Elbow Tendinitis - The cause?

[bluewolf]

Ok, so I've spent the last 12 months struggling badly with Tendinitis in my right elbow. It took me out of the game for 6 months last year, and currently has me on the sidelines for another few weeks at least... My thoughts on the cause have always tended towards the fact that I use heavy shafts in my irons (DG S300's) and I've been actively looking for replacements that will alleviate the problem....

However, I've been chatting to a friend and local Pro, who has given me another possible reason for the problem. His theory is that the weight is a minor issue, but that the Vibration through the shaft is the main cause. Having witnessed the prolonged vibration of a steel shaft (quite surprised by the amount of time the shaft vibrated for TBH), it would seem that this theory carries some weight....

So, I've been looking at shaft dampeners (such as these - http://www.golfsmith.com/product/30028716/true-temper-sensicore-inserts-8-pack#. ). The cost of the product is reasonable, however, the likelihood of needing new grips as well makes it more interesting....

My question (finally), what do you think? Is this a reasonable theory and will these shaft dampeners reduce the negative effects on my elbows?

Thanks for taking the time to read...:thup:

 

[guest100718]

Ok, so I've spent the last 12 months struggling badly with Tendinitis in my right elbow. It took me out of the game for 6 months last year, and currently has me on the sidelines for another few weeks at least... My thoughts on the cause have always tended towards the fact that I use heavy shafts in my irons (DG S300's) and I've been actively looking for replacements that will alleviate the problem....

However, I've been chatting to a friend and local Pro, who has given me another possible reason for the problem. His theory is that the weight is a minor issue, but that the Vibration through the shaft is the main cause. Having witnessed the prolonged vibration of a steel shaft (quite surprised by the amount of time the shaft vibrated for TBH), it would seem that this theory carries some weight....

So, I've been looking at shaft dampeners (such as these - http://www.golfsmith.com/product/30028716/true-temper-sensicore-inserts-8-pack#. ). The cost of the product is reasonable, however, the likelihood of needing new grips as well makes it more interesting....

My question (finally), what do you think? Is this a reasonable theory and will these shaft dampeners reduce the negative effects on my elbows?

Thanks for taking the time to read...:thup:

Ive been suffering with it in my left arm. I found one of the arm brace things you can buy has helped.

 

[bluewolf]

Ive been suffering with it in my left arm. I found one of the arm brace things you can buy has helped.

That's what I'm currently using mate, but all it has done is to hold the issue at bay while I'm playing. As soon as I take it off, the pain is immediate and very limiting.. It's my own fault for attempting to play through it in its initial stages..

 

[the_coach]

Often seems to happen when the arm swing is at some odds with the body rotation, in the folks I've seen suffer from it.
Often in the left elbow with RH golfers.
If the left arm in the swing fights the rotation in a way that there's more of an arm swing that either moves swings out & away from the body, if you like in a motion that uses the arms to deliver an in to out swing, the the left elbow bears the brunt of impact working outwards whilst the body rotation is working left as a result there's a tremendous amount of pressure on the elbow in particular.

Also this pressure on the elbow is also great for someone holding the forearms 'up' & away against the leftwards body rotation in a swing thats swinging leftways through impact so the elbow receives all that pressure as the arms are trying to hold off & keep the face as square as possible, so has to use force to stop the right forearm rotating over the left or the ball would start a good ways left. in the extreme this results in the chicken wing.

Although these two swings are working in opposite directions the extra force exerted on the left elbow is pretty extreme, the common denominator in both is the upper left arm is a good ways from the upper chest in both kinds of motions (in all good swing motions the upper left arm is supported to & through impact by resting on the upper pec) so the upper left arm & elbow is working left with the body rotation & not against the leftward body rotation as it does in the other two swing motions.

You can feel the support of the upper left arm & elbow & upper chest with the body rotation down & through impact simply by swinging your left arm alone (no club, no right arm) with the rotation of the body turning through left, by making this motion & keeping your upper left arm on your chest as you do, the open left palm when you do this goes into that facing skywards 'catch the raindrops' position as the left arm & the body move leftwards (before it folds & moves upwards) that Snead & a lot of the older time players spoke about, should feel less pressure in the elbow joint as a result.

On the other question, would have though anything that helps dampen the shaft if you suffer from this would be helpful, especially if you hit a bunch of shots from a mat every week. Though have no experience of these shafts or additions inside a shaft to dampen the vibs, so no idea if they work or not.

 

[bluewolf]

Often seems to happen when the arm swing is at some odds with the body rotation, in the folks I've seen suffer from it.
Often in the left elbow with RH golfers.
If the left arm in the swing fights the rotation in a way that there's more of an arm swing that either moves swings out & away from the body, if you like in a motion that uses the arms to deliver an in to out swing, the the left elbow bears the brunt of impact working outwards whilst the body rotation is working left as a result there's a tremendous amount of pressure on the elbow in particular.

Also this pressure on the elbow is also great for someone holding the forearms 'up' & away against the leftwards body rotation in a swing thats swinging leftways through impact so the elbow receives all that pressure as the arms are trying to hold off & keep the face as square as possible, so has to use force to stop the right forearm rotating over the left or the ball would start a good ways left. in the extreme this results in the chicken wing.

Although these two swings are working in opposite directions the extra force exerted on the left elbow is pretty extreme, the common denominator in both is the upper left arm is a good ways from the upper chest in both kinds of motions (in all good swing motions the upper left arm is supported to & through impact by resting on the upper pec) so the upper left arm & elbow is working left with the body rotation & not against the leftward body rotation as it does in the other two swing motions.

You can feel the support of the upper left arm & elbow & upper chest with the body rotation down & through impact simply by swinging your left arm alone (no club, no right arm) with the rotation of the body turning through left, by making this motion & keeping your upper left arm on your chest as you do, the open left palm when you do this goes into that facing skywards 'catch the raindrops' position as the left arm & the body move leftwards (before it folds & moves upwards) that Snead & a lot of the older time players spoke about, should feel less pressure in the elbow joint as a result.

On the other question, would have though anything that helps dampen the shaft if you suffer from this would be helpful, especially if you hit a bunch of shots from a mat every week. Though have no experience of these shafts or additions inside a shaft to dampen the vibs, so no idea if they work or not.

fantastic post again The Coach. I'm in full agreement that the root cause is a fault in the swing. The problematic part is that it's my right elbow and I'm a right handed golfer. Previously I've put it down to an overly flat swing. I've been working on this with some success recently but the problem reappears every time my swing reverts to its original fault. I was just hoping that the shaft dampeners would mean that I don't need to buy lighter shafted irons.

 

[the_coach]

fantastic post again The Coach. I'm in full agreement that the root cause is a fault in the swing. The problematic part is that it's my right elbow and I'm a right handed golfer. Previously I've put it down to an overly flat swing. I've been working on this with some success recently but the problem reappears every time my swing reverts to its original fault. I was just hoping that the shaft dampeners would mean that I don't need to buy lighter shafted irons.

Do you mean 'flat' both ways, going back & coming back through impact?

 

[bluewolf]

Do you mean 'flat' both ways, going back & coming back through impact?

Predominantly yes. I think that I'm rotating my right elbow at the top of the backswing and then having to rotate it back at speed during impact. I have improved this area recently, but the damage is still there.

 

[the_coach]

Predominantly yes. I think that I'm rotating my right elbow at the top of the backswing and then having to rotate it back at speed during impact. I have improved this area recently, but the damage is still there.

Yeah not good, with the pain that is. Guessing if you could get a little ways steeper going back then the path coming through would be a ways more neutral & not so much pressure on the elbow, give the elbow more time to re-rotate & extend through impact. Though changing technique some unfortunately usually means the game goes south temporarily. Guessing overall though it could be worth it.

Ironically speaking of the left arm support in the earlier post, that could still help you here but in a different way.
So if you kept your left upper arm in contact with the upper chest going back first move doing nothing with the hands except holding the handle then the club head would go back straighter so as the body turns the backswing would be a ways steeper going to the top right arm folds with less rotation of the elbow, shaft is over right shoulder at top instead of back behind you & a ways flatter.
From there as long as you start down from the ground up the path down & through is more neutral (a good ways nearer the 0º ball/target line) so more time a for the right forearm to rotate but less rotation so less pressure on the elbow. You still have a path coming from the inside, just not as much as a flat back to flat through swing. Might be worth a go.

 

[Liverbirdie]

Well done the coach for listening intently and going through it all with Bluewolf. I havent a clue on all technical things to do with swings, but is it worth Danny sending you a video of his swing? A picture paints a 1,000 words......

We want our old wolf back.......:thup:

 

[the_coach]

Always happy to give my take on stuff, in whatever way, to see if it helps folks any. Nothing worse than either pain everytime you play or folks with the different problem of just struggling with how to get the club on the ball. Can be a dispiriting & lonely place to be if for whichever reason things are not going too well.

 

[bluewolf]

Always happy to give my take on stuff, in whatever way, to see if it helps folks any. Nothing worse than either pain everytime you play or folks with the different problem of just struggling with how to get the club on the ball. Can be a dispiriting & lonely place to be if for whichever reason things are not going too well.

Your help is very much appreciated Coach. Sorry for the delay in responding, I've been in work all night.. It's certainly good to know that I may be on the right path with regards to the flat swing causing an issue with the rotation of the elbow. I'll follow your guidelines as soon as I get back on the course and see if this alleviates the pain...:thup:

 

[the_coach]

Couple other things maybes worth thinking about to see if it helps any. If say your swing is as you say flat-ish but also more of an arm motion swing with less through body rotation.
That could mean that the body doesn't rotate as much through & after impact & the motion to deliver the club majors with the arms more (not saying that this is you, but with not knowing obviously what exactly happens with your swing, just kinda thinking out aloud with different possibilities so see if any have any resonance with you & strike a chord) but if more of an arm dominated motion & the body not rotating as much there would then be a point either just before, during or immediately after impact where the arms are going to more or less crash & slowed down as the torso would be in the way some.

Maybe the swing better both slightly steeper with more body rotation to square the face up, rather than being over armsy (as i said just thinking out aloud over possibilities, this 'more arms' might not be your swing motion at all)

But if so, so then you try the slightly steeper swing path with more body rotation into but importantly through & after impact to take the strain a ways off the arms. The obvious thing that may well happen, probably will, is once you've kinda got used to hitting a few on the range this way getting rid of the mi***** that undoubtedly will come, & it feels though through how the elbow is that it may be worth continuing along this route. You are going to get a ways different shot pattern (starting direction, curvature, flight traj that sort of stuff) it go left it could go right.

But the thing is, say for arguments sake you try it out, & say you have a pattern of shots that push right, pull hook left, whichever. If they are mostly all flying the same whichever ways but the elbow feels better, it's then going to be possible through either a grip change, slight ball position change, or body set up alignment change to get the direction & flight that you want.
So guess what I'm saying really is if this proves to be better for how the elbow is (may not but worth a try) then keep the 'new' swing motion & then have to look at the ways to get you back in control of how & where the ball flies, without going back to how you were swinging before, if you're pretty certain it's playing golf that's caused it in the first place. Unfortunately making changes will mean you ain't going to score as well for a while, no ways around that, if tech changes prove to be the ways to go.

Good port of call too if you haven't already would be finding a sports injury specialist who's dealt with a lot of golf related stuff, must be someone around somewhere not too far aways would have thought. Maybe the TPI titleist guys could point you in the
right direction.

Although nobody really wants too I know, you may need to give it complete rest for a bunch of weeks, as any kinda swing would still put some pressures through the elbow. But maybes you've tried the rest route already. Good luck with it.

 

[williamalex1]

I have problems in my left arm no pain when straight but very sore when bending, and i think its due to my swing being mostly arms and shoulders, with little lower body movement. Sometimes i have to drink with my right arm.:cheers: