VW cars

[pokerjoke]

Massive drop in share price and a possible claim scenario on the cards.

Is it just VW?

Do emissions really mean anything in the wider picture as I saw a lorry and a car on the road chucking out enough black smoke for a 1000 cars.
Are these liable for a fine if stopped?

 

[Paul77]

Can, worms, open, everywhere!!

What VW did was sneaky. Two schools of thought came out of what I heard today on the news. VW deliberately inserted code to alter the emissions when the car was tested so they could sell more cars that are "eco friendly", or VW, like many, will be feeling the pinch of extremely tight CO2 emissions guidelines set by GOV's across the world knowing only too well they are impossible to adhere to.

I just don't know how charging folk extra for the CO2 their cars put out is going to help the fight on greenhouse gases or global warming. The USA puts out more Co2 than anyone in the planet. I don't understand why the UK gets such a hard time seeing we're such a tiny protion of the world, yet we likely pay more in motoring than anyone else.

 

[Beezerk]

Is it just VW?

That's the main worry, I find it hard to believe VW are the only ones with this scam in operation.

 

[Rooter]

I think a lot of the claims are unrealistic in real world conditions, most of the adverts you see say something along the lines of "MPG claims made in lab conditions" for the consumer, this is not great. There are potentially bigger implications around taxation also, (or road duty whatever!!!) P11D for company car drivers etc, a small change in Co2 emissions can have a huge effect on the pocket of the driver.

shame on VW, i for one am glad they have been caught and am waiting with baited breath to see which company is next to be named and shamed!

 

[Paul77]

I think a lot of the claims are unrealistic in real world conditions, most of the adverts you see say something along the lines of "MPG claims made in lab conditions" for the consumer, this is not great. There are potentially bigger implications around taxation also, (or road duty whatever!!!) P11D for company car drivers etc, a small change in Co2 emissions can have a huge effect on the pocket of the driver.

shame on VW, i for one am glad they have been caught and am waiting with baited breath to see which company is next to be named and shamed!

You make a valid point. Are all the owners of the cars in the UK suddenly going to owe her Majesty more money backdated from when they owned the car because it was found to have been done here too? I bet my left teste on it. I can't see it being only VW that are involved. This sort of thing has a market changing implication. The whole system needs to change.

 

[pendodave]

Having seen what the septics did to BP, I'd be pretty worried if I was VW. Car making is a tough enough industry without punitive fines incoming.

I wouldn't worry to much about post-dated tax implications for us though. Not realistic imho.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

This will be like banking, ppi etc when it started off with one bank being exposed and then one by one they were all found at fault. All of them will be fiddling the figures, that is what happens when targets such as these are given such weight and bearing. MPG are equally manipulated and utter nonsense.

We need real world testing of cars, carried out by independent bodies out on the roads, not in labs. They will need to be done in one location per continent to ensure consistency and fair play. Not that difficult to set up considering the amount of money sloshing around in the car industry. I am sure the real figures will be a heck of a shock compared to those that are claimed.

 

[pokerjoke]

I wander what the legal implications are with Insurance companies as they offer lower premiums for low emission cars.

 

[Region3]

"MPG claims made in lab conditions"

From what I remember from seeing it on TV, MPG tests are done on a smooth track with the wing mirrors taken off and all the gaps between panels taped over.

Good luck in achieving them on the road! :angry:

 

[bladeplayer]

Well id hazzard a guess if VW are doing it then possibly only possibly Skoda,Audi,Merc etc all under the same umbrella

 

[Rooter]

Well id hazzard a guess if VW are doing it then possibly only possibly Skoda,Audi,Merc etc all under the same umbrella

Will that also mean the Lamborghini Aventador i was looking to buy may not actually do the claimed 12mpg combined at 398g/km? Hmm my have to rethink things a little...

 

[Maninblack4612]

Not surprised it happened with a diesel. The current regulations are making it harder & harder to make diesels meet emission standards. In addition to often troublesome Exhaust Gas Recirculators & Diesel Particle Filters, modern diesels have to have a tank of Ad Blue, aka dilute pigs' pee, to inject into the exhaust. This requires a tank in the boot, which needs refilling every 5,000 miles or so and up to18 sensors to monitor the conditions in the engine & the flow of said pigs' pee. And if you don't refill the tank the car stops & won't restart. So much to go wrong! After a serious DPF problem I dumped my diesel & bought a car with a small turbo engine. I believe they are the future.

 

[Rooter]

I dumped my diesel & bought a car with a small turbo engine. I believe they are the future.

I think you will find hydrogen and/or electric cars are the future, fossil fueled cars days are numbered. Ok maybe not in my generation, and lets not argue where the electricity comes from for the leccy cars either! LOL but its coming slowly as the technology improves.

 

[Jimaroid]

From what I remember from seeing it on TV, MPG tests are done on a smooth track with the wing mirrors taken off and all the gaps between panels taped over.

I believe it's even worse than that, they're not even performed with road-going models of cars. In the EU they're done using pre-production cars, with engine specifications that don't match the production versions.

It's about time this sort of behaviour was challenged. Nobody believes MPG figures quoted by manufacturers yet they're a massive factor in purchasing decisions so they're easily massaged. People have been misled for a long time about this.

What's going to be really interesting now is seeing if buyers are willing to challenge the manufacturers claims and effectively ask for the money back on their vehicle purchases. This is going to get very big and messy.

 

[bladeplayer]

Will that also mean the Lamborghini Aventador i was looking to buy may not actually do the claimed 12mpg combined at 398g/km? Hmm my have to rethink things a little...

MPG aint gona be a problem its GPM mate same words just changed around .

One course i was on lately the instructor said the levels of emission regulation that is set to be brought in across Europe NO manufacturer can meet them , they are talking about fitting 2DPF's etc or second Cat Converter .

 

[bigslice]

I think you will find hydrogen and/or electric cars are the future, fossil fueled cars days are numbered. Ok maybe not in my generation, and lets not argue where the electricity comes from for the leccy cars either! LOL but its coming slowly as the technology improves.

sorry but i think you will find hoverboards are the future, or perhaps to go back, possibly a tardis:whoo:

 

[Paul77]

My BMW 320D is stated to have 60mpg. I get around 54mpg. I reckon that's really good for a 2.0D turbo. My mrs car is a fatal VW polo Bluemotion. Rated at 82mpg, she's lucky if she gets anywhere near my mpg and she does motorway driving. It's a joke. 1st generation DPF too with more trouble than it's worth.

I love the power of my diesel car but I'm sniffing change in the wind. The gov wanted us all to move away from petrol cars and we all bought diesels because they were cheaper to tax based emissions, and now it's looking like it's all going to be thumped on it's head with htis new revelation. It's all just a ploy to get more money out of the road users who can't do without their cars.

 

[GreiginFife]

Well id hazzard a guess if VW are doing it then possibly only possibly Skoda,Audi,Merc etc all under the same umbrella

Not so sure Merc are part of VAG Bill.
I would probably suggest that probablity is that Seat, Skoda, Audi and Lambo are in the same boat. Not so sure that Merc or BM will be, I have an A220 AMG (diesel) and at 115g/Km is quite high compared to the A3 I was looking at with comparable engine size/power which was booked at 107g/Km.

 

[Jimaroid]

This is having an incredible effect on the stock market. City firms are predicting this could lead to the end of diesel vehicles altogether and there seems to be a massive selloff in operation from vehicle manufacturers to mining companies. There's definitely much more to this than Volkswagen.

 

[Twire]

Not so sure Merc are part of VAG Bill.
I would probably suggest that probablity is that Seat, Skoda, Audi and Lambo are in the same boat. Not so sure that Merc or BM will be, I have an A220 AMG (diesel) and at 115g/Km is quite high compared to the A3 I was looking at with comparable engine size/power which was booked at 107g/Km.

Porsche are also part of the VAG.