Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Absolutely ridiculous second dosage of vaccine been delayed up to twelve weeks from first :

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...cond-stage-nhs-vaccinations-delayed-across-uk

How is that even ethical going against the vaccines developers / scientists guidelines on how it should be taken?

The vaccine developers will advise on effectivity of different dosage regimes in respect of an individual developing COVID-19 and reducing their transmission; the epidemiologists will advise on strategies for taking advantage of the different regimes with the objective of controlling and reducing the spread of infection between individuals within a community.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Absolutely ridiculous second dosage of vaccine been delayed up to twelve weeks from first :

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...cond-stage-nhs-vaccinations-delayed-across-uk

How is that even ethical going against the vaccines developers / scientists guidelines on how it should be taken?

Yeah, sounds absolutetely ludicrous this.

"Explaining the rationale for the change, the chief medical officers said in a statement, quoted by Stevens in his letter: “Prioritising the first doses of vaccine for as many people as possible on the priority list will protect the greatest number of at-risk people overall in the shortest possible time and will have the greatest impact on reducing mortality, severe disease and hospitalisations and in protecting the NHS and equivalent health services."

Bonkers.

 

[Billysboots]

Really sad but annoying story this one.

Friend of my daughters - hasn't taken a blind bit of notice of most restrictions. Gets together at Christmas with his family - around 15 of them so puts them in the same category of stupidity. He then falls ill on Boxing Day and gets a positive test. One of his grand-parents falls ill a couple of days later and died yesterday from Covid. His first post on social media - blames the Government and the NHS for not doing more for him.

What honestly can you do?

You can’t do anything. Far too many people have viewed this pandemic, since the start, as everyone else’s problem.

Unfortunately the internet is full of tragedies like this one and it matters not how many such stories there are - they make not a blind bit of difference to people like this who, even now, think this virus can’t get them.

 

[AdamW]

Yeah, sounds absolutetely ludicrous this.

"Explaining the rationale for the change, the chief medical officers said in a statement, quoted by Stevens in his letter: “Prioritising the first doses of vaccine for as many people as possible on the priority list will protect the greatest number of at-risk people overall in the shortest possible time and will have the greatest impact on reducing mortality, severe disease and hospitalisations and in protecting the NHS and equivalent health services."

Bonkers.

Pfizer are not happy about it.

It is unethical plain and simple the people who have already had the first shot did not agree to having the second against the manufactures advice.

So yes it is bonkers.

"This schedule was not what was trialled, as Pfizer/BioNTech immediately pointed out. Their phase 3 final trial showed people began to be protected from 12 days after one vaccination – but nearly all were given two shots within three weeks. “There are no data to demonstrate that protection after the first dose is sustained after 21 days,” the company said."

 

[Lump]

A family friend has just died, his death has been put down to COVID.
He was diagnosed with COVID early on( first lockdown) but it was actually un-diagnosed cancer that was making him ill. Turns out he had stage 4 cancer. Less than 2 months from finding out to when he passed.
This is why I don’t believe the death numbers are a true reflection of what’s happening.
We are now at the point where un-diagnosed illnesses are taking life’s due to no treatment and being ticked up to COVID as they may have had a positive test within 28 days.

 

[Blue in Munich]

Really sad but annoying story this one.

Friend of my daughters - hasn't taken a blind bit of notice of most restrictions. Gets together at Christmas with his family - around 15 of them so puts them in the same category of stupidity. He then falls ill on Boxing Day and gets a positive test. One of his grand-parents falls ill a couple of days later and died yesterday from Covid. His first post on social media - blames the Government and the NHS for not doing more for him.

What honestly can you do?

What should be done and what the law permits you to do are two very different things.

I suppose the limit would be calling him out in the same social media.

The level of stupidity is mind blowing.

 

[Dando]

A family friend has just died, his death has been put down to COVID.
He was diagnosed with COVID early on( first lockdown) but it was actually un-diagnosed cancer that was making him ill. Turns out he had stage 4 cancer. Less than 2 months from finding out to when he passed.
This is why I don’t believe the death numbers are a true reflection of what’s happening.
We are now at the point where un-diagnosed illnesses are taking life’s due to no treatment and being ticked up to COVID as they may have had a positive test within 28 days.

totally agree with you. how can we believe the death numbers when anyone dying within 28 days of a positive result has Covid as the cause of death.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Pfizer are not happy about it.

It is unethical plain and simple the people who have already had the first shot did not agree to having the second against the manufactures advice.

So yes it is bonkers.

"This schedule was not what was trialled, as Pfizer/BioNTech immediately pointed out. Their phase 3 final trial showed people began to be protected from 12 days after one vaccination – but nearly all were given two shots within three weeks. “There are no data to demonstrate that protection after the first dose is sustained after 21 days,” the company said."

Now, I'm no doctor, but if the chief medical officers and other scientists around the world argues for this solution I'm happy to go with it. Of course Pfizer is going to say what they say. They haven't tested it in this way, so therefore they can't say it's gonna work as well as the trial. They're covering all angles, as they should.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

totally agree with you. how can we believe the death numbers when anyone dying within 28 days of a positive result has Covid as the cause of death.

Ethan amongst others have explained this numerous times. A stake has to be put in the ground somewhere and numbers are measured from that stake. The stake may not be in the ‘right’ or ‘best’ place - but as it is difficult to precisely define that position it is best we just have one - and as long as we do not move the stake then we can see how numbers are changing relative to that stake. And as much as anything else when looking at how measures are impacting numbers it is relative changes as well as absolute numbers that are important.

After all is not the par of a hole just that - a stake in the ground based upon some criteria against which we measure our own performance in relative terms. Our golfing stake in the ground for a hole is not what Rory would score on average were he to play it 20 times; nor is it what a beginner would score on average - in both scenarios our own relative performance would be quite different - but we could measure our change...and that of our fellows.

 

[Deleted member 21258]

Absolutely ridiculous second dosage of vaccine been delayed up to twelve weeks from first :

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2...cond-stage-nhs-vaccinations-delayed-across-uk

How is that even ethical going against the vaccines developers / scientists guidelines on how it should be taken?

I would perhaps look at it another way, with an example.

There is an ultra scare resource, lets call it food and you have 2 loaves of bread.

One person needs 2 loaves of bread to survive normally 12 weeks.

However You have 2 people to keep alive for 12 weeks.

Do you give both loaves to one person, or perhaps give one loaf of bread to each of those 2 people and hopefully keep both alive for longer, until the next loaves becomes available. It may mean both will become hungry/slighter iller than if they had two loaves but....

I know what I would do and what is really ethical to do.

In support of that, I did uploaded a link to a scientific paper done about a month ago iirc, that supports that theory with the Pzifer vaccines and that one dose is a good thing to do and provides alot of protection. As well as the Oxford vaccine 2nd dose was given at various timing during the trials, again I uploaded their own Lancet paper that confirms that yesterday to this website.

Hope that helps.

 

[Pathetic Shark]

What should be done and what the law permits you to do are two very different things.

I suppose the limit would be calling him out in the same social media.

The level of stupidity is mind blowing.

Junior Shark has told me she has several times gone to put something and then thought better and deleted it. He used a phrase "my granddad fought in the war and this is the way he was treated" - apparently his grandad would have been two in 1945. She is expecting a post later "we should get together to celebrate his life because it's what he would have wanted". No what he would have wanted would be to still be alive.

 

[woofers]

What should be done and what the law permits you to do are two very different things.

Like Staying at Home, or going out to play golf ?

 

[woofers]

No what he would have wanted would be to still be alive.

I was sent the following “If we isolate now, when we can meet again no one will be missing”

 

[Billysboots]

Junior Shark has told me she has several times gone to put something and then thought better and deleted it. He used a phrase "my granddad fought in the war and this is the way he was treated" - apparently his grandad would have been two in 1945. She is expecting a post later "we should get together to celebrate his life because it's what he would have wanted". No what he would have wanted would be to still be alive.

That attitude absolutely boils my urine.

His grandad hasn’t been let down by the NHS or government. He’s been let down by his own family.

This fella is either a thick skinned imbecile or is suffering a massive guilt trip, knowing he has contributed towards this awful outcome, but seeking to blame others in order to purge that guilt.

As I don’t know him it is impossible for me to say which.

 

[Backache]

totally agree with you. how can we believe the death numbers when anyone dying within 28 days of a positive result has Covid as the cause of death.

Everyone who dies within 28 days of their first covid test does not automatically have Covid as a cause of death.
The cause of death is what is put down on a death certificate and is what the doctor caring for someone thinks they died from.
If a doctor does not think they died of covid they will not have covid entered on the death certificate and as far as the ONS are concerned they did not die of covid and will not be counted in the final numbers.
Where they will be counted is in the quick reckoning used to produce daily updates because it is a quick way of getting an idea of what the mortality is on an ongoing basis.

 

[Pathetic Shark]

That attitude absolutely boils my urine.

His grandad hasn’t been let down by the NHS or government. He’s been let down by his own family.

This fella is either a thick skinned imbecile or is suffering a massive guilt trip, knowing he has contributed towards this awful outcome, but seeking to blame others in order to purge that guilt.

As I don’t know him it is impossible for me to say which.

She's just unfriended him - she is as annoyed (insert actual phrase here) as we all seem to be.

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Here's an update from a parallel universe, also known as Sweden.

Sweden's strategy is still mostly down to "recommendations".

Don't meet other people from outside your household, but if you do, please do it outside, but if that doesn't work you can meet up indoors...

Don't go to shops, bigger shopping centres or travel anywhere if not needed. The Swedish prime minister has even held press conferences in the last month actually having a go at the Swedish people for not following the recommendations.

Now, of course that only goes for the regular people of Sweden.

19th December - The chief executive of the "Community protection and preparedness", Dan Eliasson, a part of Swedens authorities, travels to Mallorca for a christmas holiday.

20th December - The Swedish prime minister, Stefan Lofven, goes to one of Stockholms biggest and most crowded shopping centres, no mask (as that isn't even recommended), to buy a watch.

26th December - Swedens minsiter of Justice and Migration, Morgan Johansson, goes bargain hunting in a shopping mall in Lund.

Christmas - Swedens finance minister, Magdalena Andersson, goes for a ski holiday in northern Sweden.

Astonishing.

 

[Imurg]

Here's an update from a parallel universe, also known as Sweden.

Sweden's strategy is still mostly down to "recommendations".

Don't meet other people from outside your household, but if you do, please do it outside, but if that doesn't work you can meet up indoors...

Don't go to shops, bigger shopping centres or travel anywhere if not needed. The Swedish prime minister has even held press conferences in the last month actually having a go at the Swedish people for not following the recommendations.

Now, of course that only goes for the regular people of Sweden.

19th December - The chief executive of the "Community protection and preparedness", Dan Eliasson, a part of Swedens authorities, travels to Mallorca for a christmas holiday.

20th December - The Swedish prime minister, Stefan Lofven, goes to one of Stockholms biggest and most crowded shopping centres, no mask (as that isn't even recommended), to buy a watch.

26th December - Swedens minsiter of Justice and Migration, Morgan Johansson, goes bargain hunting in a shopping mall in Lund.

Christmas - Swedens finance minister, Magdalena Andersson, goes for a ski holiday in northern Sweden.

Astonishing.

Nice to see that it's not just our politicians then......

 

[Deleted member 25172]

Nice to see that it's not just our politicians then......

Isn't it just? And these are the absolute top top people were talking of. It drives me absolutely insane. It also makes me despise these hypocrites which if put into words would black ball me from here.

 

[chrisd]

Nice to see that it's not just our politicians then......

Are you allowed to use the word "Politicians"