Coronavirus - how is it/has it affected you?

Just listened to someone on the Radio from the WHO, he was saying countries should try to find alternatives to total lockdown wherever possible and he thought the UK were doing well in their efforts to tackle the virus. He said people here should not think they are in a worse situation than many other countries.
 
SocketRocket said:
Just listened to someone on the Radio from the WHO, he was saying countries should try to find alternatives to total lockdown wherever possible and he thought the UK were doing well in their efforts to tackle the virus. He said people here should not think they are in a worse situation than many other countries.
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Roger Daltrey gets around ??
 
bobmac said:
And yet, still you argue and criticise.
If it matters not, move on.

''You're only here for a short visit. Don't hurry, don't worry. And be sure to smell the flowers along the way.''
Walter Hagen
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In this I simply observe. And as has been mentioned - we have a T&T system that is not making any significant difference - and I guess that we are all concerned with that as we might all be impacted by it falling short of the mark set for it. As has been demonstrated elsewhere - that need not have been the case. It was always going to be difficult - but it need not have been the case.

However I am sure that a review once we have this under control will identify where it could have been done better, and a revised system will be put in place.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
In this I simply observe. And as has been mentioned - we have a T&T system that is not making any significant difference - and I guess that we are all concerned with that as we might all be impacted by it falling short of the mark set for it. As has been demonstrated elsewhere - that need not have been the case. It was always going to be difficult - but it need not have been the case.

However I am sure that a review once we have this under control will identify where it could have been done better, and a revised system will be put in place.
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How do you know the T&T system isn't making any difference. A very large part of the country has fairly low infection rates, maybe the system is helping there. Do you have some evidence it's not making a difference in the North, maybe it would be much worse without it. Track and Trace can't cannot change people's behaviour and that's what needs changing to make a real difference.
 
SocketRocket said:
How do you know the T&T system isn't making any difference. A very large part of the country has fairly low infection rates, maybe the system is helping there. Do you have some evidence it's not making a difference in the North, maybe it would be much worse without it. Track and Trace can't cannot change people's behaviour and that's what needs changing to make a real difference.
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See @HK post #9864 from which I quote...

Seems SAGE are saying the test and trace system is having a marginal impact on the spread. Which is a little depressing as I was under the impression that was a sound way to try and contain the spread.

And for backup of that assertion of @HKs which you might choose to dismiss...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ce-having-marginal-impact-tackling-virus.html
 
SaintHacker said:
Ah yes, the daily mail. Thats gospel then...
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Indeed - many seem to have sworn by it in the past as their trusted source of accurate information on quite complex matters...

However maybe it is best to quote directly from the SAGE paper of 21st September S0769 Summary of the effectiveness and harms of different non-pharmaceutical interventions

An effective test, trace and isolate (TTI) system is important to reduce the incidence of infections in the community. Estimates of the effectiveness of this system on R are difficult to ascertain. The relatively low levels of engagement with the system (comparing ONS incidence estimates with NHS Test and Trace numbers) coupled with testing delays and likely poor rates of adherence with self-isolation suggests that this system is having a marginal impact on transmission at the moment. Unless the system grows at the same rate as the epidemic, and support is given to people to enable them to adhere to self-isolation, it is likely that the impact of Test, Trace and Isolate will further decline in the future.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
See @HK post #9864 from which I quote...

Seems SAGE are saying the test and trace system is having a marginal impact on the spread. Which is a little depressing as I was under the impression that was a sound way to try and contain the spread.
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Test and Trace is a sound, indeed essential, way to control a pandemic. But if it being totally cocked up ......
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
Indeed - many seem to have sworn by it in the past as their trusted source of accurate information on quite complex matters...

However maybe it is best to quote directly from the SAGE paper of 21st September S0769 Summary of the effectiveness and harms of different non-pharmaceutical interventions

An effective test, trace and isolate (TTI) system is important to reduce the incidence of infections in the community. Estimates of the effectiveness of this system on R are difficult to ascertain. The relatively low levels of engagement with the system (comparing ONS incidence estimates with NHS Test and Trace numbers) coupled with testing delays and likely poor rates of adherence with self-isolation suggests that this system is having a marginal impact on transmission at the moment. Unless the system grows at the same rate as the epidemic, and support is given to people to enable them to adhere to self-isolation, it is likely that the impact of Test, Trace and Isolate will further decline in the future.
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But other than a direct quote from the SAGE scientists, purveyors of the science that the government tell us they are following, sometimes, where is your proof SAGE said what you quoted they said?
 
As an aside, it is interesting that one of the objections to some interventions, pharmacological or otherwise, is that there is no evidence of effectiveness. I would argue out that evidence can sometimes be replaced by common sense.

There is no randomised controlled trial showing that having a parachute is more effective than not having one for people who fall out of planes, but a small degree of common sense seems adequate here. Likewise, some interventions for Covid that carry little downside and seem to obviously offer a benefit should not generally be too strongly opposed.
 
SwingsitlikeHogan said:
See @HK post #9864 from which I quote...

Seems SAGE are saying the test and trace system is having a marginal impact on the spread. Which is a little depressing as I was under the impression that was a sound way to try and contain the spread.

And for backup of that assertion of @HKs which you might choose to dismiss...

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...ce-having-marginal-impact-tackling-virus.html
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That doesn't address the points I made. How can you show the current system is not making a difference based on how many of the population are using it. If people don't use it then it can't help.

I also said that T&T can't change people's attitude or the way they conduct themselves and IMO this is the underpinning reason for the increased infections.
 
SocketRocket said:
That doesn't address the points I made. How can you show the current system is not making a difference based on how many of the population are using it. If people don't use it then it can't help.

I also said that T&T can't change people's attitude or the way they conduct themselves and IMO this is the underpinning reason for the increased infections.
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Whatever the reason or reasons - and the SAGE paper cites a few - their opinion is that it is only having a marginal impact on transmission. Of course we can all have our own views, however on this I tend to accept the analysis and conclusions of SAGE - and their view is that it is not simply lack of public engagement.
 
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Ethan said:
As an aside, it is interesting that one of the objections to some interventions, pharmacological or otherwise, is that there is no evidence of effectiveness. I would argue out that evidence can sometimes be replaced by common sense.

There is no randomised controlled trial showing that having a parachute is more effective than not having one for people who fall out of planes, but a small degree of common sense seems adequate here. Likewise, some interventions for Covid that carry little downside and seem to obviously offer a benefit should not generally be too strongly opposed.
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LOL.

Excellent analogy.
 
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