NR Handicap increases

[stevelev]

Just a quick one to see whether it is the norm to have a handicap increase when someone has an NR on their card.

The card that was submitted did not have a players signature, nor did it have a score submitted for the 18th hole.

The card was a good 8 shots over the CSS so outside the buffer, but is it normal to still have an increase placed on the handicap even though they are DQ'd and NR's on the same card?????

Thanks in advance

 

[Kellfire]

Just a quick one to see whether it is the norm to have a handicap increase when someone has an NR on their card.

The card that was submitted did not have a players signature, nor did it have a score submitted for the 18th hole.

The card was a good 8 shots over the CSS so outside the buffer, but is it normal to still have an increase placed on the handicap even though they are DQ'd and NR's on the same card?????

Thanks in advance

Yes, you can be DQed but the card still counts for handicap purposes. A no return is 0.1 back.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

Yep. NR is 0.1 back. I would rather complete the round if I can. In my mind once you start to NR, it can become the easy option and I wouldn't want to give myself the option. I can see how and why people do and I have no qualms. Just knowing me and how lazy I can get it could develop into a habit

 

[kid2]

Yes, you can bed DQed but the card still counts for handicap purposes. A no return is 0.1 back.

Not necessarily.... I had an NR on one hole 3 weeks ago in a Medal.... Automatic DQ.... But i played on and actually came back in on the buffer...... You can still get cut also even with a DQ.....Thats if you submit the card and play out the round honestly....

 

[HawkeyeMS]

It's normal and correct. If you enter the competition and fail to score buffer or better you get 0.1 back. You can however still get cut or buffer if you NR or get DQ'd if you complete the rest of the round under competition rules.

 

[Kellfire]

Not necessarily.... I had an NR on one hole 3 weeks ago in a Medal.... Automatic DQ.... But i played on and actually came back in on the buffer...... You can still get cut also even with a DQ.....Thats if you submit the card and play out the round honestly....

I meant NR as in don't return the card, not NR a hole. Should've been clearer.

 

[kid2]

I meant NR as in don't return the card, not NR a hole. Should've been clearer.

Crossed wires Pal.....:thup:

 

[duncan mackie]

Just a quick one to see whether it is the norm to have a handicap increase when someone has an NR on their card.

probably easier to look at it the other way - 2 player's walk off the 17th having played 20 shots over their handicaps.

one NR's the 18th, or does someting to get DQ'd - the other returns a score.

why would you expect them to be treated differently for handicap purposes?

 

[rosecott]

I meant NR as in don't return the card, not NR a hole. Should've been clearer.

Counted as "no score recorded" - still 0.1 upwards.

 

[HughJars]

I meant NR as in don't return the card, not NR a hole. Should've been clearer.

Hopefully your club bans anyone who doesn't return a card at all.

 

[Kellfire]

Hopefully your club bans anyone who doesn't return a card at all.

Not finishing a competition is a one competition ban, increasing for repeat offenders.

 

[Foxholer]

Just a quick one to see whether it is the norm to have a handicap increase when someone has an NR on their card.

The card that was submitted did not have a players signature, nor did it have a score submitted for the 18th hole.

The card was a good 8 shots over the CSS so outside the buffer, but is it normal to still have an increase placed on the handicap even though they are DQ'd and NR's on the same card?????

Thanks in advance

Either/Both of those would be a DQ from the Competition, but - except if deemed premeditated - neither would automatically be a 'No Return' for handicap purposes - which is done on a hole-by-hole basis, so the 18th would go down as a Nett Double.

That's a similar situation to what Kid posted about.

Handicap Secretaries manually entering the score of a Card that is out of Buffer and has either of those conditions would probably just enter NR (or not enter the details and accept the mismatches between Starting Sheet and Returns as NRs). On Player Input systems, he'd probably just accept whatever the player entered.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

Hopefully your club bans anyone who doesn't return a card at all.

Why? I'm not saying your wrong, I just don't quite follow why what you say should be true. What's the difference between a 0.1 for missing the buffer vs a 0.1 for doing that but then not putting in a card?

I'm sure I'm missing something obvious.

 

[pbrown7582]

I

Why? I'm not saying your wrong, I just don't quite follow why what you say should be true. What's the difference between a 0.1 for missing the buffer vs a 0.1 for doing that but then not putting in a card?

I'm sure I'm missing something obvious.

I thought you were obliged to complete a score for any further holes after a NR as handicap and CSS is calculated using stableford points a NR hole is classed as a blob and you still get an increase or cut dependant on the rest of your holes.

 

[williamalex1]

Why? I'm not saying your wrong, I just don't quite follow why what you say should be true. What's the difference between a 0.1 for missing the buffer vs a 0.1 for doing that but then not putting in a card?

I'm sure I'm missing something obvious.

I think its to stop people manipulating their h/c by only putting in cards they want to be counted. Put your card good or bad in and let the computer decide. , I think nrs can alter the css ??

 

[Foxholer]

I

I thought you were obliged to complete a score for any further holes after a NR as handicap and CSS is calculated using stableford points a NR hole is classed as a blob and you still get an increase or cut dependant on the rest of your holes.

Well, you can. But that wasn't going to happen in the above case.

I think its to stop people manipulating their h/c by only putting in cards they want to be counted. Put your card good or bad in and let the computer decide. , I think nrs can alter the css ??

NRs do indeed affect CSS - in the same way as any outside-buffer score.

 

[Canary_Yellow]

At my club there's a focus on making sure people do submit cards either way at the moment for administrative purposes - the secretary has to go through the list of entrants and tick off cards handed in to work out who didn't if the total entrants doesn't match the number of cards.

I can see the handicap "management" argument, but I don't think making people hand in a card is going to stop that happening in any case, if someone really is that set on effectively cheating then they will.

 

[chrisd]

I did establish a couple of years ago with the EGU that an n/r due to injury shouldn't result in a .1 increase. I was told that the card should not be put through the system.

 

[DAVEYBOY]

I N/R in medal about 2 months back and I'm still in the process of getting .1 added to my HCP

 

[CirenBhoy]

This is an interesting topic for me. At our club its an automatic 0.1 but no other sanction.

Now if its a legitimate NR ( e.g. injury) then I would say thats fine.
But it depends on the mindset of the player. The aim of every golfer should be to play there best and lower their handicap accordingly. There are those that see a "bad round" and subsequent increase as an opportunity to win next time out.

For this latter type there should be additional punishment. I like the idea of a competition ban, 1 round and rising for subsequent offences.

But the problem with this is how do you determine whether someone is working the system?

It would need to involve club rules stipulating that if during a medal you NR on a hole then you must continue the round as normal and have your card signed and returned as normal.
For Stablefords then cards must always be returned.

Dont think there is any way to determine whether someone has retired from injury as this is too difficult to prove one way or another. Probably would just need to be annotated on scorecard and signed off by marker. Then its at the competition committee's discretion.