Marking The Ball on the Green

[Deleted member 16999]

Playing today in a comp, one of the guys noticed another one of the other 2 putting his ball back about 1/2 an inch in front of the marker, when questioned he stated he puts the marker that far from the ball to avoid knocking it and so long as he uses the same distance to mark and pick up that's fine. I've always put my marker as close as I can to the ball, is he incorrect, Advice please.

 

[Tongo]

I'm always a bit wary of nudging the ball when using a marker so i place it a smidge behind the ball. But not half an inch!

 

[North Mimms]

I leave a wee gap so that the marker doesn't touch the base of the ball, but if I look straight down on ball (as when marking it), the front edge of marker "touches" back edge of ball so distance is always consistant

 

[Colin L]

There is no reason for his not putting his marker closer to his ball to avoid any doubt about the accuracy of his marking. If he moves his ball in the process of marking, there is no penalty and he replaces the ball. Decision 20-1/20 uses two inches as an example of being too far away and incurring a penalty. Half an inch might not seem that bad, but I'd suggest that if a player is marking sufficiently far from the ball to cause comment, it is in effect too far and he should change his practice.

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!decision-20,d20-1-20

 

[rulefan]

when questioned he stated he puts the marker that far from the ball to avoid knocking it. Advice please.

Suggest that he reads 18-2a(ii)
Under the Rules there is no penalty if a player accidentally causes his ball to move in the following circumstances:

• In lifting a ball under a Rule - Rule 20-1
• In placing or replacing a ball under a Rule - Rule 20-3a

 

[Deleted member 16999]

Suggest that he reads 18-2a(ii)
Under the Rules there is no penalty if a player accidentally causes his ball to move in the following circumstances:

• In lifting a ball under a Rule - Rule 20-1
• In placing or replacing a ball under a Rule - Rule 20-3a

Thank you, just to clarify, what if he knocks his ball in the process of marking it, i.e., when marker is not in place yet?

 

[Colin L]

Thank you, just to clarify, what if he knocks his ball in the process of marking it, i.e., when marker is not in place yet?

See post #4 and this bit of Rule 20-1:

If a ball or ball-marker is accidentally moved in the process of lifting the ball under a Rule or marking its position, the ball or ball-marker must be replaced. There is no penalty, provided the movement of the ball or ball-marker is directly attributable to the specific act of marking the position of or lifting the ball.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

See post #4 and this bit of Rule 20-1:

If a ball or ball-marker is accidentally moved in the process of lifting the ball under a Rule or marking its position, the ball or ball-marker must be replaced. There is no penalty, provided the movement of the ball or ball-marker is directly attributable to the specific act of marking the position of or lifting the ball.

Cheers

 

[rulefan]

See post #4 and this bit of Rule 20-1:

If a ball or ball-marker is accidentally moved in the process of lifting the ball under a Rule or marking its position, the ball or ball-marker must be replaced. There is no penalty, provided the movement of the ball or ball-marker is directly attributable to the specific act of marking the position of or lifting the ball.

See Colin's reply above but beware, if the ball is marked but not yet lifted and the player accidentally moves the ball (eg drops his club on it), he has breached the rule.

A marked ball is not necessarily out of play.

 

[azazel]

Would I be right in thinking along the following lines with regarding to 20-1 (marker being accidentally moved):

Someone who uses their thumb to push the marker into the green and the marker sticks to their finger when they lift it - no problem (in the process of marking)?

Someone who marks the ball then uses the sole of their putter to tap the marker down - problem (not in the process of marking as ball was marked before tapping with the putter)?

 

[Colin L]

Not quite. Correct with your understanding of the marker sticking to your thumb or finger but tapping down a marker with your putter is also considered part of the process of marking and so if the marker sticks to the putter you can replace it without penalty.

 

[azazel]

Not quite. Correct with your understanding of the marker sticking to your thumb or finger but tapping down a marker with your putter is also considered part of the process of marking and so if the marker sticks to the putter you can replace it without penalty.

Thanks. Happened a couple of years ago in consecutive rounds. I was the player in question for the tapping down and felt it was a penalty then the next week a playing partner had the other scenario and we were sure that was ok. At least it was only me that lost out but lesson learned.

 

[Colin L]

You're welcome. Decision 20-1/6 is your reference should you need to persuade anyone.

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!decision-20,d20-1-6

 

[PhilTheFragger]

Didnt Poults call a penalty on himself a year or so ago?
he marked his ball, then dropped the ball on the marker which jumped up and changed position

Got a lot of credit for his honesty I remember

 

[Colin L]

If you drop the marker and move the ball or vice versa it is not part of the marking process and yes, you are penalised.

 

[Foxholer]

Seem to remember that happened to someone in a quite recent PGA event.

 

[Deleted member 16999]

If you drop the marker and move the ball or vice versa it is not part of the marking process and yes, you are penalised.

Sorry Colin, probably coming across as a bit dim here, so I bend over to mark my ball and as I get close I accidentally drop my poker chip and it hits and moves the ball, is it a penalty?

 

[Region3]

Sorry Colin, probably coming across as a bit dim here, so I bend over to mark my ball and as I get close I accidentally drop my poker chip and it hits and moves the ball, is it a penalty?

Yes. If either the ball or marker is dropped, no matter how high, it is a penalty if it causes the other to move.

See "directly attributable" in the definitions for a better explanation.

 

[Colin L]

See Decision 20-1/15 for the explanation of "directly attributable."

http://www.usga.org/rules/rules-and-decisions.html#!decision-20,d20-1-15

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

In a match yesterday evening - two marking related situations arose.

1) My opponent's ball is on the green - and he marks it. But when he comes to replace it he can't get it to stay put - what to do?

2) We've still got preferred lies local rule in place - mark, lift, clean and place within 6". My ball was on the fringe of green with a fair bit of not well cut pretty hairy grass on my line to the hole. But I was only 3" from lovely lovely - putting surface. So I though - aha - mark ball and place within 6" not nearer the hole on the green - what's not to like?

I now know the answers to both but thought I'd fling them out there on here just to see ...

BTW - I didn't do 2) as I wasn't sure. Always the best thing when you don't know - play as lies even if you subsequently find that you had ignored an advantage.