Plugged ball

[dudley.williams]

Playing in a match play, four ball better ball, my partner and I both drove into the light rough.

On arriving at our balls, my partner incorrectly identified my ball as his and as it was 'plugged' proceeded to lift it (on agreement). After discovering this he dropped it. When asked for a ruling, no one in the group had an answer, so we agreed to play my ball as it lay until we could get a ruling post-match. I therefore played the ball as it lay and went on to win the hole and we eventually won the match (1 up).

On arriving at the club house, we raised this with the Pro's and management team.

The final decision was that we should have lost the hole and awarded it to the opposition - i.e. a total of minus two holes, therefore losing the match one down. Was this correct?

What should we have done - on the hole and was the penalty correct?.

I'd be very grateful if you are able to advise on this.

Many thanks.

 

[guest100718]

I think you would get a one shot pen after PP moved your ball, but then it sounds like you played it from the wrong place as well, becasue I think it should have been replaced, which is loss of hole.

 

[peter_w]

PP should have replaced the ball, allowing you to continue under a one stroke penalty (20-1). If they'd declared they were identifying and had marked the ball, no penalty would have applied.

As is, it's loss of hole.

 

[doublebogey7]

A ball to be lifted under the Rules may be lifted by the player, his partner or any other person authorised by the player, (Rule 20-1) so no problem there.
However a ball to be dropped under the Rules must be dropped by the player himself (Rule 20-2), the penalty for not doing so would be one stroke if not corrected.

So for me the hole was halved, unless of course I have missed something.

 

[Region3]

In Matchplay, don't issues like this have to be resolved before teeing off on the next hole? ie, right or wrong, it stands?

 

[LIG]

In Matchplay, don't issues like this have to be resolved before teeing off on the next hole? ie, right or wrong, it stands?

This is correct.....I think.

 

[chrisd]

Can be resolved by the comittee

 

[doublebogey7]

In Matchplay, don't issues like this have to be resolved before teeing off on the next hole? ie, right or wrong, it stands?

No, as long as the OP's opponents made a claim before any player had made a stroke from the next teeing ground then the committee must considor that claim. (Rule 2-5).

 

[Colin L]

Dudley, could you clarify whether the ball was lifted in order to identify it, or under a local rule allowing relief from and embedded ball through the green, or without such a local rule but in the mistaken belief that you can take relief? Also what happened with your partner's ball. Did he play out the hole and if so what was his score compared with your opponents' better score?

@Region 3 Either an opponent must make a claim before playing off at the next tee or the players can agree to seek a ruling if doubtful of procedure.

 

[dudley.williams]

Hi, Colin,

My partner picked up the ball in the mistaken belief that it was his ball. He only realised that it wasn't when he had picked it up.

He went on the play the hole but did not beat my 5 net 4 or our opponents' 5.

 

[woody69]

I would have thought that as soon as your partner identified your ball as his and picked it up, he breached rule 18-2, which is a penalty of 1 stroke for you. As the ball was moved, it was your responsibility to replace it, so by him dropping it and you not, you were now in breach of 18-2, which for matchplay meant loss of hole.

 

[dudley.williams]

Thanks for this, Woody...........................so bottom line is loss of hole.

 

[doublebogey7]

Thanks for this, Woody...........................so bottom line is loss of hole.

Sorry but I disagree.

Rule 18-2 starts by stating "Except as permitted by the Rules". Rule 20-1 clearly allows a partner to lift a ball under any circumstances permitted by the rules. The OP's partner could therefore not be in breach of Rule 18-2.

However rule 20-2 tells us that a ball to be dropped under the rules must be dropped by the player himself. Failure in not correcting the error results in a one shot penalty. Therefore the hole was halved.

 

[duncan mackie]

Sorry but I disagree.

Rule 18-2 starts by stating "Except as permitted by the Rules". Rule 20-1 clearly allows a partner to lift a ball under any circumstances permitted by the rules. The OP's partner could therefore not be in breach of Rule 18-2.

However rule 20-2 tells us that a ball to be dropped under the rules must be dropped by the player himself. Failure in not correcting the error results in a one shot penalty. Therefore the hole was halved.

:thup:

 

[doublebogey7]

:thup:

Thanks Duncan good to get an expert confirm.

 

[duncan mackie]

Thanks Duncan good to get an expert confirm.

I thought you had covered it fine in post #4 but later posts suggested a little support for your perspective might be useful!

 

[woody69]

Sorry but I disagree.

Rule 18-2 starts by stating "Except as permitted by the Rules". Rule 20-1 clearly allows a partner to lift a ball under any circumstances permitted by the rules. The OP's partner could therefore not be in breach of Rule 18-2.

However rule 20-2 tells us that a ball to be dropped under the rules must be dropped by the player himself. Failure in not correcting the error results in a one shot penalty. Therefore the hole was halved.

20-1 states the ball must be marked when lifted if it is being replaced. Is the fact it is only being dropped and not actually replaced negate the need for the person lifting to mark the ball then?

 

[doublebogey7]

20-1 states the ball must be marked when lifted if it is being replaced. Is the fact it is only being dropped and not actually replaced negate the need for the person lifting to mark the ball then?

That's correct although I would suggest it is good practise to mark the ball whenever lifting to avoid disputes around where a ball should be dropped.

 

[rulefan]

As the drop wasn't corrected, was the ball played from a 'wrong place'?

 

[doublebogey7]

As the drop wasn't corrected, was the ball played from a 'wrong place'?

No as rule 20-2 tells us that failure to correct the error results in a one shot penalty.