 00:30-04:30

So if you drove 50 miles a day and scheduled your car to charge every night at 00:30 until full you would pay £1.40 (assuming it charged for all those hours rather than be charged before that)

Bargain

Yes that's the tariff I was mentioning earlier. I believe they are also trialing a variable rate tariff depending in grid load, i.e when it's at peak such as early evening when everyone gets home and puts the cooker and kettle on it's more expensive, but very cheap (sometimes less than 1p Kw/h) during hours when there is excess electric in the grid to get rid of and different rates all through the day depending on load. Some people are benefiting by storing up electric in batteries at cheap rates then using it at peak rates even with the system losses. There is no doubt prices will change to refect the market, the Government takes in huge amounts of its money from fuel duty and will need to recover it from somewhere, most likely whatever fuels cars are using to power them in the future which looks like electricity at the moment. Running an electric car will not stay cheap for long once the incentives have got enough people to swap over the taxes will come.

 

[Deleted member 21784]

Yes that's the tariff I was mentioning earlier. I believe they are also trialing a variable rate tariff depending in grid load, i.e when it's at peak such as early evening when everyone gets home and puts the cooker and kettle on it's more expensive, but very cheap (sometimes less than 1p Kw/h) during hours when there is excess electric in the grid to get rid of and different rates all through the day depending on load. Some people are benefiting by storing up electric in batteries at cheap rates then using it at peak rates even with the system losses. There is no doubt prices will change to refect the market, the Government takes in huge amounts of its money from fuel duty and will need to recover it from somewhere, most likely whatever fuels cars are using to power them in the future which looks like electricity at the moment. Running an electric car will not stay cheap for long once the incentives have got enough people to swap over the taxes will come.

That's the thing whilst EV vechiles in the short term will be cheaper in the long term it's about shifting away from using the fossil fuels rather than impacting our wallets

Yes I prob will be able to run a car for 5k a year including fuel, insurance and lease which will be great

But that car will also be carbon neutral

 

[bobmac]

I wonder how much the government wastes spends on subsidising coal, gas and oil powered power stations at the moment.

If and when the EV cars are in the majority and people are charging their cars on this off peak tariff how long before it’s not off peak.
The more that is used the more needs to be generated .
This means more staff, maintenance crews etc , that not the case at the moment .
So the cost of running these cars will rise to match ICE cars .
I would say when this is up and running there will be no off peak tariffs as there will be a drain on the grid 24/7.

And my reply to you in post no.198 was
''Only 60% of all car owners have off street parking and not every EV plugs in every night plus overnight demand for electricity is almost nothing.''
And in years to come when renewable energy continues to increase its output, there will be plenty of cheaper, cleaner power

 

[ScienceBoy]

Don't get me wrong the Bill Gates foundation does some excellent work but! - He's now ordered a new boat at a monetary cost of $600m - the Environmental impact of construction is not stated. It will need a crew of 20 odd and room for 14 guests!

However, not to worry as everything is fine because it will be hydrogen powered by fuel cells!!

The sources of his supply of hydrogen are unknown so there's are diesel driven generator systems as 'back-up' !! He has previously chartered boats but wanted a new one.

Its his money but it is nice to know that some of us plebs in the real world are taking climate responsibility seriously.

I think this has been proven to be fake news, confirmed by the hydrogen boat company involved.

As to your point, no disagreement there!

We need to fix transport for all and not force others deeper into poverty just to get to work.