Poll: Single player status in your club

[dejf]

Do single golfers in your club have any standing on your course - i.e. should they be invited to go through by slower flights in front of them as suggested by the etiquette section of rule of golf since 2004; or do your club policy suggest that singles have no standing on the course as it was part of the rules before 2004?

This is just for poll, for discussion, please see another thread.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

It depends. The vast majority of the ladies will let a single player through without hesitation and so will a reasonable majority of the men. However, the one section that from personal experience and from the accounts of others that won't under any circumstances is the seniors who will flatly accept your presence and won't let you through no matter how quiet the course is ahead.

 

[Tiger man]

It depends. The vast majority of the ladies will let a single player through without hesitation and so will a reasonable majority of the men. However, the one section that from personal experience and from the accounts of others that won't under any circumstances is the seniors who will flatly accept your presence and won't let you through no matter how quiet the course is ahead.

I played in a two ball yesterday behind a pair of seniors who flat out refused to let us through even though we were waiting 5 to 10 minutes on each tee and the course was clear ahead. Very annoying and uncalled for until they decided to finally let us through, on the 18th! Absolutely pointless and sure it was done as a wind up. Had a word with the pro but sure nothing will change.

 

[Slab]

I played in a two ball yesterday behind a pair of seniors who flat out refused to let us through even though we were waiting 5 to 10 minutes on each tee and the course was clear ahead. Very annoying and uncalled for until they decided to finally let us through, on the 18th! Absolutely pointless and sure it was done as a wind up. Had a word with the pro but sure nothing will change.

Weird, how did the conversation go/what did they say to justify their stance?

 

[Rlburnside]

Sadly this seems to be a problem at many clubs, in Tigers case the pro should follow this up with the committee , in Homers case this seems to be a problem at his club with certain members, it the pro can't be more active in solving this problem it should be taken farther to the committee to try and resolve this.

Untill members start complaining more the problem will not go away, I would hate to think any guest at our club playing as a single would not be let through.

 

[patricks148]

yes at ours all groups have a status on the course, only time they don't is behind a club match who always get priority.

 

[dejf]

yes at ours all groups have a status on the course, only time they don't is behind a club match who always get priority.

This actually suggest that your club does have an overriding policy as they feel a club match is something special that entitles golfers to justify poor ettiquete (not sure how else to call it, but it is simply against the modern version of it) behavior.

I don't believe that a club match is something so important that needs special treatment. Because if it was, you would get a course closed to play that (just as courses hosting PGA comps are). If the course is not closed for regular play, the match is surely not that important.

 

[patricks148]

This actually suggest that your club does have an overriding policy as they feel a club match is something special that entitles golfers to justify poor ettiquete (not sure how else to call it, but it is simply against the modern version of it) behavior.

I don't believe that a club match is something so important that needs special treatment. Because if it was, you would get a course closed to play that (just as courses hosting PGA comps are). If the course is not closed for regular play, the match is surely not that important.

its not against single players if there was a 4 ball or greensomes match, a 3 ball would not or 2 ball would have to wait to get though, though in realty its only people who don't like letting people through under any circumstances that adhere to this.

and i would have though more clubs have this rule about club matches having priority than as single having no status.

 

[Lord Tyrion]

Rule or not, lots of older golfers still believe it is the case. Another way golf shoots itself in the foot.

 

[duncan mackie]

This actually suggest that your club does have an overriding policy as they feel a club match is something special that entitles golfers to justify poor ettiquete (not sure how else to call it, but it is simply against the modern version of it) behavior.

I don't believe that a club match is something so important that needs special treatment. Because if it was, you would get a course closed to play that (just as courses hosting PGA comps are). If the course is not closed for regular play, the match is surely not that important.

One of the reasons associated with lab matches is catering arrangements, the other is that they create their own course speed according to the format they are being played ie all games can (and should) be hard up on the game in front so playing a game through them all (and who knows what's in front of them!) is counter productive to pace of play all round.
They are also in the diary for time and format well in advance so the balance of membership can work round them, or pack sandwiches (note I'm not implying that all matches are played at a slow pace!).

Can't do polls but we revised our membership notes to reflect the R&As advice.

Finally, as ever with etiquette issues, it's not really the rules but the area reflected and common courtesy should be applied by everyone playing the game. To state that club rules mean we have priority and therefore don't have to let you through is completely missing the point - and experience suggests that anyone who thinks like this isn't going to let you through even if the Club rule was changed!

 

[chrisd]

we're fortunate in having a two tee start with 2 balls off (say) the 1st tee and 3 and 4 balls off the 10th, this switches after 90 minutes and works, by and large, pretty well. If players check their diary and there's a club match all other players can go off the wrong tee at the wrong time if the pro shop allow, so there is little reason for (say) 3 x 2 balls to rock up behind an 8 x 4 ball club match and all expecting to be let through. It does just take common sense at ours

 

[dejf]

One of the reasons associated with lab matches is catering arrangements, the other is that they create their own course speed according to the format they are being played ie all games can (and should) be hard up on the game in front so playing a game through them all (and who knows what's in front of them!) is counter productive to pace of play all round.
They are also in the diary for time and format well in advance so the balance of membership can work round them, or pack sandwiches (note I'm not implying that all matches are played at a slow pace!).

For that, I think it is really easy solution that I apply to myself - if there is nowhere to go - i.e. I wait on the group in front of me but that group has no empty hole in front of them, then I do not even want to go through. Obviously because the overall effect of me playing through several flights would be negative and could really affect their play - as you say, it would be counter productive. If you put your single ball behind a tournament full of flights, it is your decision and there is no why to let you through unless there is really an empty space to go.

On the other hand, if there is empty space in front, it does not matter what the flight is playing. Be it the most important match of their entire life, if there is space in front of you, let go.

 

[duncan mackie]

For that, I think it is really easy solution that I apply to myself - if there is nowhere to go - i.e. I wait on the group in front of me but that group has no empty hole in front of them, then I do not even want to go through. Obviously because the overall effect of me playing through several flights would be negative and could really affect their play - as you say, it would be counter productive. If you put your single ball behind a tournament full of flights, it is your decision and there is no why to let you through unless there is really an empty space to go.

On the other hand, if there is empty space in front, it does not matter what the flight is playing. Be it the most important match of their entire life, if there is space in front of you, let go.

Indeed. I've played a pair through as last game in a match many times - mainly to make the point on how slowly my partner or opponents are playing!

 

[Slab]

There’s two things to consider
1. The common sense of letting any faster group through into space
2. The common sense that any comp/match is more important than a practice game

Why on earth would a larger group a comp/match not let a single through into space, to not is just lacking in common sense and shows poor etiquette

But

Why on earth would a single allow their practice to interrupt a competitive game, to do so is just lacking in common sense and shows poor etiquette

For any match/comp group to not let a single through both the above have gone wrong

Once in that situation then 10/10 they should overlook the poor etiquette of the single and let them through

 

[dejf]

There’s two things to consider
1. The common sense of letting any faster group through into space
2. The common sense that any comp/match is more important than a practice game

Why on earth would a larger group a comp/match not let a single through into space, to not is just lacking in common sense and shows poor etiquette

But

Why on earth would a single allow their practice to interrupt a competitive game, to do so is just lacking in common sense and shows poor etiquette

For any match/comp group to not let a single through both the above have gone wrong

Once in that situation then 10/10 they should overlook the poor etiquette of the single and let them through

I fail to see how me starting a my single game about 90 minutes before the fourball (that I did not even know it is there but OK that could be my fault, but could not see they were playing something) and going smoothly through the course's 12 holes is a poor etiquette. I just hit the wall, not even asking to let them through, just waiting on each tee watching them ignoring me after one of them told me they were playing match. Also, I am not sure how can letting through affect the match, unless the players never do that and so they are not used to let faster flights through, and hence it would really be a new situation to them that would put them off their game.

 

[Slab]

I fail to see how me starting a my single game about 90 minutes before the fourball (that I did not even know it is there but OK that could be my fault, but could not see they were playing something) and going smoothly through the course's 12 holes is a poor etiquette. I just hit the wall, not even asking to let them through, just waiting on each tee watching them ignoring me after one of them told me they were playing match. Also, I am not sure how can letting through affect the match, unless the players never do that and so they are not used to let faster flights through, and hence it would really be a new situation to them that would put them off their game.

I'd have let you pass and I think they should have too but you can't just focus on what they might have done

Was there no pro or starter to advise you on the course or for you to ask general questions when you checked in/tee'd off?

• How's the course today, anything I should know about? (like green-keeper works etc)
• Are all tee boxes open today for a practice round?
• Any groups/comps/matches out there or due after me?

Pretty general/generic info really that's not only useful to you but shows you care about the course, the staff & other players and lets you plan your practice round a bit better

Maybe then after the game instead of telling them they have poor etiquette you could have asked who won/what comp was it etc etc

 

[patricks148]

come to think of it the main benefit for the matches having priority is if they are coming off the 18th all square they can continue onto the 1st tee for extra holes

 

[Liverbirdie]

Inter-Club and club matches should take priority over bounce games, although personally I would let someone through if I was in a larger slower group, if convenient, or if we had lost a 1-2 holes and an opportunity arose. My priority in a proper comp is our game, and the rest of the comp, though.

I;ve been on bot ends of the situation and accept it, selfish for people playing bounce games to expect normal etiquette when comps are out there.

 

[DCB]

yes at ours all groups have a status on the course, only time they don't is behind a club match who always get priority.

I'm assuming by "club match" you mean an inter club match - league match or the likes. At my club the tee is reserved for 30 mins before the Match is due to start and players behind can't tee off until the last group in the match are on the second tee. These are all good golfers playing a scratch match, representing their respective clubs. Anyone expecting to be able to jump into the midst of a match really doesn't get it IMO.

Bobmac made a fine point in the other thread,

I think common sense has to work both ways.
There's no point going out on your own behind a 40 strong society playing in 4 balls as your not going to get through. Better to make some friends and play as a 4 ball or just avoid the rush hour

What are you doing playing on your own, get out there and find some like minded golfers to play with.

 

[patricks148]

I'm assuming by "club match" you mean an inter club match - league match or the likes. At my club the tee is reserved for 30 mins before the Match is due to start and players behind can't tee off until the last group in the match are on the second tee. These are all good golfers playing a scratch match, representing their respective clubs. Anyone expecting to be able to jump into the midst of a match really doesn't get it IMO.

Bobmac made a fine point in the other thread,



What are you doing playing on your own, get out there and find some like minded golfers to play with.

no, knock out cups as well as interclub matches, though for the M&N league the tee will be blocked half hour before and after.