Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

A tragic story about a friend of a friend was relayed to me last night.

Family of four - two parents with two daughters. Parents in their late 60s, one daughter is 42 and the other is 37. My friend is friends with one of the daughters.

Both parents smoked and have COPD. The mother got Covid and died not long before Christmas after a short battle with the disease.

Both father and eldest daughter were admitted with Covid just before Christmas. The daughter finally died yesterday morning. The father died last night. The eldest daughter has a teenage daughter herself and her dad long ago fled the scene.

This has left the youngest daughter on her own after having a full extended family just over two months ago.

Yes, all three who died had preexisting medical conditions which made Covid so much more dangerous to them but does anyone think that’s any comfort to those left behind? I’m sick of conspiracy theorists trumpeting this line of “99.7% survival rate” and “it’s just the flu” while the bodies continue to pile up for those who would otherwise be alive. I’m not ready to write people off because they’re not as physically fit as others.
 
Reading the post from Kellfire got me thinking

Right now we have a virus that is affecting the respiratory system and the ones most are risk as those people with breathing problems

So I wonder if it has seen more people stop smoking ?

My mate owns a couple of shops and we were speaking about it and he says the same people with the same issues still come in for their daily pack of fags

Trying not to be preachy because I used to smoke until I found out I had asthma but I still find it staggering the amount of people that you still see smoking - yep it’s a vice and addictive which I fully understand but this should be the perfect time to stop .

And then vaping ? I don’t know enough about the dangers or how safe it is but smoke still going into the lungs in a fashion so again whilst the risk isn’t as high surely there is some there ?

During the height of the drought a couple years back we actually introduced a smoking ban on the course - it was great to see no fag butts etc.
 
Liverpoolphil said:
Reading the post from Kellfire got me thinking

Right now we have a virus that is affecting the respiratory system and the ones most are risk as those people with breathing problems

So I wonder if it has seen more people stop smoking ?

My mate owns a couple of shops and we were speaking about it and he says the same people with the same issues still come in for their daily pack of fags

Trying not to be preachy because I used to smoke until I found out I had asthma but I still find it staggering the amount of people that you still see smoking - yep it’s a vice and addictive which I fully understand but this should be the perfect time to stop .

And then vaping ? I don’t know enough about the dangers or how safe it is but smoke still going into the lungs in a fashion so again whilst the risk isn’t as high surely there is some there ?

During the height of the drought a couple years back we actually introduced a smoking ban on the course - it was great to see no fag butts etc.
Click to expand...

Smoking is clearly a risk factor, not only for respiratory complications, but also vascular and multi-organ. It isn't quite correct to consider Covid as a virus which principally affects the respiratory system. It has systemic effects - broad effects on the whole person - that are inflammatory in nature. This can cause damage to organs and the vasculature. The people who die in the first couple of days tend to die from respiratory complications, but the characteristic course where someone appears to get better but then declines around day 7 is due to a large immune reaction by the body causing wide pared inflammatory effects. This can cause all sorts of bad things. Because the heart and lungs are the organs which are the main engine of the body, multi-organ failure tends to kill you by heart or respiratory failure, or both, but sometimes that is really caused by other organ failure putting pressure on the heart and lungs.

People who smoke tend to have a heightened state of inflammation at the best of times and are therefore more susceptible to this sort of damage. If they are a Type 2 Diabetic as well, that is a very bad combination.

Unless your hobby is catching knives with your teeth, stopping smoking is still probably the most effective health improvement anyone can make.
 
SaintHacker said:
And how life comes along to put things back into perspective. Last year our niece spent some time in a mental health specialist unit while she recovered from an operation, the cause of which had affected her brain function. While there she made friebds with a girl the same age (14) who was going through her own issues and being helped with her demons. We've just found out the girl took her own life yesterday. 15.
Have a good night lads.
Click to expand...
Thoughts with your daughter hope she is well.
 
Liverpoolphil said:
Reading the post from Kellfire got me thinking

Right now we have a virus that is affecting the respiratory system and the ones most are risk as those people with breathing problems

So I wonder if it has seen more people stop smoking ?
Click to expand...

You'd think so, but, I don't know how many recollect, but there were several reports, tv, press, putting forward the view that smokers were less affected by Covid?
I think it was a view of David Hockney, the artist.
Here is copy from the Observer paper.
David Hockney Says Smokers Have Developed an ‘Immune System’ Against Coronavirus
I don't think he was alone in his view, and I never did see any final verdict..
( if there could be one?).
My view is , that he is wrong, but.........
 
PhilTheFragger said:
Reopened
No political posts
No bickering

Simples ?

Members who ignore the above or who push the boundaries will get infractions which could lead to a ban .
Click to expand...

You know I don’t get this forum at times. We all have cabin fever. We are all struggling in some capacity or other. Some a lot more so than others. This forum is a release for some. We mention on some topics how people have to talk. Then launch personal attacks on people when they do. I mentioned the other week that this topic has become the new “ political” thread where it appears it is open season to lay into one another whilst using this topic as a reason to do that. If you did not like someone at Work or anywhere else you would not talk to them you would ignore them. May I suggest doing the same, put them on ignore.
 
Swinglowandslow said:
You'd think so, but, I don't know how many recollect, but there were several reports, tv, press, putting forward the view that smokers were less affected by Covid?
I think it was a view of David Hockney, the artist.
Here is copy from the Observer paper.
David Hockney Says Smokers Have Developed an ‘Immune System’ Against Coronavirus
I don't think he was alone in his view, and I never did see any final verdict..
( if there could be one?).
My view is , that he is wrong, but.........
Click to expand...

Had to pop into Tesco to return a phone the other day for me ma. I am In the same queue as e cigs, fags, lottery etc. In front of me was a woman who bought her 100 cigs, a woman who bought her “ usual” 40, a girl who bought her e cig stuff. The one thing they all had in common. They were not wearing masks.. They had lanyards to say as such. I thought it very odd.

I also find it odd that people that are exempt from wearing masks because of underlying health problems (inc damage caused by smoking) are more vulnerable. Yet are in the supermarkets which are on of the largest spreaders of Covid.
Fortunately I don’t smoke.
 
Tashyboy said:
You know I don’t get this forum at times. We all have cabin fever. We are all struggling in some capacity or other. Some a lot more so than others. This forum is a release for some. We mention on some topics how people have to talk. Then launch personal attacks on people when they do. I mentioned the other week that this topic has become the new “ political” thread where it appears it is open season to lay into one another whilst using this topic as a reason to do that. If you did not like someone at Work or anywhere else you would not talk to them you would ignore them. May I suggest doing the same, put them on ignore.
Click to expand...
Tash, using your example of the workplace, would you say nothing if the person you are ignoring is telling lies or spreading information that is simply rubbish? Or if 3 people who ignore you are sat together slagging you off about something you said and then twisting it, knowing full well you can hear what is being said, would you sit there and accept it?
 
[QUOTE="Ethan, post: 2295141, The people who die in the first couple of days tend to die from respiratory complications, but the characteristic course where someone appears to get better but then declines around day 7 is due to a large immune reaction by the body causing wide pared inflammatory effects.

Unless your hobby is catching knives with your teeth, stopping smoking is still probably the most effective health improvement anyone can make.[/QUOTE]

Thanks for this explanation. May I ask about a query that arises to my laymans mind.When you say a large immune reaction, does that mean you could have a too efficient immune system? Sounds simplistic and daft, but if someone takes supplements to improve their immune response, I.e vitamin D,
does this possibly cause a problem?
Hope I've put this in a half sensible way?

BTW - that last sentence of yours---???
 
Swinglowandslow said:
You'd think so, but, I don't know how many recollect, but there were several reports, tv, press, putting forward the view that smokers were less affected by Covid?
I think it was a view of David Hockney, the artist.
Here is copy from the Observer paper.
David Hockney Says Smokers Have Developed an ‘Immune System’ Against Coronavirus
I don't think he was alone in his view, and I never did see any final verdict..
( if there could be one?).
My view is , that he is wrong, but.........
Click to expand...

The well known pulmonologist David Hockney. Well, medical science might have to reconsider its position ....

There was some evidence early on that smokers appeared to be less likely to get Covid, but worse affected if they did. I think some of that was confounded, in other words, there were other explanatory factors that led to a spurious association. The general view now is that smoking is an additional risk factor for a bad outcome if you get Covid.
 
Swinglowandslow said:
Thanks for this explanation. May I ask about a query that arises to my laymans mind.When you say a large immune reaction, does that mean you could have a too efficient immune system? Sounds simplistic and daft, but if someone takes supplements to improve their immune response, I.e vitamin D,
does this possibly cause a problem?
Hope I've put this in a half sensible way?

BTW - that last sentence of yours---???
Click to expand...

Yes, essentially it is an over enthusiastic immune response known as cytokine release. It is basically a disorderly release of substances (cytokines) intended to attack intruders which instead damages the host. It happens more in men, which may be the reason women do better with Covid. Some of the drugs recently discussed in the media as good treatments for Covid, for example tocilizumab currently used as a treatment for rheumatoid arthritis, reduce the cytokine release.
 
Kellfire said:
A tragic story about a friend of a friend was relayed to me last night.

Family of four - two parents with two daughters. Parents in their late 60s, one daughter is 42 and the other is 37. My friend is friends with one of the daughters.

Both parents smoked and have COPD. The mother got Covid and died not long before Christmas after a short battle with the disease.

Both father and eldest daughter were admitted with Covid just before Christmas. The daughter finally died yesterday morning. The father died last night. The eldest daughter has a teenage daughter herself and her dad long ago fled the scene.

This has left the youngest daughter on her own after having a full extended family just over two months ago.

Yes, all three who died had preexisting medical conditions which made Covid so much more dangerous to them but does anyone think that’s any comfort to those left behind? I’m sick of conspiracy theorists trumpeting this line of “99.7% survival rate” and “it’s just the flu” while the bodies continue to pile up for those who would otherwise be alive. I’m not ready to write people off because they’re not as physically fit as others.
Click to expand...

You'll be agreeing vey strongly with Deborah James (a very vocal and cogent advocate of the rights of the very many - young and old - who have significantly compromised immunity due to a serious health/medical condition) in her strong rejection of the views of such as Lord Sumption (a high profile neo-liberal and libertarian).
 
Last edited:
Ethan said:
...but the characteristic course where someone appears to get better but then declines around day 7 is due to a large immune reaction by the body causing wide pared inflammatory effects. This can cause all sorts of bad things. Because the heart and lungs are the organs which are the main engine of the body, multi-organ failure tends to kill you by heart or respiratory failure, or both, but sometimes that is really caused by other organ failure putting pressure on the heart and lungs.
Click to expand...
This is precisely the course of what happened to my wife's 90+yr old aunt. No specific underlying conditions and 'sheltered' from the virus in a care home; diagnosed with Covid-19; after just over a week or so seemed to be getting better; no more than a couple of days later she passed. Though we do not know the actual cause of her death, I am assuming that it will be along the lines of the immune reaction described.
 
Last edited:
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
You'll be agreeing vey strongly with Deborah James (a very vocal and cogent advocate of the rights of the very many - young and old - who have significantly compromised immunity due to a serious health/medical condition) in her strong rejection of the views of such as Lord Sumption (a high profile -neo-liberal and libertarian).
Click to expand...

Yep.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
You'll be agreeing vey strongly with Deborah James (a very vocal and cogent advocate of the rights of the very many - young and old - who have significantly compromised immunity due to a serious health/medical condition) in her strong rejection of the views of such as Lord Sumption (a high profile -neo-liberal and libertarian).
Click to expand...

Sumption is in a lobbying group along with some of the Great Barrington crew - Sikora and Gupta. He basically remains a herd immunity advocate.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top