Should caddies just be bag carriers?

[phillarrow]

I've not been here long enough to know if this counts as a thread bingo post (apologies if it does!) but the other thread bingo did about McIlroy's caddie has got me thinking about the role in professional golf.

Green books have been limited to make it more of an unscientific test of skill. A few of us feel that ball spotters make the game too easy for the pros. They're not allowed to use measuring devices.
In that spirit, would it not be a truer test of the golfer's skill if the role of the caddie was restricted to bag carrier and buddy? Could/should the help they give on deciding club selection not be considered outside interference?

Personally, I think the game would be a tougher, and truer, test for the pros of they received zero assistance regarding shot selection.

 

[KenL]

No, they are part of the game.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

They certainly shouldn’t be allowed to go on as much as Bones did with Phil ?

 

[Lord Tyrion]

I don't object to caddies but I do object to a two minute plus chat over which club to take, analysis, over analysis. Be stricter on the shot clock, not going to happen in the US sadly, and any caddy debate largely disappears.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Disagree. A good bag man can make a difference. Harrington has often said his caddy got him through his meltdown at Carnoustie and in the right frame for the playoff. Plenty of other stories of a caddy being essential to players down the stretch. I like to hear the conversations between player and caddy. I do think getting the yardage can be painful and that side perhaps needs looking at

 

[phillarrow]

Disagree. A good bag man can make a difference. Harrington has often said his caddy got him through his meltdown at Carnoustie and in the right frame for the playoff. Plenty of other stories of a caddy being essential to players down the stretch. I like to hear the conversations between player and caddy. I do think getting the yardage can be painful and that side perhaps needs looking at

No, I agree with you they DO make a difference. That's what I'm not sure about. It feels to me a bit like a good caddie can make TOO much difference.

 

[Deleted member 23344]

I have no real problem with a caddy being a psychological aid in stressful moments or keeping a player focussed when things are going well, but surely club selection, choice of shot, impact of wind direction/slope and dealing with hazards etc are all part of being a golfer. I would prefer that these aspects/decisions were handled solely by the player.

 

[fundy]

no, they should never be just bag carriers, either you allow caddies or let the pros carry their own bag round the course

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Westwood has his OH just carry the bag for him a number of times and does everything else himself

 

[Orikoru]

Scrap caddies altogether. Make the pros carry (or push) their own bags round and let them use rangefinders and GPS. Imagine if footballers all had an assistant running round with them telling them how far to kick it and which foot to use.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Scrap caddies altogether. Make the pros carry (or push) their own bags round and let them use rangefinders and GPS. Imagine if footballers all had an assistant running round with them telling them how far to kick it and which foot to use.

You have seen some managers on the sidelines? That is pretty much what they seem to do ?. I'm not sure that football was the best sport to compare against, but I do get your point.

 

[Orikoru]

You have seen some managers on the sidelines? That is pretty much what they seem to do ?. I'm not sure that football was the best sport to compare against, but I do get your point.

Yeah I was just kidding with that really. But, if you sort of approach golf as an outsider, say, it does seem kind of silly that they have caddies to help them with certain aspects of the game. Maybe snooker would have been a better comparison as a slow-paced individual sport - they don't have someone to tell them the potting angles and recommend whether to use the rest or not.

I've never played with a caddy. When I play I consider figuring the distance out and what club to use part of the game, so it would be weird not doing that. So it does feel odd that the pros don't have to do it. Definitely in favour of removing the green books as well - use your eyes and read the break!

 

[phillarrow]

Yeah I was just kidding with that really. But, if you sort of approach golf as an outsider, say, it does seem kind of silly that they have caddies to help them with certain aspects of the game. Maybe snooker would have been a better comparison as a slow-paced individual sport - they don't have someone to tell them the potting angles and recommend whether to use the rest or not.

I've never played with a caddy. When I play I consider figuring the distance out and what club to use part of the game, so it would be weird not doing that. So it does feel odd that the pros don't have to do it. Definitely in favour of removing the green books as well - use your eyes and read the break!

I think this is kind of my point really. Why get rid of one type of outside help - green books - but keep another - caddies advising on club selection?

As you say, I consider club selection to be a huge part of the skill of golf. Therefore, I feel it should be a test of the player, not the caddy. The snooker analogy is spot on!

 

[YandaB]

I've just got my copy of "Four-iron in the Soul" as recommended by others on this forum, there are a couple of quotes before the book even starts and this one from Booby Jones in 1930 is very relevant:

"If I needed advice from my caddy, he'd be hitting the shots and I'd be carrying the bag".

 

[AussieKB]

I've just got my copy of "Four-iron in the Soul" as recommended by others on this forum, there are a couple of quotes before the book even starts and this one from Booby Jones in 1930 is very relevant:

"If I needed advice from my caddy, he'd be hitting the shots and I'd be carrying the bag".

Always loved that quote from a true golfer, could hit every shot in the book.

 

[patricks148]

I suppose the era of professional caddy has changed things, once apon a time a player turned up at a course and employed a local caddy to help around and unfamiliar course, now the player brings his own who is as familiar with the course as he is. Maybe it would speed things up if professionals were allowed to use a trolly and range finder, but who knows. According to a few of the guys at my club who have been to US college on golf scholarships self reliance is the name of the game and caddys are not used in collegiate golf, so these guys can do it.

 

[Imurg]

I'm in 2 minds on this...
On the one hand it can be interesting watching and listening to the interaction between player and caddy
On the other hand ...although often referred to as a team, it's only the player's name that gets put on the trophy.
If they're a team then why not the caddy as well..?
So if the caddy gets no credit for the win, other than a ton of cash, then just make them bag carriers and make the Pro earn their money.
And, to take it one step further, use local caddy, drawn out of a hat and make sure whoever gets Kooch gets paid properly

 

[Orikoru]

I suppose the era of professional caddy has changed things, once apon a time a player turned up at a course and employed a local caddy to help around and unfamiliar course, now the player brings his own who is as familiar with the course as he is. Maybe it would speed things up if professionals were allowed to use a trolly and range finder, but who knows. According to a few of the guys at my club who have been to US college on golf scholarships self reliance is the name of the game and caddys are not used in collegiate golf, so these guys can do it.

Small point on this, why are the caddies not allowed to use trolleys as it is??

 

[patricks148]

Small point on this, why are the caddies not allowed to use trolleys as it is??

No idea.

Though I think they can on the lower tours, any time I've seen the euro pro on the TV I've seen guys with trolleys

I gave up my sky subscription last year and while looking through the sports channel last week came across some golf from the far east and they were using range finders.

 

[sweaty sock]

I find it interesting how few coaches the players have as caddies. Other individual sports like tennis/snooker etc would absolutely have there coach giving advice if they had the chance. Admittedly unlikely Terry Griffiths would be carting round a 20kg bag.

Seems like theres alot more development to come in the role...