Minister grabs activist

Beezerk

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Been following the enquiry into the Borough market terrorist attack. Apparantly one of the terrorist was shot when they were a couple of feet away. Its seems to me that with hindsight you are a couple of feet or a couple of seconds away from being a hero or a spineless git.
I can't believe you are comparing these two things lol. Do you seriously think anyone would be claiming he was in the right had he not concocted his cock and bull "thought she had a weapon" defence?
 
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Hobbit

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I can't believe you are comparing these two things lol. Do you seriously think anyone would be claiming he was in the right had he not concocted his cock and bull "thought she had a weapon" defence?
But can you prove he didn't think what he said he did? Personally I don't know either way but I'd err on the side of caution rather than have my guts hanging out.
 
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Tashyboy

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I can't believe you are comparing these two things lol. Do you seriously think anyone would be claiming he was in the right had he not concocted his cock and bull "thought she had a weapon" defence?
All i am saying is, with hindsight. If security had done there job. There would if been no story. 30 women dressed in red. Theres a clue there. These people that say they are protestors, are they protestors or anarchists. They have no respect for the law. If 30 women can gatecrash that event with high profile people there, who else could. I don't think think they would of been waving placards either.
 

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I can't believe you are comparing these two things lol. Do you seriously think anyone would be claiming he was in the right had he not concocted his cock and bull "thought she had a weapon" defence?
She could’ve easily grabbed something from the table to use as a weapon
 

Beezerk

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But can you prove he didn't think what he said he did? Personally I don't know either way but I'd err on the side of caution rather than have my guts hanging out.
I can't either Bri, but watching the footage he never takes his eyes of hers and doesn't even attempt to look for the fabled weapon. For me he's seen her prancing around the room, got the red mist and made a lunge as he's had enough of it all.
 

Beezerk

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She could’ve easily grabbed something from the table to use as a weapon
So could any waiter/waitress in disguise.
By the same token the fella could have taken a knife and stabbed the woman.
How far do we take this?
It's almost normalising violence, if someone feels threatened they can lash out and claim they thought the other person had a weapon or grabbed at something to use as a weapon.
Mad a tell thi.
 

Hobbit

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I can't either Bri, but watching the footage he never takes his eyes of hers and doesn't even attempt to look for the fabled weapon. For me he's seen her prancing around the room, got the red mist and made a lunge as he's had enough of it all.
Did he see her prancing around the room? I'm only playing Devil's Advocate but I'd rather deal in absolutes in this mad world.
 

Hacker Khan

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She could’ve easily grabbed something from the table to use as a weapon
Yes, she could also have been a fembot and shot bullets from her bra. After all, there is no end to the number of scenarios you can come up with to desperately justify what he did.

 

Slime

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I can't believe so many people are getting so upset at a man ejecting a woman from somewhere she had absolutely no right to be.
Did he use force? Absolutely.
Was it excessive? Absolutely not.

Well done, I'd say.
Stupid woman, what did she expect?
 

Liverpoolphil

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If she came at me with a machete I sure wouldn't ask her if she wanted sugar in her coffee. Its about context of the situation AND the wider context of the world today.

Although she was in an evening gown, with little room to hide anything, what's not to say she was at the extreme end of the Greenpeace movement.
How many “extreme” Greenpeace demonstrators do you see these days ? She wasn’t some sort of secret agent with things hidden inside the gown. It was a “disruptive” demonstration which whilst annoying should have been left to security to deal with - just let them shout away , stand back and let the people being paid to deal with them. Taking matters into your own hands is a very slippery slope , even more so if the person is not trained , all it needed was for her to slip because of his actions for things to go wrong - you could tell he was very angry about what they had done and acted that way
I can't believe so many people are getting so upset at a man ejecting a woman from somewhere she had absolutely no right to be.
Did he use force? Absolutely.
Was it excessive? Absolutely not.

Well done, I'd say.
Stupid woman, what did she expect?
First question - did he have the right to use force ? Was she threatening him ? Was she threatening anyone , was she using force against anyone ?. There was no need for him to use force because no one was in any immediate danger

And excessive - who deems that ? He grabbed by the throat and then marched her out by the back of her neck - was that force more than what was required ? For me the answer is yes - he had no need or right to manhandle her the way he did

And I’m not being upset by it but you could see that he got very angry about a protest and snapped. Some will claim him some sort of hero which for me is really poor
 
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How many “extreme” Greenpeace demonstrators do you see these days ? She wasn’t some sort of secret agent with things hidden inside the gown. It was a “disruptive” demonstration which whilst annoying should have been left to security to deal with - just let them shout away , stand back and let the people being paid to deal with them. Taking matters into your own hands is a very slippery slope , even more so if the person is not trained , all it needed was for her to slip because of his actions for things to go wrong - you could tell he was very angry about what they had done and acted that way


First question - did he have the right to use force ? Was she threatening him ? Was she threatening anyone , was she using force against anyone ?. There was no need for him to use force because no one was in any immediate danger

And excessive - who deems that ? He grabbed by the throat and then marched her out by the back of her neck - was that force more than what was required ? For me the answer is yes - he had no need or right to manhandle her the way he did

And I’m not being upset by it but you could see that he got very angry about a protest and snapped. Some will claim him some sort of hero which for me is really poor
Surely the throat is at the front of the neck.

I only saw him holding her at the back of the neck as he frog-marched her out.

I am not saying that he handled the situation well but it is dangerous to present an exaggerated picture.
 

Liverpoolphil

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Not a hero, just someone doing the right thing. Ask the French and Russians about how extreme Greenpeace can be.
Is it really the right thing ? Right now he has been suspended with the police looking into his actions - saw a longer clip earlier and saw him marched her out gripping round the back of the neck ? Is that really the right thing to do ?. Is the right thing not to just let security deal with it and stay out of it ?

And we aren’t in France or Russia and I can’t recall the last violent Greenpeace protest in the UK
 

Liverpoolphil

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Surely the throat is at the front of the neck.

I only saw him holding her at the back of the neck as he frog-marched her out.

I am not saying that he handled the situation well but it is dangerous to present an exaggerated picture.
He initially grabbed her by the throat quickly at the start and then turned her round and marched her out by holding the her neck

EDF7562F-0E79-45F1-8571-9D34C48104CF.jpeg

The worst thing is that they were allowed to get that far in the first place - shocking security
 

SocketRocket

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How many “extreme” Greenpeace demonstrators do you see these days ? She wasn’t some sort of secret agent with things hidden inside the gown. It was a “disruptive” demonstration which whilst annoying should have been left to security to deal with - just let them shout away , stand back and let the people being paid to deal with them. Taking matters into your own hands is a very slippery slope , even more so if the person is not trained , all it needed was for her to slip because of his actions for things to go wrong - you could tell he was very angry about what they had done and acted that way


First question - did he have the right to use force ? Was she threatening him ? Was she threatening anyone , was she using force against anyone ?. There was no need for him to use force because no one was in any immediate danger

And excessive - who deems that ? He grabbed by the throat and then marched her out by the back of her neck - was that force more than what was required ? For me the answer is yes - he had no need or right to manhandle her the way he did

And I’m not being upset by it but you could see that he got very angry about a protest and snapped. Some will claim him some sort of hero which for me is really poor
Dont exaggerate, no ones calling him a 'Hero' At times you have to use a gut reaction to situations as you only have a split second to react. When the knife is in your neck or the acid in your face its too late, you must know this. High profile people are particularity vunerable these days. On balance I can't see how any reasonable person could see anything wrong. If she doesn't want that kind of treatment then she should keep to legal methods of protest.
 

ColchesterFC

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How many “extreme” Greenpeace demonstrators do you see these days ? She wasn’t some sort of secret agent with things hidden inside the gown.
In the picture you've posted in a later response she's clearly got a bag with her. How can anyone know what she could have in that?
 
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