Slow play clamp down (on 18th)

[MarkT]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1397648074541961218

Never heard of this happening before. LPGA statement..
On the 18th hole of her Day One match, Carlota Ciganda was assessed a loss-of-hole penalty for a breach of the LPGA’s Match-Play Pace of Play Policy. Per the policy, a player is subject to penalty if she exceeds the allotted time for her total strokes taken on a hole by more than 10 seconds, averaging 30 seconds per shot. Ciganda exceeded the allotted time for the number of strokes taken on the 18th hole.

 

[SteveW86]

Does the loss of hole mean that the group in front had already left the bar before she finished?

Seems a little bit harsh to me

 

[rulefan]

Does the loss of hole mean that the group in front had already left the bar before she finished?

Seems a little bit harsh to me

Another discretionary rule?

 

[sweaty sock]

Dont know the details as they are very closely gaurded. But Id love to see the times taken for the rounds of all the days matches.

Case in point, the slow play penalty at the PGA, the average round time was over 5 hours!! Whats the point of nailing one player for ten seconds when the whole field is slow to the point of ridicule?

 

[Deleted member 29109]

Funny how all of these slow play penalties are on the LPGA or given to lesser known male pros.

Two days running the final group last weekend had lost a hole to the group in front. And 5 hour plus rounds were common.

Until some of the high profile slow players start getting penalised, nothing will change.

 

[Bdill93]

If shes averaging 30 seconds per shot, is this where shes stood, ready to strike and just tinkers until she feels ready to swing? If so - what a joke! The real time killer is surely the discussion pre-shot?

 

[larmen]

Until some of the high profile slow players start getting penalised, nothing will change.

2 1/2 minutes from standing over the ball 1st time to shot, 8 test swings and 2 club changes. Are we admiring this shot, or do we think he should have chipped out and got on with it?

Personally I don’t think slow play is a big issue. Some of the shots I remember took ages. The Tiger one, Spieth from a car park, ... good things need time. A golfer taking a minute doesn’t make a round 6 hours.

 

[Deleted member 29109]

2 1/2 minutes from standing over the ball 1st time to shot, 8 test swings and 2 club changes. Are we admiring this shot, or do we think he should have chipped out and got on with it?

Personally I don’t think slow play is a big issue. Some of the shots I remember took ages. The Tiger one, Spieth from a car park, ... good things need time. A golfer taking a minute doesn’t make a round 6 hours.

For the occasional difficult shot, its not a problem. When its every shot it is.

Mickelson took an age over every shot last week. Bryson has to mark, look at his green book and line up every putt. Even from a couple of feet. This is what adds to the slow play.

And it creeps in to weekend golf. Its infuriating watching someone check their yardage every time the duff a shot. Or read a putt from every conceivable angle.

Last week I witnessed someone doing the stand on your line thing in the group in front. I doubt they ever had a putt for par. And they took a flipping age.

 

[Foxholer]

Another discretionary rule?

I believe the Rule (6-7?) is non-discretionary.
It's The Committee's specification of the required Pace of Play as a Condition of Competition that is 'discretionary'.
Unfortunate circumstances (for Ciganda), but I'm pleased to see it's applied without regard to consequences.

 

[IanM]

it creeps in to weekend golf. Its infuriating watching someone check their yardage every time the duff a shot. Or read a putt from every conceivable angle.

Last week I witnessed someone doing the stand on your line thing in the group in front. I doubt they ever had a putt for par. And they took a flipping age.

And therein lies the trouble. When I first played, if you messed about, some old geezer called you out for it. Anything over 3 hours was slow.

On Sunday, I could not believe how long they stood on tees of par 5s and 4s and starred into space.... a hole they'd played every day all week and virtually every time, hit the same club.

 

[slowhand]

I believe the Rule (6-7?) is non-discretionary.
It's The Committee's specification of the required Pace of Play as a Condition of Competition that is 'discretionary'.
Unfortunate circumstances (for Ciganda), but I'm pleased to see it's applied without regard to consequences.

I wonder, had the situation been reversed and it meant that applying the rule meant the European won and the American lost, if the penalty would have been applied

 

[jim8flog]

edited

 

[fundy]

I think you need an edit.

why?

hes saying that women get penalised
hes also saying that when males are penalised they are lesser known

both seem accurate to me, "or" implies hes not saying the LPGA are penalising males

 

[jim8flog]

why?

hes saying that women get penalised
hes also saying that when males are penalised they are lesser known

both seem accurate to me, "or" implies hes not saying the LPGA are penalising males

Yes re reading it I see what he means.

 

[Foxholer]

I wonder, had the situation been reversed and it meant that applying the rule meant the European won and the American lost, if the penalty would have been applied

1. My understanding is that it was Ciganda (only) that exceeded the time allowance. Schmelzal, her opponent did not!
2. You appear to be challenging the integrity of those officiating at the top level of Golf! As one of the fundamental values of the game is 'integrity (by all involved)', I suggest you reconsider whether you really grasp all the aspects of the 'game'!

So my answer would be 'most certainly'!

 

[HeftyHacker]

And therein lies the trouble. When I first played, if you messed about, some old geezer called you out for it. Anything over 3 hours was slow.

On Sunday, I could not believe how long they stood on tees of par 5s and 4s and starred into space.... a hole they'd played every day all week and virtually every time, hit the same club.

I played with two 85yr olds last weekend and they said they had noticed that a lot of the new beginners that they had played with took an age over their shots and believed it was because of what folk watch on TV.

They get to their ball, pick a club and hit it. No messing.

 

[Backsticks]

Bryson has to mark, look at his green book and line up every putt. Even from a couple of feet. This is what adds to the slow play.

To be fair to Bryson though, as a physics major who applies advanced science to every shot, he has a lot more data to process than most players. It might just look like a straight forward fairway iron distance selection from the yardage book to us and for most of his fellow pros. But for him, when you are mentally doing all the calculations for elevation vectors, wind speed, boundary layer shear forces on the golfball and the different altitudes it will be at on its trajectory, the complex interactions of ballistic parabolic motion and the aerodynamic surface friction of the ball surface and dimple pattern, air temperature, air density, and dew point influences, as well as landing zone probabilities, failure modes effects analysis, and coefficient of restitution of the green itself and grass friction factors and their influence on spin ball touchdown dynamics, its not really realistic to expect him to do that in 30 seconds.

 

[IanM]

To be fair to Bryson though, as a physics major who applies advanced science to every shot, he has a lot more data to process than most players. It might just look like a straight forward fairway iron distance selection from the yardage book to us and for most of his fellow pros. But for him, when you are mentally doing all the calculations for elevation vectors, wind speed, boundary layer shear forces on the golfball and the different altitudes it will be at on its trajectory, the complex interactions of ballistic parabolic motion and the aerodynamic surface friction of the ball surface and dimple pattern, air temperature, air density, and dew point influences, as well as landing zone probabilities, failure modes effects analysis, and coefficient of restitution of the green itself and grass friction factors and their influence on spin ball touchdown dynamics, its not really realistic to expect him to do that in 30 seconds.

Yeah...but even he doesn't understand PCC

 

[Aussie Swinger]

She had a fairly high profile in the women’s game. I’ve seen her routine in real life. She is painfully slow and although I’ve not seen the incident I can fully understand why she’s been given a time penalty. If you ever catch her on the tv you will come to the same conclusion.

 

[cliveb]

To be fair to Bryson though, as a physics major who applies advanced science to every shot, he has a lot more data to process than most players. It might just look like a straight forward fairway iron distance selection from the yardage book to us and for most of his fellow pros. But for him, when you are mentally doing all the calculations for elevation vectors, wind speed, boundary layer shear forces on the golfball and the different altitudes it will be at on its trajectory, the complex interactions of ballistic parabolic motion and the aerodynamic surface friction of the ball surface and dimple pattern, air temperature, air density, and dew point influences, as well as landing zone probabilities, failure modes effects analysis, and coefficient of restitution of the green itself and grass friction factors and their influence on spin ball touchdown dynamics, its not really realistic to expect him to do that in 30 seconds.

Excellent point.
My cat has to make many of these complex ballistics computations when he jumps up onto a fence, but seems to do them in a trice. I guess this means my cat has a better brain than Bryson.