Played the wrong ball

[chrisd]

Yesterday I was playing in a pairs better ball matchplay game and stupidly played the wrong ball. It was lack of concentration and totally my own fault. What I can't understand is why at that point I'm d/q'd from the hole and not just subject to a 2 shot penalty as I would be in strokeplay.

Ok, it was stroke index one and I was giving shots all round so it didn't matter in the end, but, I can't understand the fact that I cant add a 2 stroke penalty and carry on, as it could still be possible for me to recover the hole.

Anyone tell me the logic?


Chris

 

[palindromicbob]

I take it your partner didn't go on to win the hole then? It's the same for a lot of rules where a breech results in loss of hole in matchplay but would be 2 strokes in other formats.

The logic? No idea but it'll teach you to concentrate next time

 

[SocketRocket]

I can only guess that it relates to Matchplay where if it was 'two ball' Matchplay then you would have lost the hole when striking the wrong ball. DQ'ing you in fourball and letting your partner continue is more consistent with Matchplay than giving a two shot penalty like Strokeplay.

Hope that is not too muddled

 

[CMAC]

its a good question chrisd, I'm interested in the answer as well, maybe mashie knows

 

[chrisd]

I understand that the various misdemenours in matchplay means your out of the hole but I just dont see why the penalty isn't the same as stroke play


As it happens my partner got a half on the hole, so no damage was done


Chris

 

[rosecott]

In the rules of 1812, the penalty for striking the adversary’s ball was loss of hole. (It would seem that the rules at that time covered matchplay only.)
In 1891, the penalty was changed to a 1 stroke penalty.
In 1899 it was changed back to loss of hole in matchplay and playing a wrong ball in strokeplay was mentioned for the first time. Clearly in strokeplay you couldn’t “lose the hole” and there was no penalty if you corrected the situation.
In 1908, in strokeplay, there was no penalty for playing one stroke with a wrong ball but DQ for two successive strokes.
In 1933, no DQ but 2 stroke penalty for first stroke with wrong ball.
In 1952, current rules confirmed as loss of hole in matchplay and 2 stroke penalty in strokeplay.
The short answer is that the rules for playing a wrong ball were originally concerned with matchplay only and it was clearly the intention to maintain that penalty for matchplay. This meant that different penalty was needed for strokeplay, hence two stroke penalty.
I can remember every change as they were introduced!

 

[DaveM]

Blimey you must be nearly as old as me. ..

 

[MashieNiblick]

Interesting question and I bow to Rosecott on this one.

There are quite a few rules where the penalty is "matchplay loss of hole, stroke play 2 strokes" and it's a good question as to why this is so.

My guess would be, as suggested by Rosecott, that the penalties originated in matchplay, which was the preferred type of play for many years, and a stroke play equivalent was later adopted.

However nowadays with the prevalence of stroke play I can't see why it wouldn't be possible in a lot of cases (such as this one) for the penalty to be 2 strokes whether it is matchplay or stroke play. As Chris says that would mean you were still in hole rather than effectively having a "one strike and you're out" type penalty.

The R&A will say it's traditional I suppose. Maybe one for the Rules section in the magazine.

 

[wull]

i personally don't see the problem with the "loss of hole" ruling when it comes to matchplay.you have many more holes to make it up and in a sense losing one hole is better than a 2 stroke penalty because you lose a hole by being 1 shot worse than the opposition anyway.

 

[MashieNiblick]

I think the issue is that the loss of hole penalty instantly puts you out of the hole, which in some cases might be rather extreme and unfair compared to a 2 stroke penalty, which is bad enough in itself.

So A and B are playing a match. All square, playing the last.

A hits OOB, reloads and finds a fairway bunker, he knocks it out but is still 150 from the green, playing 5.

B's drive has gone in semi rough, he plays to the green but walking up sees another ball nearby sitting down a bit. It's his. First ball was wrong ball. Instant loss of hole and in this case the match. If it was a 2 stroke penalty as in stroke play he could carry on, playing 4, and still have a chance to halve or win the hole.

There are a few rules where this applies (basically breaches of Rules where the penalty in stroke play is 2 strokes, e.g. grounding your club in bunker) and others where it is just a 1 stroke penalty whether it is match play or stroke play (e.g. hitting the ball twice).

 

[chrisd]

Great answer guys

I have sometimes halved a hole in matchplay with as much as a 7, so the loss of a hole due to an offence that could be quite insignificant is, possibly, quite extreme. It's obvious that the same offence in a strokeplay event has to have a value put to it as you cant disqualify people for the offence of, say, playing a wrong ball (so long as they correct the error per the rules) but I still, after your answers, am still mystified as to the logic!


Chris