Short game[now im not so sure].

[pokerjoke]

I have always been in the camp of the short game is key and working from 100 yards in and chips around the green,getting up and down etc.

But after watching the golf last night im starting to think I might be wrong.

We always talk about being on the fairway instead of being 20-30 yards further up and maybe in the semi rough.

But watching Jason day last night bombing it out there 20-50 yards further than Jordan Speith was an eye opener.

Jason was sometimes taking 3 clubs less than Jordan on some holes.

Im certainly not saying neglect any short game practice but im definitely going to look at my driving a bit more and maybe learn to get a bit more distance because there no doubt going into a green with less club is more beneficial.

Any thoughts

 

[FairwayDodger]

It's all important, to be honest. You can have good rounds based on a good long game or good short game but both need to be sharp to shoot low scores consistently.

My good scores tend to come on the days that my long game is "on" - driving well and finding fairways and greens. I've had some rounds this year where I hit upwards of 15 GIR.

On the other hand, my short game is a weak point. 12 GIR on Saturday, good by most standards, but only one up and down out of six - not good enough. Combined with one careless mistake I missed out on what could have been a healthy handicap cut.

 

[UlyssesSky]

If you look at the driving distance stats for the PGA Tour (here) you'll find that Jordan Speith is currently ranked 77th in that category.

Yet he finished ahead of 75 of the 76 players who hit it longer than him (not sure if all of them actually played in the PGA championship last weekend, but you get the point...)


So while hitting into a green with less club may increase your chances of acutally hitting the green, it's not guarantee you will actually see lower scores. You could also call Bubba Watson to discuss the increasing importance of great wedge play for a long hitter...


If you put the amount of work it would need to increase your driving distance by one or two clubs without loosing accuracy into your approaches/short game, you'll be more likely to shoot lower scores than you would if you hit it 20 yards further, imho.

 

[bladeplayer]

As said before , being decent at all the areas will probably get u lower than been great at 1 & poor at others ..

But i also firmly believe its far easier to be going into greens with as much loft as is possible ..

 

[Spear-Chucker]

A few more yards on a drive is largely pointless to improve a score for us recreational golfers but is fun if that floats your boat. Your mileage may vary.

Aim to get up and down 50% of the time round the greens, mostly eliminate three putting and try to average low 30's for putts per round - and then enjoy the improvement.

Day won yesterday by making several crucial up-and-down saves when missing greens on the back nine and finishing solidly. Long hitting helped for sure but that was only a bit part player in the larger scheme of things. Spieth missed a few opportunities on the greens (3 by my reckoning) and came second by a that number.

 

[happyhacker]

Days length definitely helped last night, but those extra yards were not at the expense of fairways. Day hit more fairways than Speith last night and was longer. A powerful combo if you've got both!

 

[UlyssesSky]

Here's some more stats Mark Crossfield posted on facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AskGolfGur...4140156627965/964218120286828/?type=1&theater

Jason Day:

- was on average 18 yards longer off the tee than the field average
- had a over 13% higher driving accuracy
- hit 15% more greens in regulation
- was 5% better scrambling
- gained almost 1.3 (!!!) strokes putting...

I guess it's safe to say the additional 18 yards had the least contribution to his win. If you combine them with the higher driving accuracy it becomes more significant, but I'd still say the most importance factors were greens in regulation (which acuaally may be a result of the long and precise driving) and especially his putting.

 

[13Aces]

The short game is very important but improving "Greens in Regulation" numbers is the foundation for playing consistently good golf. How would we rate our chances of getting down in two from (1)somewhere around the green (2) green side bunker or (3) on the green 40ft from the pin?
I would always choose (3).

 

[garyinderry]

I'd take a 20 foot chip over a 40 foot putt.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

With the top players having a short game which is incredible imo it gives them the confidence to go for it with the driver as they know if they miss the fairway they have the ability to recover.
In the amateur game I think there would be a lot of us that would readily accept driving 5-20 yds less if it guaranteed being on the short stuff

 

[Slab]

Would still go for the short game being more important of the two to actually make the score although its true to say you can't guarantee a par from a good tee shot but you can easily rule yourself out of a par with a poor one

For me a FIR gives me the opportunity to score on a hole, the short game will decide what that score is

 

[Deleted member 1147]

If you can hit further down the fairway you leave a shorter approach. Combine this with it probably means you hit your irons further than the guy you just outhit by 20 yards off the tee, you will be more likely to get closer with your approach, and therefore are less likely to 3 putt or more likely to hole out for birdie.

I reckon if you hit it long and straight, and have a good short game, you'll probably be quite good.

 

[pokerjoke]

Here's some more stats Mark Crossfield posted on facebook: https://www.facebook.com/AskGolfGur...4140156627965/964218120286828/?type=1&theater

Jason Day:

- was on average 18 yards longer off the tee than the field average
- had a over 13% higher driving accuracy
- hit 15% more greens in regulation
- was 5% better scrambling
- gained almost 1.3 (!!!) strokes putting...

I guess it's safe to say the additional 18 yards had the least contribution to his win. If you combine them with the higher driving accuracy it becomes more significant, but I'd still say the most importance factors were greens in regulation (which acuaally may be a result of the long and precise driving) and especially his putting.

As has been said all of the game is important.
Days stats tell me he was hitting more GIR because he was longer and on the short stuff.
Going into a green with less club means more accuracy which can mean closer to the pin which then gives shorter putts.
Sounds easy enough.

Seriously though what I was trying to say is that I have spent so much time on the short game neglecting the long game so just saying I need to practice the long game more.

 

[FairwayDodger]

Seriously though what I was trying to say is that I have spent so much time on the short game neglecting the long game so just saying I need to practice the long game more.

Indeed. I spent all winter working on grip and swing changes and hitting full shots. Started the season brilliantly tee to green but my neglected short game let me down badly.

Started concentrating on short game practice and long game "went off". I need to find a better balance - and I will!

To be honest, my scores on average are probably better with great long game and "okish" short game rather than the other way round. The former generally means more bogeys than I'd like due to failing to get up and down, the latter more doubles and triples when I get into real problems after a poor long shot.

 

[Alex1975]

I understand that GIR is the number one way to improve, stats wise.

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Indeed. I spent all winter working on grip and swing changes and hitting full shots. Started the season brilliantly tee to green but my neglected short game let me down badly.

Started concentrating on short game practice and long game "went off". I need to find a better balance - and I will!

To be honest, my scores on average are probably better with great long game and "okish" short game rather than the other way round. The former generally means more bogeys than I'd like due to failing to get up and down, the latter more doubles and triples when I get into real problems after a poor long shot.

If I could guarantee more shots stayed in play my scores would drop significantly.
My problem has been putting myself in bad positions off the tee leading to an overall reliance on the short game.

If I used Game Golf I'm sure my average 5 iron would be about 130-150 yards long and about 3 feet off the ground - I'm becoming Seve like in my recovery play!

 

[rksquire]

Generally I'd rather be longer of the tee, but not always. Thinking about my own course I can hit the green with a drive at 2 par 4 holes (missing them is a chip so still better than a iron for my 2nd); 2 of the par 5s it's actually better to be long and in trouble than trying to ensure you're on fairway and plotting your way to the green with irons.

But others I'm undecided - eg our par 4 1st has a pond on left starting at 200, bunker on right starting at 210 with about 15-20 yards fairway between them; I can carry 220, rarely, and that only works if I'm on the line of the bunker - I'd need 235ish to clear the water. However, to get the green in 2 I have to hit driver. I could go iron to 260 ish, iron to whatever followed by wedge but I think I'm sure to be worse off or at best never any better than taking on the bunker / slim fairway.

I recently played with a guy of (5.7) 6 and his short game just okay but he hit it long and his putting was great. Maybe you just need 2 out of the 3 (driving, short game and putting)?

 

[Oddsocks]

I have always been in the camp of the short game is key and working from 100 yards in and chips around the green,getting up and down etc.

But after watching the golf last night im starting to think I might be wrong.

We always talk about being on the fairway instead of being 20-30 yards further up and maybe in the semi rough.

But watching Jason day last night bombing it out there 20-50 yards further than Jordan Speith was an eye opener.

Jason was sometimes taking 3 clubs less than Jordan on some holes.

Im certainly not saying neglect any short game practice but im definitely going to look at my driving a bit more and maybe learn to get a bit more distance because there no doubt going into a green with less club is more beneficial.

Any thoughts

There was a guy on here a few years back (Tim golfy??)!who was convinced distance was everything.

As you say when I'm standing at 160yards with an easy 6i and my playing partner is pulling an easy 9i there has to be something in it.

 

[londonlewis]

It depends on the course though surely?! Whistling straits has no trees, so the professionals can smash it down there and will normally be ok. Given they are such excellent bunker players, well most of them (both green-side and fairway bunkers), their risk and reward means you can justify bombing it.

But for us mere mortals, who can't smash a 5 iron out of a fairway bunker to 5 feet, we are better off ensuring we are down the middle instead of in a hazard.

In reality there is no right answer as to how to play a golf course every time, it depends on so many factors;
- weather conditions (different if it was wet, windy or dry as a bone)
- course conditions (different if the rough is long / short, greens are fast / slow)
- your ability - depending whether you have a good short game or rely on hitting greens
- your confidence that day - can you shape the ball how you want it, when you want it?

etc... etc...

I wouldn't recommend watching the men's game to determine how you should attack the golf course. If anything, I would recommend watching the women's game as their distances are more realistic to the average club golfer.

P.S I look forward to the many comments from men on this forum telling me how they hit it much further than the professional women on tour.

 

[FairwayDodger]

I wouldn't recommend watching the men's game to determine how you should attack the golf course. If anything, I would recommend watching the women's game as their distances are more realistic to the average club golfer.

P.S I look forward to the many comments from men on this forum telling me how they hit it much further than the professional women on tour.

I'll come from the other side, the pro women hit it further than the average club golfer!!