Would you buy an electric car?

Lord Tyrion

Money List Winner
Joined
Sep 9, 2014
Messages
22,014
Location
Northumberland
We know everything you wrote. Although why you would have the heating on, the heating seats on AND the air con on at the same time is puzzling.
I run with the aircon on 12 months of the year. In summer it runs cold, winter it runs warm. It is recommended. In winter I'll have the heated seats on.

I'm not understanding your point there.
 

BiMGuy

Well-known member
Joined
Oct 9, 2020
Messages
3,744
I run with the aircon on 12 months of the year. In summer it runs cold, winter it runs warm. It is recommended. In winter I'll have the heated seats on.

I'm not understanding your point there.
I think there is some confusion between air conditioning and cooling. It’s a common misconception.
 

ColchesterFC

Journeyman Pro
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
6,062
Hydrogen may well be the way forward but don't you need electricity to generate it? 🤔
There are already plans to generate hydrogen from wind turbines. There's a demo project off Aberdeen to retrofit a wind turbine so that during the day when demand is higher it will feed in to the grid. At night when demand is lower it will switch to generating hydrogen from sea water. There are some buses in Aberdeen already running on hydrogen, although not from the wind turbine source.
 

bobmac

Major Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
25,857
Location
Lincolnshire
I run with the aircon on 12 months of the year. In summer it runs cold, winter it runs warm. It is recommended. In winter I'll have the heated seats on.

I'm not understanding your point there.
The point was, turning on everything and loading up the van reduces the range of the van. I was telling BM that most people know that already
 

bobmac

Major Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
25,857
Location
Lincolnshire
There are already plans to generate hydrogen from wind turbines. There's a demo project off Aberdeen to retrofit a wind turbine so that during the day when demand is higher it will feed in to the grid. At night when demand is lower it will switch to generating hydrogen from sea water. There are some buses in Aberdeen already running on hydrogen, although not from the wind turbine source.
So you get electricity from wind turbines and use it to separate the Hydrogen from Oxygen which is then turned back into electricity in the car to power the motor.
Why the expensive middle man?
Turbine/solar/thermal.......electricity...........car.
I agree it may be more suitable for larger vehicles but I don't think it will ever work for cars.

And are people really going to fork out £50k on a new Toyota Mirai that does 26mpg and a range of 270 miles?
I know the costs will come down but so will the cost of EVs.
 

ColchesterFC

Journeyman Pro
Joined
Jan 28, 2013
Messages
6,062
So you get electricity from wind turbines and use it to separate the Hydrogen from Oxygen which is then turned back into electricity in the car to power the motor.
Why the expensive middle man?
Turbine/solar/thermal.......electricity...........car.
I agree it may be more suitable for larger vehicles but I don't think it will ever work for cars.

And are people really going to fork out £50k on a new Toyota Mirai that does 26mpg and a range of 270 miles?
I know the costs will come down but so will the cost of EVs.
I've no idea, that's all well above my pay grade. I just get told that the boat I'm joining is in Aberdeen and we're doing a route survey for a pipeline to bring hydrogen ashore from the turbine. I then turn up and run the survey.
 

bobmac

Major Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
25,857
Location
Lincolnshire
For those people who want electric cars that can drive 500 miles on a 5 minute charge, this will not interest you.

For those who are interested in a new idea, please read on.

Electric car conversion kit
Basically, you take your little ICE run-around to the garage in the morning, the garage removes the oily smelly bit and replaces it with an electric battery and motor. Takes about 4 hours so you collect it at lunchtime.
Cost depends on size of battery and govt. grants but could be as low as €5,000

 

Bunkermagnet

Journeyman Pro
Joined
May 14, 2014
Messages
6,336
Location
Kent
We know everything you wrote. Although why you would have the heating on, the heating seats on AND the air con on at the same time is puzzling.
I have the heated seat on most of the time because I have a bad back and need the heat to help ease it down. In my book, you do whatever you can to be able to work:)
 

RichA

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 24, 2021
Messages
1,889
Location
UK
I have the heated seat on most of the time because I have a bad back and need the heat to help ease it down. In my book, you do whatever you can to be able to work:)
Likewise. Heated seat is on pretty much all year round. Especially when driving to the golf club. Muscles prewarmed by the heated seat = less time wasted on a warm up.
 

bobmac

Major Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
25,857
Location
Lincolnshire
I have the heated seat on most of the time because I have a bad back and need the heat to help ease it down. In my book, you do whatever you can to be able to work:)
Puzzle solved, thank you.
I've never had a car with heated seats so don't know the benefits, I should have worked harder at school ;)
 

Bunkermagnet

Journeyman Pro
Joined
May 14, 2014
Messages
6,336
Location
Kent
The point was, turning on everything and loading up the van reduces the range of the van. I was telling BM that most people know that already
What I do know, is that the mileage I get form my VW Transporter more or less matches the claimed mileage in the brochure, and that’s including driving in central London. The chaps I have spoken to who work for a manufacturer service agent and who uses electric vans have each said that empty, the range is ok. As soon as you load in what you need to carry and use anything within the van then the range drops by over half.
perhaps the manufacturerS of the electric vehicles should quote range when fully loaded and using all ancillaries.
 

greenone

Active member
Joined
Nov 15, 2020
Messages
404
Hydrogen would still be electric. Just the hydrogen fuel cell will power the motors rather than a lithium battery.
Not all of them. If the infrastructure was in place a new Mazda Rx would be at the top of my shopping list. Or convert the one that's been sat in the garage for the last 6 years.
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
759
I’ve just let my model x go which was on salary sacrifice, did 80k in it over 2-3 years and genuinely it convinced me I’d always have an EV on my drive. Range loss was fairly insignificant along with service costs.

New car time I was looking at going for the Taycan on salary sacrifice however an opportunity arose where my boss proposed buying the car outright as a capital expenditure.

I got lucky as it would have been a long range model however due to delivery dates I lucked out with the performance model. Looked at Model Y however dates didn’t meet my demands either.

This will cost me sub £50 a month BIK when it goes up to the 2% rate, free charging at work, no service or maintenance costs and insurance included with a home charger fitted when I move into my new house. You can’t afford not to go EV for a company car in those circumstances, it’s a no brainer even if you’re in a Volkswagen Up or something.

Sacrifice quality of build and comfort somewhat to what I’m used to however the tech is on another level and I will have absolutely zero fuel costs and ridiculous performance. Charging from work and have solar panels installed on house I’m moving into so rising costs not an issue.

I had a Range Rover SDV8 as I wanted an ICE car alongside my EV, I’ve literally just sold this as the range, super charging network and recently installed charging facilities at work just mean I really no longer need the car.

Ive always been a petrol head, EV works for me and it’s a perfect solution. Unfortunately it won’t work for others well if it all. We all have different constraints.

We just need to cut the bull out. I’m neutral, I don’t claim to be saving the world however similarly stubbornness and fact manipulation also is of no use. It’s been painful during fuel increases seeing the memes within the EV communities, it does nothing but breed hatred towards EV drivers and creates an even larger divide.

Roll on May! (Fingers crossed)


40F53854-44FE-4872-8AB2-B9BC750F6DA0.jpeg
 
Last edited:

phillarrow

Well-known member
Joined
Jan 27, 2022
Messages
513
My current ICE has two years left on its deal and I fully intend to buy electric at that point. But... I won't unless there's been a huge improvement in the infrastructure and range/charging times by that point.

We travel extensively in the UK, towing a trailer, and (selfish or not) I don't want to have to stop every couple of hours to recharge. Holiday time is precious, I don't want to waste too much of it sat in service stations.

Also, as someone who has lived in a flat in recent years, there's an awful lot to square off yet if the move to electric is to become viable for everyone. There's no charging where I work and no option to charge at home. It is just not an option for me, and I suspect it still won't be by the time I'm hoping to buy one.
 
Joined
Jul 28, 2018
Messages
759
My current ICE has two years left on its deal and I fully intend to buy electric at that point. But... I won't unless there's been a huge improvement in the infrastructure and range/charging times by that point.

We travel extensively in the UK, towing a trailer, and (selfish or not) I don't want to have to stop every couple of hours to recharge. Holiday time is precious, I don't want to waste too much of it sat in service stations.

Also, as someone who has lived in a flat in recent years, there's an awful lot to square off yet if the move to electric is to become viable for everyone. There's no charging where I work and no option to charge at home. It is just not an option for me, and I suspect it still won't be by the time I'm hoping to buy one.
I know Tesla are trialling opening their super chargers to all EV’s in some countries. This would improve access immensely as that’s the main reason I go Tesla as the infrastructure is there. There is some push back from Tesla owners as it will reduce access to the provisions they have. I say go for it personally, it all generates money and Tesla can build more reliable points. Win / win in my opinion as we need more reliable fast charging locations.

My wife has a Fiat 500 electric and I have range anxiety if we go out in that sometimes. Real world in winter it gets around 150 miles, there have been times we have stopped at motorway services for a high speed charger and they have been faulty despite zap map showing them as working. This has really scuppered us as you have to pray the next available charger is working otherwise you could genuinely end up stranded as your range declines. It’s never happened but it nearly did once. We were on our way back from Bicester Village and Leicester forest east services were down, so were the next services and we fortunately found a Novotel off of junction 25 with 100kw charging. Frustratingly the Tesla Superchargers we’re all fine but we couldn’t use them. At Novotel we popped into the bar, had a drink and then 20 mins later had more than enough charge to get home comfortably. It’s added stress you don’t need and super chargers I find much more reliable so that would mitigate the stress. Never had range anxiety in my Tesla. High range and good charging provision covers that. To be fair my wife’s car is great for short daily commutes which is what she uses it for not long commutes. She charges it once every week or so and it gets her to work everyday on her 15-20 mile round trip commute.

There lies a huge problem, there isn’t that flexibility that ICE cars have. You have a little Honda Jazz or something whilst it not be the most comfortable on long journeys it can do them. If your budget only allows for a low range car you’re always going to be at a charging station on long commutes and that is utterly pointless. I think my wife’s car claims 180mile real world range. It doesn’t happen, 160 in summer is the most we’ve seen. You take this on a motorway and do 70 and it’s even less. So somebody could have higher expectations.

I wouldn’t say it’s selfish at all, I kept my Range Rover sport SDV8 for towing and due to the comfort on a really long commute chose it over the X as it was a more pleasurable experience and I wasn’t crippled on arrival. Some applications EV can’t compete with ICE currently. It’s silly to adversely effect ourselves. I travel a lot for work, up and down the motorway mostly but some remote places also. I’ve never had an issue as long range and supercharging facilities mean before I leave the motorway I can stop for a coffee and toilet break and charge back up to 80% in the process. This has always been enough for me to go remote and get back.

Routeplanners these days are really good for planning your charging, it’s second nature to me now and stopping to fast charge 15mins after 3 hours is no detriment to me. I need to stretch my legs and have another caffeine hit after that point anyway. Must admit however I’m the past I’ve brimmed my tank in a diesel and drove from East Midlands to Cornwall in one hit and not had to worry about refuelling. Now I factor in a 20-30 min charge between Bristol and Cornwall so I’m entering Cornwall with a good amount of range so I’m not worrying about recharging in remote locations. Never been an issue otherwise though.

As you say flats/ apartments on street parking etc is quite a hurdle and will hinder many people from making the switch. I have seen people trailing cords which isn’t a solution. I do think we have to commit to the conversion or lampposts however it’s still going to be an under provision in the future and at significant cost. A friend lives in an apartment and relies on Tesco for 7kw charging. Only works due to low mileage he does as he’d otherwise be solely reliant on fast charging which makes it less cost effective.

I think EV is great if it works with your lifestyle however if it doesn’t it really doesn’t and just becomes a hinderance. I no longer need to tow so the SDV8 has gone and as I drive on my own 90% of the time the Model 3 Performance gives me range, fast charging and quite a fun car.
 

bobmac

Major Champion
Joined
Feb 2, 2009
Messages
25,857
Location
Lincolnshire
We were on our way back from Bicester Village and Leicester forest east services were down, so were the next services and we fortunately found a Novotel off of junction 25 with 100kw charging. Frustratingly the Tesla Superchargers we’re all fine but we couldn’t use them. At Novotel we popped into the bar, had a drink and then 20 mins later had more than enough charge to get home comfortably. It’s added stress you don’t need and super chargers I find much more reliable so that would mitigate the stress. Never had range anxiety in my Tesla. High range and good charging provision covers that. To be fair my wife’s car is great for short daily commutes which is what she uses it for not long commutes. She charges it once every week or so and it gets her to work everyday on her 15-20 mile round trip commute.
I'm guessing that was a while ago as, according to Zap Map, there are quite a few free chargers around Bicester Village.
And a genuine question........if you have a Tesla which has a good range and is perfect for motorway driving and a huge boot for all the shopping, why did you take the Fiat 500?
 

Bunkermagnet

Journeyman Pro
Joined
May 14, 2014
Messages
6,336
Location
Kent
I know Tesla are trialling opening their super chargers to all EV’s in some countries. This would improve access immensely as that’s the main reason I go Tesla as the infrastructure is there. There is some push back from Tesla owners as it will reduce access to the provisions they have. I say go for it personally, it all generates money and Tesla can build more reliable points. Win / win in my opinion as we need more reliable fast charging locations.

My wife has a Fiat 500 electric and I have range anxiety if we go out in that sometimes. Real world in winter it gets around 150 miles, there have been times we have stopped at motorway services for a high speed charger and they have been faulty despite zap map showing them as working. This has really scuppered us as you have to pray the next available charger is working otherwise you could genuinely end up stranded as your range declines. It’s never happened but it nearly did once. We were on our way back from Bicester Village and Leicester forest east services were down, so were the next services and we fortunately found a Novotel off of junction 25 with 100kw charging. Frustratingly the Tesla Superchargers we’re all fine but we couldn’t use them. At Novotel we popped into the bar, had a drink and then 20 mins later had more than enough charge to get home comfortably. It’s added stress you don’t need and super chargers I find much more reliable so that would mitigate the stress. Never had range anxiety in my Tesla. High range and good charging provision covers that. To be fair my wife’s car is great for short daily commutes which is what she uses it for not long commutes. She charges it once every week or so and it gets her to work everyday on her 15-20 mile round trip commute.

There lies a huge problem, there isn’t that flexibility that ICE cars have. You have a little Honda Jazz or something whilst it not be the most comfortable on long journeys it can do them. If your budget only allows for a low range car you’re always going to be at a charging station on long commutes and that is utterly pointless. I think my wife’s car claims 180mile real world range. It doesn’t happen, 160 in summer is the most we’ve seen. You take this on a motorway and do 70 and it’s even less. So somebody could have higher expectations.

I wouldn’t say it’s selfish at all, I kept my Range Rover sport SDV8 for towing and due to the comfort on a really long commute chose it over the X as it was a more pleasurable experience and I wasn’t crippled on arrival. Some applications EV can’t compete with ICE currently. It’s silly to adversely effect ourselves. I travel a lot for work, up and down the motorway mostly but some remote places also. I’ve never had an issue as long range and supercharging facilities mean before I leave the motorway I can stop for a coffee and toilet break and charge back up to 80% in the process. This has always been enough for me to go remote and get back.

Routeplanners these days are really good for planning your charging, it’s second nature to me now and stopping to fast charge 15mins after 3 hours is no detriment to me. I need to stretch my legs and have another caffeine hit after that point anyway. Must admit however I’m the past I’ve brimmed my tank in a diesel and drove from East Midlands to Cornwall in one hit and not had to worry about refuelling. Now I factor in a 20-30 min charge between Bristol and Cornwall so I’m entering Cornwall with a good amount of range so I’m not worrying about recharging in remote locations. Never been an issue otherwise though.

As you say flats/ apartments on street parking etc is quite a hurdle and will hinder many people from making the switch. I have seen people trailing cords which isn’t a solution. I do think we have to commit to the conversion or lampposts however it’s still going to be an under provision in the future and at significant cost. A friend lives in an apartment and relies on Tesco for 7kw charging. Only works due to low mileage he does as he’d otherwise be solely reliant on fast charging which makes it less cost effective.

I think EV is great if it works with your lifestyle however if it doesn’t it really doesn’t and just becomes a hinderance. I no longer need to tow so the SDV8 has gone and as I drive on my own 90% of the time the Model 3 Performance gives me range, fast charging and quite a fun car.
Probably the most helpful reply on the subject. No axe to grind, just an honest reply.
Thankyou:)
 

DaveR

Head Pro
Joined
Jun 7, 2017
Messages
1,907
Probably the most helpful reply on the subject. No axe to grind, just an honest reply.
Thankyou:)
Only a couple of people have been giving biased replies, most have pointed out genuine issues. I think the majority if not all are happy to go EV as and when the technology is in place.
 
Top