Tee Markers and teeing ground

[BTatHome]

Ok, I'll try and use correct terminology but won't throw out my toys if someone corrects me on it

Anyway i know of the fact that the teeing ground is determined by tee markers and that your can go back 2 clubs lengths .... no problem with any of that. Question is, does anyone know of rules/ruling/recommendation written down that talks about the actual position of these markers? Clearly making sure that they are not too far back, so that people can go 2 clubs lengths back is a good idea, but is there anything about the side-to-side positioning. I know that some like to stand outside the markers, and clearly on raised ground this could be tricky if the markers are placed up tight to one side. So is there something written down that says its best practise to ensure every player has the ability to stand outside the markers? Would it be related to Congu and qualifying status?

 

[Colin L]

From the R&A "Guidance on Running a Competition". Recommendations, not rules.

Due to the fact that the Rules of Golf state that the teeing ground is an area of two clublengths in depth, tee-markers should always be at least two club-lengths forward from the back edge of the tee. A player should be allowed to tee his ball as far back in the two club-length area as he chooses and still be able to make an unobstructed swing. Ensure that trees, advertising boards, etc. do not create any interference. When positioning tee-markers it is also important to take account of the left-handed player and ensure that the teeing ground affords these players as much room for manoeuvre as right-handed players.

http://www.randa.org/en/Rules-and-A...unning-a-Competition.aspx?chapter=4&section=1

There's nothing there or in the rest of the section about allowing players to stand with their feet outside the side of the teeing ground. The recommended distance between markers is 6 to 7 yards and so if you follow that recommendation within limited space, you might have to forego that. From the point made about left-handed players, however, it is clearly important that if there is space for a right handed player to stand outside the teeing ground on the left, the tee markers should be placed so that a leftie would have the same opportunity to the right.

 

[delc]

Ok, I'll try and use correct terminology but won't throw out my toys if someone corrects me on it

Anyway i know of the fact that the teeing ground is determined by tee markers and that your can go back 2 clubs lengths .... no problem with any of that. Question is, does anyone know of rules/ruling/recommendation written down that talks about the actual position of these markers? Clearly making sure that they are not too far back, so that people can go 2 clubs lengths back is a good idea, but is there anything about the side-to-side positioning. I know that some like to stand outside the markers, and clearly on raised ground this could be tricky if the markers are placed up tight to one side. So is there something written down that says its best practise to ensure every player has the ability to stand outside the markers? Would it be related to Congu and qualifying status?

I can't imagine that there are any particular extra requirements, because otherwise you couldn't play off winter mats. Some clubs in Southern England do still run qualifiers off winter mats or tees by the way.

 

[rulefan]

This is an extract from the R&A's Guidance on Running a Competition

Tee-markers should be placed about six to seven yards apart. If the width of the teeing ground
is greater, players are more likely to inadvertently tee up in front of the tee-markers. The front
line of the teeing ground should be set up at right angles to the centre of the drive zone. In
order to achieve this it is suggested that the person setting the teeing ground stands on the
tee, faces the centre of the drive zone (or the putting green at a par 3 hole) and extends his
arms at a 90 degree angle to the centre of the drive zone. If he then places the tee-markers in
line with his arms a square set up should result. Alternatively, some form of T-square can be
placed on the ground to assist with alignment.

Due to the fact that the Rules of Golf state that the teeing ground is an area of two clublengths
in depth, tee-markers should always be at least two club-lengths forward from the back
edge of the tee. A player should be allowed to tee his ball as far back in the two club-length
area as he chooses and still be able to make an unobstructed swing. Ensure that trees,
advertising boards, etc. do not create any interference. When positioning tee-markers it is also
important to take account of the left-handed player and ensure that the teeing ground affords
these players as much room for manoeuvre as right-handed players.

 

[BTatHome]

Thanks Rulesfan and Colin L, our tee markers are often placed quite close to the right edge of sloped areas and I commented that it wasn't particulalry fair to some competitors (it just logical to me that lefties should be allowed the same consideration as righties).

 

[rulefan]

I can't imagine that there are any particular extra requirements, because otherwise you couldn't play off winter mats. Some clubs in Southern England do still run qualifiers off winter mats or tees by the way.

Both tee mats and fairway mats are specifically permitted under CONGU regulations and are widely used throughout all parts of GB & Ireland for winter qualifiers.
However, CONGU recognises that tee mats do not generally satisfy the two club-lengths in depth requirement but in such circumstances it is considered that the spirit of the rule is being honoured and that Qualifying Competitions can be played.
In the same vein, fairway mats may only be used in the 'preferred lie' period.

 

[delc]

This is an extract from the R&A's Guidance on Running a Competition

Tee-markers should be placed about six to seven yards apart. If the width of the teeing ground
is greater, players are more likely to inadvertently tee up in front of the tee-markers. The front
line of the teeing ground should be set up at right angles to the centre of the drive zone. In
order to achieve this it is suggested that the person setting the teeing ground stands on the
tee, faces the centre of the drive zone (or the putting green at a par 3 hole) and extends his
arms at a 90 degree angle to the centre of the drive zone. If he then places the tee-markers in
line with his arms a square set up should result. Alternatively, some form of T-square can be
placed on the ground to assist with alignment.

Due to the fact that the Rules of Golf state that the teeing ground is an area of two clublengths
in depth, tee-markers should always be at least two club-lengths forward from the back
edge of the tee. A player should be allowed to tee his ball as far back in the two club-length
area as he chooses and still be able to make an unobstructed swing. Ensure that trees,
advertising boards, etc. do not create any interference. When positioning tee-markers it is also
important to take account of the left-handed player and ensure that the teeing ground affords
these players as much room for manoeuvre as right-handed players.

I've come across tee markers where the front line is nothing like at 90 degrees to the centre of the driving zone! One of our teeing grounds normally points straight at a bunker to one side of the fairway. I had always rather assumed that this was a deliberate design feature to make you feel uncomfortable on the tee and to test your aiming skill, but is this actually against the spirit of the competition guidelines? :mmm:

 

[palindromicbob]

I've come across tee markers where the front line is nothing like at 90 degrees to the centre of the driving zone! One of our teeing grounds normally points straight at a bunker to one side of the fairway. I had always rather assumed that this was a deliberate design feature to make you feel uncomfortable on the tee and to test your aiming skill, but is this actually against the spirit of the competition guidelines? :mmm:

Notice the guidance says should and not must.

 

[rulefan]

I've come across tee markers where the front line is nothing like at 90 degrees to the centre of the driving zone! One of our teeing grounds normally points straight at a bunker to one side of the fairway. I had always rather assumed that this was a deliberate design feature to make you feel uncomfortable on the tee and to test your aiming skill, but is this actually against the spirit of the competition guidelines? :mmm:

Of course, you don't have to stand at right angles to the two markers. Having determined that your ball is behind the line, ignore the markers completely.

 

[delc]

Of course, you don't have to stand at right angles to the two markers. Having determined that your ball is behind the line, ignore the markers completely.

I do, or at least try to ignore them! Isn't a skewed front line a bit unfair on either left or right handers because it slightly changes the distance to the hole from either end of the line, and on those players who like to use a tee marker as an alignment aid?

 

[delc]

Notice the guidance says should and not must.

Is that like the French think that EC Directives are just directives (i.e. recommendations) and can be ignored when it doesn't suit them, whereas the UK Government regards them as Gold plated Laws? :mmm:

 

[Colin L]

Neatly sidestepping that distraction and back to tee markers, I'd agree it is bad practice to have them misaligned although it's hard to see a few centimetres difference from one side to the other mattering even on a short Par 3 ..... unless your distance control is remarkably finely tuned. Making it more difficult to align your tee shot is what matters mostly.

But isn't fixing your particular problem on one tee just a simple matter of someone instructing the greenkeepers to take heed of alignment when putting the markers in?

 

[Region3]

I know that some like to stand outside the markers, and clearly on raised ground this could be tricky if the markers are placed up tight to one side.

I wouldn't imagine people like to stand with their feet outside the markers because they prefer it that way, most likely it will be because they want the ball as far left/right as possible.

If the markers are on the edge of the teeing ground then they can have their ball as far left/right as possible without standing outside the markers and I don't see an issue.

Unless they really do like to see the marker between their feet and the ball, in which case words fail me.

 

[Slab]

I wouldn't imagine people like to stand with their feet outside the markers because they prefer it that way, most likely it will be because they want the ball as far left/right as possible.

If the markers are on the edge of the teeing ground then they can have their ball as far left/right as possible without standing outside the markers and I don't see an issue.

Unless they really do like to see the marker between their feet and the ball, in which case words fail me.

Off topic but I know a player like this!

 

[backwoodsman]

I wouldn't imagine people like to stand with their feet outside the markers because they prefer it that way, most likely it will be because they want the ball as far left/right as possible.

If the markers are on the edge of the teeing ground then they can have their ball as far left/right as possible without standing outside the markers and I don't see an issue.

Unless they really do like to see the marker between their feet and the ball, in which case words fail me.

Off topic but I know a player like this!

So do I. Bizarre to me, but he always does it.

 

[Pipetwister]

Could it be that he is using the tee marker as an alignment aid?