LIV Golf

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Aug 2, 2017
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seems people are falling in to a few categories

1. Really don't like the way PGAT is run so have thrown all their eggs into the LIV basket, promoting everything about it and slating everything from the PGAT, because anything is better than than status quo
2. People who aren't particularly enamoured by the PGAT, don't think the LIV is great but will watch it because they like watching golf
3. People who are not fussed at all and agnostic on pretty much everything relating to LIV and PGAT
4. People who in principle have nothing against a new tour, but don't think LIV has been set up or run at all well, and in its current form has actually a negative impact on world golf and cannot see that changing unless LIV completely change how they operate
5. People who are very much against the Saudi State using sport as a propaganda tool and so cannot like LIV out of principle
6. People who like to post about how many posts there are
 

4LEX

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LIV players have made their own bed with regard to ranking points, majors and team events. They joined to play less for more dollar so why are they complaining they can't get into more events or have ranking points? All that matters is growing the game and doing something different supposedly....

It's clear now that was all nonsense and they want to have the best of both worlds. Not going to happen. They'll need to play more events and even qualifying events to get into majors whilst travelling to Asia and Australia for the ranking points :ROFLMAO:

I don't blame the guys for taking the money, I would've done the same if I was over 40 and my best days behind me. However if you do that show some class, backbone and stick to your decision without slithering around and crying like a baby over other tours and ranking points. The younger players have made a bad move.

My own take is I hope the PGA Tour, DP World Tour, the majors and broadcasters shun them. It might cause chaos for a year or two but they'll start crawling back and cancelling the LIV contracts. No one is irreplaceable and as long as they're falling out of the world rankings, getting less coverage and not in the majors no one will care about them.
 
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LIV players have made their own bed with regard to ranking points, majors and team events. They joined to play less for more dollar so why are they complaining they can't get into more events or have ranking points? All that matters is growing the game and doing something different supposedly....

It's clear now that was all nonsense and they want to have the best of both worlds. Not going to happen. They'll need to play more events and even qualifying events to get into majors whilst travelling to Asia and Australia for the ranking points :ROFLMAO:

I don't blame the guys for taking the money, I would've done the same if I was over 40 and my best days behind me. However if you do that show some class, backbone and stick to your decision without slithering around and crying like a baby over other tours and ranking points. The younger players have made a bad move.

My own take is I hope the PGA Tour, DP World Tour, the majors and broadcasters shun them. It might cause chaos for a year or two but they'll start crawling back and cancelling the LIV contracts. No one is irreplaceable and as long as they're falling out of the world rankings, getting less coverage and not in the majors no one will care about them.
You're obviously well entitled to your opinion.
On this well used point -
"They joined to play less for more dollar"

To clarify, what % of players actually said this?
Your post reads like 100%
Or might it be 30%, or 3%
Or something you just know...
😉
 
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LIV players suing the PGAT to be allowed to play in their events is a strange one for me. What happens if PGAT players sue LIV to be able to play in their events? If, legally, there is a reason to allow LIV players to play on the PGAT then surely the reverse equally applies and PGAT players should be allowed to play in LIV events. And if PGAT players are allowed to play in the LIV events then surely they will need to be reimbursed to the same level as others playing in the same events.
 

Blue in Munich

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LIV players suing the PGAT to be allowed to play in their events is a strange one for me. What happens if PGAT players sue LIV to be able to play in their events? If, legally, there is a reason to allow LIV players to play on the PGAT then surely the reverse equally applies and PGAT players should be allowed to play in LIV events. And if PGAT players are allowed to play in the LIV events then surely they will need to be reimbursed to the same level as others playing in the same events.
Would LIV almost want that; get the pick of the players in one fell swoop by allowing the pick of the top 48 from the PGA Tour to join… 🤔
 
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LIV players suing the PGAT to be allowed to play in their events is a strange one for me. What happens if PGAT players sue LIV to be able to play in their events? If, legally, there is a reason to allow LIV players to play on the PGAT then surely the reverse equally applies and PGAT players should be allowed to play in LIV events. And if PGAT players are allowed to play in the LIV events then surely they will need to be reimbursed to the same level as others playing in the same events.
Thing is, this could have been the plan - a two way street of top players switching between the PGA and LIV series, to the benefit of all parties - We know that GN definitely approched both the PGA Tours and DPWT to try and work something out. With the benefit of hindsight, or foresight depending on where you are on the whole thing, it seems to me that something along those lines might have been a pretty good solution.
 
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Mr. Norman goes to Washington.

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2...iv-golf-series-saudi-arabia-us-congress-visit


One legal expert interviewed by the Guardian said that business ventures that are owned by foreign governments do sometimes escape scrutiny, but not when they are owned by a nation’s sovereign wealth fund, and not when there are legitimate questions about whether the business also has public relations goals involving the country’s image abroad.
“I think there are a lot of signs that LIV is not a typical business interest. I think there are a lot of reasons for the DoJ to potentially kick tires on this. I wouldn’t be surprised if they did,” said Matt Sanderson, a lawyer at Caplin & Drysdale who specialises in Fara cases. Sanderson said it was also unclear whether LIV intended to make a profit in the long run, raising further questions about its intentions.
 
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Thing is, this could have been the plan - a two way street of top players switching between the PGA and LIV series, to the benefit of all parties - We know that GN definitely approched both the PGA Tours and DPWT to try and work something out. With the benefit of hindsight, or foresight depending on where you are on the whole thing, it seems to me that something along those lines might have been a pretty good solution.
Solution, to what ?
 
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.....

My own take is I hope the PGA Tour, DP World Tour, the majors and broadcasters shun them. It might cause chaos for a year or two but they'll start crawling back and cancelling the LIV contracts. No one is irreplaceable and as long as they're falling out of the world rankings, getting less coverage and not in the majors no one will care about them.
Re the bit above, isn't that what has been happening since June ? (If we restrict broadcasters to USA & UK).

The majors remain a bit of an unknown. The Masters position isn't clear. The 2 opens in 2022 happened after it started but hadn't really had time to digest/react.

What you outline could still happen. Just feels to me that with each week that passes it becomes less likely.
Is also more difficult to control internet coverage, and it looks as though a number were included due to their 'net presence.
 

Imurg

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You're obviously well entitled to your opinion.
On this well used point -
"They joined to play less for more dollar"

To clarify, what % of players actually said this?
Patrick Reed for 1.
Now he's signed up for the Dunhill he's playing 7 weeks in a row.....Boston LIV, PGA, Chicago LIV, French, Dunhill and then straight to the far East for a couple of Asian Tour events as per his LIV contract.....
Busy boy for someone who wants to spend less time out on Tour and more time at home....
 
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ExRabbit

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Patrick Reed for 1.
Now he's signed up for the Dunhill he's playing 7 weeks in a row.....Chicago LIV, PGA, Italian, French, Dunhill and then straight to the far East for a couple of Asian Tour events as per his LIV contract.....
Busy boy for someone who wants to spend less time out on Tour and more time at home....
Not taking any sides here - but wasn't Reed getting a lot of credit for being an American PGAT player who played all over the world not so long ago? In Europe a lot at least.
 

Imurg

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Not taking any sides here - but wasn't Reed getting a lot of credit for being an American PGAT player who played all over the world not so long ago? In Europe a lot at least.
Absolutely..a World Player before LIV
But he said recently that the PGAT forced him to not be around when his kids went to school and miss them coming home in the afternoon and is deeply saddened by only getting iPad time with his kids...and yet he's playing 7 weeks on the bounce....
 
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Absolutely..a World Player before LIV
But he said recently that the PGAT forced him to not be around when his kids went to school and miss them coming home in the afternoon and is deeply saddened by only getting iPad time with his kids...and yet he's playing 7 weeks on the bounce....
I think he may be chasing OGWR points right now to try and maintain his ranking while they wait for the decision on Liv events OGWR points.

If Liv events were receiving points he probably wouldn't be playing 7 weeks in a row I'm guessing.

A situation of their own making of course but a possible reason for 7 weeks on the bounce no less..
 

Imurg

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I think he may be chasing OGWR points right now to try and maintain his ranking while they wait for the decision on Liv events OGWR points.

If Liv events were receiving points he probably wouldn't be playing 7 weeks in a row I'm guessing.

A situation of their own making of course but a possible reason for 7 weeks on the bounce no less..
I think it's absolutely the reason...
It does give the impression that GN told them all that ranking points would be on offer and is failing to deliver...and unless LIV change their format to take in the OWGR criteria ..they're not going to..so they'll all be chasing the points.
And that, I suspect, is not what the players expected...
 

Swango1980

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I think it's absolutely the reason...
It does give the impression that GN told them all that ranking points would be on offer and is failing to deliver...and unless LIV change their format to take in the OWGR criteria ..they're not going to..so they'll all be chasing the points.
And that, I suspect, is not what the players expected...
These guys are professional golfers. Some of the most elite, well known golfers in the world. I'd be embarrassed for them if they were naive enough to simply take GN word for anything, unless it was solely related to LIV. As world ranking points are not controlled by LIV, but an outside body, surely they'd have done their due diligence and contacted the appropriate people as ask them to confirm? If they didn't, that is complete lack of professionalism.

Even if they thought world ranking points would be on offer, they must have realised that they'd probably be minimal due to the small field and lack of quality? I mean, the poorer players might have been positive about it, but not the handful of top players.

They had time to weigh up pros and cons. It is why most of them didn't just immediately sign up without hesitation. The pros were clearly the money. Playing less golf was also one, I can see characters like DJ liking that. The cons would clearly have been alienation from the PGA Tour (the PGA were clear on this), and clearly issues with World Ranking points. I'm sure we have been chatting about this for months, so I'm sure it must have been known to professional.players and their representatives.

I agree with a lot of you, that I'm not bothered players joining LIV for the cash and playing less golf. But, they need to accept the consequences. If they have complete faith that LIV is great for golf and it is going to grow the game, they really have nothing to worry about. No need to fight and complain. They'll be pioneers, and LIV will start to naturally get ranking points as it becomes the amazing tour they tell.us it is.
 

IainP

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Patrick Reed for 1.
Now he's signed up for the Dunhill he's playing 7 weeks in a row.....Boston LIV, PGA, Chicago LIV, French, Dunhill and then straight to the far East for a couple of Asian Tour events as per his LIV contract.....
Busy boy for someone who wants to spend less time out on Tour and more time at home....
Thanks, yes he's the one I recalled also.
Certainly think he deserves the ribbing etc. for that. It will follow him around.
Reminds me of those footballers who each time they switch club kiss the badge and say it's the one they supported as a child 😆

So going for 2% of players said they wanted to play less then?
 
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