Muscle Memory

[General Fade]

I've heard a lot about muscle memory in golf and other sports and body part positions etc being replicated when making an action and a lot of golf teachers use these words when citing drills etc.

My understanding is the brain controls muscles etc and if you were to cut off a direct function to the brian e.g. a nerve to a muscle/ limb it is'nt going to function.

Question is what's the thoughts on this with the golf swing?

Cheers, Fade

 

[ScienceBoy]

There are two golfers in you. Conscious and subconscious, call them C and S.

When golfer C plays you think about each movement, remember a position, try and repeat things from lessons etc. It works but it takes effort and often it goes wrong horribly. This golfer can play some great shots but needs to think about all the working parts, positions etc to make the movements needed at the time. One time its thinking about a turn, maybe the next week thinking about hinge etc.

Once golfer C gets the hang of it they eventual become golfer S, you get in the positions without thinking, you can make great shot after great shot and have no idea how it happens. In essence golfer C gets out of the way and just lets golfer S get on with it.

We all remember those rounds, the really good ones where we can hardly remember hitting a shot, those are the golfer S rounds.

If you go to the course as golfer

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Not convinced there is muscle memory in golf. You can build a good technique through repetition but as soon as you finish a round/range session the is no muscle memory and its reliant on your ability to repeat a good technique every time.

 

[Face breaker]

Same as walking, blinking, breathing, chewing, swallowing, riding a motorcycle, driving a car, scratching yer arse, farting, even having a pee or a turn-out, do it enough and it becomes second nature, you end up doing it without even thinking about it, that's muscle memory...

Play 2/3 rounds a week and you'll soon have the required muscle memory, how often you play will have a greater baring on how quick you acquire that skill, I used to ride motorcycles 7 days a week over about a 25yr period and although I haven't ridden for the last 3 or so years I have absolutely no doubt that I could climb straight back in the saddle tomorrow and within a few minutes/miles it'd be like I'd never stopped riding... :thup:

 

[Maninblack4612]

I've been golfing for 60+ years & I think I've got muscle amnesia. If I try to change my swing, no matter how much I practise, it never works & I eventually revert to my "natural" swing. I think you can handle one swing thought on the backswing & one on the downswing & I find that if I concentrate on the things that make my natural swing work I get better results than trying to swing textbook.

Perhaps if we were pros we'd be able to practise enough to develop muscle memory but for us mere mortals I don't think this is possible.

 

[Val]

Muscles don't have a memory. It's a daft term.

 

[Karl102]

Google procedural memory and meta cognition... will help you understand it.

 

[Val]

Google procedural memory and meta cognition... will help you understand it.

Spoken like a PE teacher eh :rofl:

 

[ScienceBoy]

Not convinced there is muscle memory in golf.

Do you consciously swing? Try playing without thinking about the swing at all.

I agree it's a silly term buy you are going to score better if you "get out of the way of your subconscious".

I think I'm having my issues triggering my swing because it's one of the concious bits left at the moment.

 

[garyinderry]

Its a simple term. your memory learns how to move the muscles. your muscles don't literally learn what to do.

 

[Capella]

Yeah, as others have already mentioned. It is not really located in the muscles. It is more a hardwired transitway through your brain (and partly through the nerve bundles in your spine), making the action feel natural, because the conscious part of the brain does not have to interfere and pull each wire individually.

That's the reason that changes in the golf swing are so difficult to make. Because we not only have to learn something new, but also overwrite and then deconstruct the hardwired pathway that is already there. That's why changing even a little thing, like the grip or an angle in the take-away or something like that often leads to us missing the ball completely or at least feel as if we have never swung a club before. Because technically, we haven't. Not that way. The moment we leave that hardwired motorway through our brain we are hacking our way through synaptic bushland again. If we hack often enough along a certain path, a new motorway will eventually form. But it takes many repetitions (experts quote something between 4000 and 10000 here, but you will end up with something like a usable country lane much quicker than that, thankfully).

Interestingly enough, those connections are molded into place during sleeping hours. Alcohol, even small amounts, massively hinder this process. So when you are trying to learn a new skill, give your brain plenty of rest and stay off alcohol for the time being. Progress is much faster that way. That does not just apply to golf or sports in general, but to any new skill you wish to pick up.

 

[jim8flog]

When you walk do you think " I must put my left foot forward, rest on it then put my right foot forward" or do you just walk thinking about where you are getting to.

What they call muscle memory in golf is about the same thing - it's about thinking about where you want the ball to go rather than how is it going to get there.

Calling it 'sub conscious automatic reaction' would be more realistic but that is a bit of a mouthful.

 

[Foxholer]

'Muscle memory' doesn't exist - except as a bad description, but useful concept, for Procedural Memory!

 

[Tiger Woods]

No such thing as muscle memory, Adam young covers this in his book the practice manual.

 

[Fish]

Never mind muscle memory, I walk into the kitchen and then forget why I've gone in their 😳

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

I am currently 'setting' at address prior to every shot. Why? I want to get my body and mind used to the feeling of a hip turn (which I never really had) and having my arms and wrists 'just so' at the set position.

At first it felt a bit weird - but through repetition it no longer feels weird. But I must keep doing it for some time so that the mind learns what to do to create the set position I want - without me having to remind it prior to every shot. The body will eventually be able to interpret what my mind is telling it to do to create the set position without me actually thinking about it. Not sure it's muscle memory though - though I suppose you could interpret it that way.

 

[ScienceBoy]

'Muscle memory' doesn't exist - except as a bad description, but useful concept, for Procedural Memory!

What does exist is the science behind a term that is often misunderstood, I've never liked it as a phrase at all.

In simple terms the more a synaptic pathway in the brain is used the less resistance the electrical impulse down it has.

To change the pathway it must be used enough to be have less resistance than the old one. The less a pathway is used, the more resistance it has as its insulation degrades.

We can override the resistance to some degree with concious thought, it works but not 100% and all the time, you can end up using a mix of new and old pathways.

Pathways here are positions, movements and actions in a golf swing.

 

[jim8flog]

Never mind muscle memory, I walk into the kitchen and then forget why I've gone in their 

Should that be mussel memory

 

[Karl102]

Spoken like a PE teacher eh :rofl:

Haha! Got my nerd on! 🤓