Out of Order?

[HRC99]

Had a bit of an altercation on the course during a matchplay comp this week. Pretty nip and tuck and we're even on the 16th tee.

It's a 237 yard par 3. I put my tee shot into the greenside bunker and my opponent thins the hell out of one into the gorse bush in front of the tee. It was travelling so had a reasonably chance of going through.

He says he'll play a provisional and hits a really nice shot onto the green. He walks ahead to the front of the gorse bush to see if it had gone through.

I head a quick peek in the gorse bush, he tells me not to bother but I look and after no more than 10 seconds looking spot his ball. I tell him I've found it and that he should play that ball.

He goes nuts.

He loses the hole and subsequently the match.

Was I out of order to have a quick peek or should I have just walked on?

 

[birdieman]

You're through, he's out, job done!

Considering he was just into the rough I think he should have had a quick look for the original ball, I would have, best he could do with provisional was a 4, more likely 5 on a par 3. You were a dead cert bogey or better.

 

[Jabba]

If he didn't want to find it, he shouldn't have declared his second shot a provisional. Declaring the 2nd a provvy and then not looking for your 1st just because you like the look of the provisional is gamesmanship imo. He'd have had a bloody good look if his provvy was in the crap.

 

[ash01]

You beat him so don't worry too much about it and definitely don't let the thought of that scenario hinder you in your next match.

Sounds to me like he knew full well what he was up to, hoping he could halve or win the hole if your bunker shot went wayward or you struggled to get out?

Ash!!

 

[chris661]

Bolloxs to him you won.

Chris661!!

 

[richart]

If he didn't want to find it, he shouldn't have declared his second shot a provisional. Declaring the 2nd a provvy and then not looking for your 1st just because you like the look of the provisional is gamesmanship imo. He'd have had a bloody good look if his provvy was in the crap.

Spot on. If he had holed his provisional ball, he no doubt wouldn't have looked at all for his first one. Not what playing a provisional is all about, and definitely gamesmanship.

 

[timgolfy]

The rules state that he has 5 minutes to find his ball.

In match play, I believe the etiquette is that the opponent has 5 minutes to find the ball too!

 

[PhilTheFragger]

A provisional is declared on the basis that if you cant find the first ball then the provisional becomes "ball in play"

If the first ball is found within a reasonable time, then it should be played, especially if it is a match or Comp. Ok in social play you could let it go

Simples, you have done nothing wrong, The first ball was found.

If he doesnt like it, he shouldnt have hit it there

Fragger

 

[rosecott]

You were entitled to 5 minutes to look for his ball. It was to your advantage to do so.

 

[HRC99]

I knew I was within my rights to look for the ball (after numerous threads on here about declaring your ball lost! ). As has been pointed out, if he didn't want to find it, he should have just played another ball without declaring it a provisional.

I was just unsure as to whether I had gone beyond the etiquette/spirit of the game.

Mainly, cos he went bonkers at me!

 

[Yerman]

I think he missed a trick, if he had simply continued to the provisional and played it, it would automatically become the ball in play, he is not obliged to look for or play the first ball.

 

[timgolfy]

But would he not then be playing out of turn until HC99 had played his ball from the bunker, in which case the ball would not be in play?

 

[Jabba]

I think you're wrong.

 

[RGDave]

You were right, he was out of order.

The correct thing to do if you definitely do not want to search for your original ball is to put another ball into play as quickly as possible, without declaring it as a provisional ball.

Simples.

He was miffed, 'cause he had a chance at a 4 and could see a possible halved hole with some luck.

 

[Matty]

I'm of the opinion that if he didn't like the first shot at all he should not have declared his second tee shot a provisional.

Moreover, once the first ball was found he can still declare it unplayable and take a penalty drop so he's playing his 3rd stroke next, not his fourth if he plays 'the provisional' ball.

Why did he go nuts? He was technically better off finding the ball and taking a drop. Or am I missing something?

 

[doubletripledouble]

The way i see it is he has basically declared that he has stopped looking and declaring the provisional as the ball in play.

 

[Deleted member 1740]

No you are well within your rights to help him look for his lost ball.

 

[Jabba]

But once the ball has been found, he has no right to play the provisional.

 

[timgolfy]

Ruling: 27-2c/2 Ball Believed to Be Original Found; Player Wishes to Ignore It and Continue Play with Provisional Ball

Q: At a par-3 hole, a player plays his tee shot into a heavy thicket. Since his ball may be lost, he hits a provisional ball that comes to rest near the hole. In the circumstances, it is advantageous to the player not to find his original ball. Accordingly, the player does not search for the original ball and walks directly toward his provisional ball. While the player is on his way to his provisional ball, a ball believed to be his original is found. The player is advised that his original ball may have been found. May the player ignore this ball and continue play with the provisional ball?

A: No. The player must inspect the ball that has been found and, if it is the player's original ball, he must continue play with it (or proceed under the unplayable ball Rule). The provisional ball must be abandoned – Rule 27-2c. See also Decision 27-2b/1.

 

[Marko77]

Assuming not in a hazard I don't get what the guys beef was. If the lie was not good with the original ball found why not declare unplayable and go back to the original spot and hit 3 from there.

As said, if he wasn't wanting to have the first one in play why call the 2nd a provisional?