Shaft Flex vs Weight

[One Planer]

Just after a little info from you good folk regards the importance of shaft weight and/or flex.

I know through both personal and fitting experience that light shafts don't suit me, or my swing.

When I was fitted for my MP63's in 2013, the Mizuno DNA thingy suggested based on the speed and characteristics of my swing, suggested light shafts such as TT Dynalite Gold XP, Nippon NS Pro 1150 and Project X 5.0.

Through actually hitting balls, it turns out I'm much more suited to the heavier end of the regular shaft (DG R300).

On the flip side of the coin I've been trialling a stiff shaft in my driver over the last 4-6 months. Moving from a stock Kai'li regular to Graphite Design Tour AD YSQ in Stiff. Both 65g, only the shaft flex differing. I have to say the results are very promising. I know that I, probably, don't have a high enough swing speed to load a stiff shaft correctly, but I've not noticed any significant loss in distance and my dispersion is a little better.

I'm looking into getting for a club to fill the distance gap between my 4 wood and 3 iron, probably a hybrid ( ) but I'm curious to hear your thoughts regarding shaft weight and shaft flex.

I know, as I said above, I'm not suited to uber-light shafts, but probably don't generate the swing speed for a stiff shaft.

Could a heavy regular shaft (80g-90g) fit the bill as a trade off between swing speed and dispersion?

If it helps. My Mizuno DNA figures (6 iron) are:

Head Speed - 73
Tempo - 4
Toe Down - 1
Kick Angle - 2
Release Factor - 1


P.S - I will be getting fitted for the club, as I said above. I'm more after and understanding of how shaft weight and flex play there part.

 

[Alex1975]

Head Speed - 73
Tempo - 4
Toe Down - 1
Kick Angle - 2
Release Factor - 1


From the above you are clearly and extremely ... I am not sure what the word is... lets say careful swinger of the club.

Head Speed - 73 Rather considered
Tempo - 4 The 4 is out of 9, 9 being yanking the heck out of it on the change of direction so your middle.
Toe Down - 1 This is the twist of the club around the shaft 1 being very very little.
Kick Angle - 2 This is the bend of the shaft forwards on the way down, again very little.
Release Factor - 1 How much force your release the club with 1 being very little.

Everything here, and clearly this is from a tool that is used to give you a guide so not a fact, would suggest very light, soft steel or graphite iron shaft. The tool (Mizuno DNA) cannot legislate for feel.

The driver shaft you have is rather well known for being incredibly smooth, most reviews on it (and I have/do own two of them) will tell you that even in X flex it is very friendly and most anyone can use any flex in this shaft, only the spin/launch will dictate the flex.

Just a thought but... Light shaft with heavy swing weight?

Correct me if I am wrong but your a big guy are you not? So it may not be about the weight, perhaps you can handle that, you just have a very considered swing?!

I would guess that you could go to 10 different fittings and they would start you off with light and soft.

I cant remember my DNA stats but I am something like 84 MPH Head Speed(so pretty slow) but my Tempo, Toe Down, Kick and Release are very aggressive. I was playing about at Golf Principles a little while back and he had me in PXi 6.5 as he said I was so aggressive from 90* to impact that the shaft needed to be a little strong.

I guess, do you want results or do you want it to feel right. From experience feel can come later. I have had several sets of PX shafts and at the time wondered why people said they were boardy but after using something else for a year when I go back to PX they do feel boardy.

 

[Foxholer]

I'm looking into getting for a club to fill the distance gap between my 4 wood and 3 iron, probably a hybrid ( ) but I'm curious to hear your thoughts regarding shaft weight and shaft flex.

I know, as I said above, I'm not suited to uber-light shafts, but probably don't generate the swing speed for a stiff shaft.

Could a heavy regular shaft (80g-90g) fit the bill as a trade off between swing speed and dispersion?

I'd suggest that doing the opposite could be 'better' - a lightish, but stiff one. The light weight should help with swing speed; the stiff with dispersion. 80gms isn't particularly heavy for a Hybrid btw - though it really depends on the style of head, which can vary markedly.

A 18-19* or maybe slightly lower should suit that gap, though I'd consider dropping the 3-iron too - and the hybrid can be 'swung easy' to cover that distance, if you get on with it!

 

[One Planer]

Head Speed - 73
Tempo - 4
Toe Down - 1
Kick Angle - 2
Release Factor - 1


From the above you are clearly and extremely ... I am not sure what the word is... lets say careful swinger of the club.

Head Speed - 73 Rather considered
Tempo - 4 The 4 is out of 9, 9 being yanking the heck out of it on the change of direction so your middle.
Toe Down - 1 This is the twist of the club around the shaft 1 being very very little.
Kick Angle - 2 This is the bend of the shaft forwards on the way down, again very little.
Release Factor - 1 How much force your release the club with 1 being very little.

Everything here, and clearly this is from a tool that is used to give you a guide so not a fact, would suggest very light, soft steel or graphite iron shaft. The tool (Mizuno DNA) cannot legislate for feel.

The driver shaft you have is rather well known for being incredibly smooth, most reviews on it (and I have/do own two of them) will tell you that even in X flex it is very friendly and most anyone can use any flex in this shaft, only the spin/launch will dictate the flex.

Just a thought but... Light shaft with heavy swing weight?

Correct me if I am wrong but your a big guy are you not? So it may not be about the weight, perhaps you can handle that, you just have a very considered swing?!

I would guess that you could go to 10 different fittings and they would start you off with light and soft.

I cant remember my DNA stats but I am something like 84 MPH Head Speed(so pretty slow) but my Tempo, Toe Down, Kick and Release are very aggressive. I was playing about at Golf Principles a little while back and he had me in PXi 6.5 as he said I was so aggressive from 90* to impact that the shaft needed to be a little strong.

I guess, do you want results or do you want it to feel right. From experience feel can come later. I have had several sets of PX shafts and at the time wondered why people said they were boardy but after using something else for a year when I go back to PX they do feel boardy.

Not sure I'd class my swing as deliberate

[video=youtube_share;OOpPnY83Khs]http://youtu.be/OOpPnY83Khs[/video]

That said, those numbers were taken before quite significant changes to my swing so they may be out, but not by much.

I'm not the biggest chap, but not exactly svelte :smirk:

I tend to find the middle more often than not so tend to get enough distance.

I'd suggest that doing the opposite could be 'better' - a lightish, but stiff one. The light weight should help with swing speed; the stiff with dispersion. 80gms isn't particularly heavy for a Hybrid btw - though it really depends on the style of head, which can vary markedly.

A 18-19* or maybe slightly lower should suit that gap, though I'd consider dropping the 3-iron too - and the hybrid can be 'swung easy' to cover that distance, if you get on with it!

That was another thought I had.

Looking at an 18° or 19° hybrid if I'm being honest but don't want to get stuck with a shaft that feels boardy/dead.

The Graphite Design in my driver is excellent so something along those lines would be ideal.

I know the Diamana S+ shaft that comes in the 913 has differing weights so that could be an option.

Perhaps a 72g in stiff would fit the bill?

 

[Foxholer]

..
That was another thought I had.

Looking at an 18° or 19° hybrid if I'm being honest but don't want to get stuck with a shaft that feels boardy/dead.

The Graphite Design in my driver is excellent so something along those lines would be ideal.

I know the Diamana S+ shaft that comes in the 913 has differing weights so that could be an option.

Perhaps a 72g in stiff would fit the bill?

Remember that Hybrid Shafts are 'speciallst' ones, normally significantly different to Wood ones. Generally 0.370 for a start. So S+/D+ are not relevant to Hybrids. Other styles/brands are though - there's a Diamana Bassara Hybrid (never tried it) and Aldila tend to have a 'family' - I had a 909H with Voodoo that was boringly straight!

As a Matrix fan, the Altus Hybrid line was pretty good. Not sure about their current line(s). I actually prefer less feel - and am less picky - for a hybrid shaft than for woods, so the heavy (95+gm) 904HB suits me fine, at least with the Rescue Mid.

 

[One Planer]

Head Speed - 73
Tempo - 4
Toe Down - 1
Kick Angle - 2
Release Factor - 1


From the above you are clearly and extremely ... I am not sure what the word is... lets say careful swinger of the club.

Head Speed - 73 Rather considered
Tempo - 4 The 4 is out of 9, 9 being yanking the heck out of it on the change of direction so your middle.
Toe Down - 1 This is the twist of the club around the shaft 1 being very very little.
Kick Angle - 2 This is the bend of the shaft forwards on the way down, again very little.
Release Factor - 1 How much force your release the club with 1 being very little.

Everything here, and clearly this is from a tool that is used to give you a guide so not a fact, would suggest very light, soft steel or graphite iron shaft. The tool (Mizuno DNA) cannot legislate for feel.

The driver shaft you have is rather well known for being incredibly smooth, most reviews on it (and I have/do own two of them) will tell you that even in X flex it is very friendly and most anyone can use any flex in this shaft, only the spin/launch will dictate the flex.

Just a thought but... Light shaft with heavy swing weight?

Correct me if I am wrong but your a big guy are you not? So it may not be about the weight, perhaps you can handle that, you just have a very considered swing?!

I would guess that you could go to 10 different fittings and they would start you off with light and soft.

I cant remember my DNA stats but I am something like 84 MPH Head Speed(so pretty slow) but my Tempo, Toe Down, Kick and Release are very aggressive. I was playing about at Golf Principles a little while back and he had me in PXi 6.5 as he said I was so aggressive from 90* to impact that the shaft needed to be a little strong.

I guess, do you want results or do you want it to feel right. From experience feel can come later. I have had several sets of PX shafts and at the time wondered why people said they were boardy but after using something else for a year when I go back to PX they do feel boardy.

I'd suggest that doing the opposite could be 'better' - a lightish, but stiff one. The light weight should help with swing speed; the stiff with dispersion. 80gms isn't particularly heavy for a Hybrid btw - though it really depends on the style of head, which can vary markedly.

A 18-19* or maybe slightly lower should suit that gap, though I'd consider dropping the 3-iron too - and the hybrid can be 'swung easy' to cover that distance, if you get on with it!

Remember that Hybrid Shafts are 'speciallst' ones, normally significantly different to Wood ones. Generally 0.370 for a start. So S+/D+ are not relevant to Hybrids. Other styles/brands are though - there's a Diamana Bassara Hybrid (never tried it) and Aldila tend to have a 'family' - I had a 909H with Voodoo that was boringly straight!

As a Matrix fan, the Altus Hybrid line was pretty good. Not sure about their current line(s). I actually prefer less feel - and am less picky - for a hybrid shaft than for woods, so the heavy (95+gm) 904HB suits me fine, at least with the Rescue Mid.

Interested on the highlighted section as the Diamana S+ is listep as an option in the 913h range. As is the D+ (White).

Sorry if I've misunderstood you post.

 

[Ethan]

In the past, shaft weight typically correlated with flex. Probably something to do with having to use thicker shaft walls to achieve greater stiffness with older poorer quality graphite. These days, it is possible to separate the two factors much more. As a result, some shaft gurus now say that shaft weight is possibly more important to the average player, and light shafts that maintain good stability are popular. I have a mate who was fitted by a Tour van fitter, into an X flex lightweight shaft for this very reason.

Gareth's swing looks good, and I think he might be a lighter but stiffer kinda guy too. Ooh err, missus.

Agree with Foxy that the Matrix Altus is a great hybrid shaft. I have a set of current or last generation clubs, all apart from the hybrid which is a 585H, older than the 913, 910, 909 and possibly some more Titleist lines, fitted with a Matrix Altus shaft. I have never found anything better.

 

[One Planer]

In the past, shaft weight typically correlated with flex. Probably something to do with having to use thicker shaft walls to achieve greater stiffness with older poorer quality graphite. These days, it is possible to separate the two factors much more. As a result, some shaft gurus now say that shaft weight is possibly more important to the average player, and light shafts that maintain good stability are popular. I have a mate who was fitted by a Tour van fitter, into an X flex lightweight shaft for this very reason.

Gareth's swing looks good, and I think he might be a lighter but stiffer kinda guy too. Ooh err, missus.

Agree with Foxy that the Matrix Altus is a great hybrid shaft. I have a set of current or last generation clubs, all apart from the hybrid which is a 585H, older than the 913, 910, 909 and possibly some more Titleist lines, fitted with a Matrix Altus shaft. I have never found anything better.

Thanks for that Ethan.

I suppose the good thing about SureFit is a few twists of the wrench and it's a whole new club..... ish.

I'll have a look at the fairway while I'm at it.

Thanks for the comments. Very much appreciated.

 

[Foxholer]

Interested on the highlighted section as the Diamana S+ is listep as an option in the 913h range. As is the D+ (White).

Sorry if I've misunderstood you post.

Nope. You understood it perfectly! :thup:

I blundered! Doh! There was even a Blueboard Hybrid apparently - not something I ever encountered! :mmm:

As I posted earlier though, weights are relatively high. Some Hybrid shafts are 60gms - the TM one I had at that weight was a a bit of a hook machine for me!

 

[One Planer]

Nope. You understood it perfectly! :thup:

I blundered! Doh! There was even a Blueboard Hybrid apparently - not something I ever encountered! :mmm:

As I posted earlier though, weights are relatively high. Some Hybrid shafts are 60gms - the TM one I had at that weight was a a bit of a hook machine for me!

No worries, just threw me for a second

I'm going to look at a light weight, stiff flex option as detailed above.

As I say, I can always swap the shaft out if needed.

 

[Junior]

Go for a 2 iron in the same spec as yr other irons? Maybe a h-4 2 iron with the same shaft ?

 

[One Planer]

I thought I'd add to this thread, albeit it is a little old

In the end I plumbed up for a lighter shaft in stiff flex for my 19° 913H (Diamana S+) and it's currently going like a stabbed rat.

All in all very happy with this choice and the results.

As moving to lighter shafts in two of my three woods has bore fruit, I'm now making a change in the final wood I carry. My 4 wood.

The current shaft and spec' installed in the 4 wood is a:

UST Axivcore Tour Red
77g
2.6 Torque
Stiff Flex

I'm moving to a lighter shaft and different club (... Thanks to Region3 :thup: ).

The shaft in the Optiforce is

Project X PXv
52g
4.0 Torque
6.0 flex

I'm guessing the weight difference alone between these shafts will have them play considerably different from each other?

Any input you good people have on either the Project X PXv shaft or the differences between my current and prospective shafts, I'd be happy to hear