'It Was Not Like That In My Day'

[GB72]

Honest question here as I was not involved or interested in golf until fairly recently and so I have no experience about what the game was like 10 or 20 years ago.

I see articles, comment and all sorts about how a two and a half hour round was not unusual for a 2 ball in the past and how slow play is a modern occurance. So, what was different back then. The equipment used etc all suggest that the game was harder then and so rounds should be slower but many say this was not the case.

Are courses now longer, more difficult, more packed with golfers, are people just slower and less considerate. Has the skill level of the average golfer declined so as to negate the benefit or modern equipment?

I would just be interested to know what circumstances allowed a quicker round of golf in the past as surely looking at the historical evidence is the way to find a solution to the current problem,

 

[pbrown7582]

im personally not convinced the problem is as widespread as made out. there has always been long days when fields are packed and 4 balls litter the course.
Think slow play highlighting is more down to far greater demands on everyones time these days.
maybe longer than 20 years to regular 2.5 hrs rounds. although with a clear course early morning it still happens.

 

[Simbo]

Been done the death this, and no-one really has a solid answer with evidence. I played 18 holes on Tuesday night alone with a virtually empty course and it took me about 2.15. I did feel like I was hammering round though. I don't know where the figures for the 2.5 hour rounds 20 years ago come from but I seriously doubt that a 2 ball/3 ball of average golfers could get round in that time.

 

[Crazyface]

Rubbish clubs, useless balls meant you couldn't hit it far enough offline to loose much time searching for balls and therefore holding up the course.

Just a guess.....

 

[Deleted member 1147]

There are many possible reasons for slower play now, many I'd imagine are to do with less money being available to clubs.

Perhaps some clubs were once more restrictive as to who they accepted as members. Now they let "less desirable" people in, as tey are desperate for green fees, whose etiquette etc isn't as good and thus relates itself as slower play?

Perhaps they had more members on the green staff, so they could cut the grass shorter. Therefore fewer lost balls, fewer provisional and less time searching

There are too many possible reasons, and it may not even be the case that the game is slower.

But it does seem slower nowadays then when I started in the '90s.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Been done the death this, and no-one really has a solid answer with evidence. I played 18 holes on Tuesday night alone with a virtually empty course and it took me about 2.15. I did feel like I was hammering round though. I don't know where the figures for the 2.5 hour rounds 20 years ago come from but I seriously doubt that a 2 ball/3 ball of average golfers could get round in that time.

Then maybe you are the problem because believe me, it used to happen!

There are numerous well documented reasons for slow play and the majority of them come down to lack of thought or consideration for others.

 

[Tongo]

Me and my old man can generally get round in about 3 hours. Some courses take a bit longer though. That's without any extensive ball searches mind you. And I would consider us as fast players.

2.5 hours would be going some but fair play!

 

[bobmac]

My home course in Scotland where I grew up had a sign up which read

A 2 ball must not take longer than 3 hrs
A 3 ball must not take longer than 3 1/4 hrs
A 4 ball must not take longer than 3 1/2 hrs

Note the words 'must not'

Sadly, these timings have gone for one reason only............

Golfers copying the antics of the pros on tele.

 

[Deleted member 18121]

I think I saw it from all aspects last week when I did the Macmillan day.

Rounds 1 and 2 with a 100% clear course, a buggy driving our clubs around so we could concentrate on playing equalled to 2hrs 20 and 2 hrs 30.

Round 3 with a packed course and waiting on shots took a little over 4 hours.

Round 4 with a clear course = 2hrs 20

I think the margins are so fine....all you need is 1 person in the group ahead to hit their ball into the rough and spend 1-2 minutes looking for a ball it soon backs the course up.

It still drives me crazy to see people marking their scorecards on the green on leaving their bags nowhere near the "exit" to a hole though.

 

[Deleted Member 1156]

Adam, well done on completing your challenge and 3 nice, quick speedy rounds. Only disappointment is that your club didn't ensure you had a clear run for the 3rd round by asking people to stand aside for you or allocating a marshall to walk ahead and alert people.

Hope you made your fundraising target? :thup:

 

[Deleted member 18121]

Adam, well done on completing your challenge and 3 nice, quick speedy rounds. Only disappointment is that your club didn't ensure you had a clear run for the 3rd round by asking people to stand aside for you or allocating a marshall to walk ahead and alert people.

Hope you made your fundraising target? :thup:

lol thanks D4S.... we knew it wasn't about completing 4 rounds as quickly as possible and only if time was getting really tight would we have asked to play through, but it really did show us the difference between a quick round and a "normal" round.

We've raised just short of £800 so far :thup:

 

[moogie]

Been done the death this, and no-one really has a solid answer with evidence. I played 18 holes on Tuesday night alone with a virtually empty course and it took me about 2.15. I did feel like I was hammering round though. I don't know where the figures for the 2.5 hour rounds 20 years ago come from but I seriously doubt that a 2 ball/3 ball of average golfers could get round in that time.

Most of my club comps this year, have been midweek, there's something on every Wednesday, it's a better day for me to take the afternoon off, and much better than a OVERcrowded weekend fixture
Me & my son, as a 2-ball have managed 3 comps in times ranging from 2hrs 40mins to approx 2hrs 55mins.
We also played a comp yesterday afternoon as a 3-ball in 3hrs 10mins

Nobody here is rushing, we're not running, so this pace is very easily achieved
We are in a competition after all
Just applying common sense, and playing, being ready to play when it's your turn

But as said by bobmac, it's those copying the players on TV and mimicking their habits and PSR, that are causing most of the problems that I see

The line drawn on the ball....!!
Jeez that boils my ****
Seen many a player obsess over that, and take 3-4 attempts to line up
Unbelievable

Unfortunately, this pace of play doesn't seem achievable at weekends, so I find myself participating less this year than in previous years

 

[Mattyboy]

I think more people are playing the game now. That's due partly to the 'Tiger effect' and also that subs have generally increased to a point where to get value, you have to play at least once a week

Having said that, I am not sure there is a great difference. We hear about more 5 hour rounds as the internet and this forum allows us to.

 

[fundy]

Simple answer for me is expectations and attitude

It was expected that a round would take a lot less time and almost all people took responsibility to make this happen as well as caring about the impact they had on others. Nowadays, in todays far more selfish society, you get people whose attitude is that Ive paid for it and Ill take as long as I like and I dont care how it affects everyone else

 

[patricks148]

Simple answer for me is expectations and attitude

It was expected that a round would take a lot less time and almost all people took responsibility to make this happen as well as caring about the impact they had on others. Nowadays, in todays far more selfish society, you get people whose attitude is that Ive paid for it and Ill take as long as I like and I dont care how it affects everyone else

I agree with this, people now have far less consideration for others than they used to in all walks of like not just golf.

 

[dufferman]

Maybe it's to do with comps and rules and generally people are more stricter on themselves?

I can play a round at my club with a PP which is a tough course in 3 1/2 hours if the course is clear, we don't look for lost balls (knee deep rough across the course) and break a few rules in respect to proper 2 club length drops etc etc.

However, when you put a 3 ball in a medal off our back tees at 9am on a Sunday, like it was last week, it took nearer 5 hours.

Maybe the idea of competitions were only for the elite players... did club champs have many 22 + handicappers playing in them in the days gone by, or were there a field of 50+ players in those comps on any given Sat / Sun for a monthly medal or stableford?

I only started playing properly in 2009 so I only know what I know.

I also think that different courses, levels of difficulty, players, handicaps, willingness to break the odd rule here and there etc means that everyone plays at a different pace and there will always be those who decide anything more than 3 hours is a crime.

Let them!

 

[patricks148]

Maybe it's to do with comps and rules and generally people are more stricter on themselves?

I can play a round at my club with a PP which is a tough course in 3 1/2 hours if the course is clear, we don't look for lost balls (knee deep rough across the course) and break a few rules in respect to proper 2 club length drops etc etc.

However, when you put a 3 ball in a medal off our back tees at 9am on a Sunday, like it was last week, it took nearer 5 hours.

Maybe the idea of competitions were only for the elite players... did club champs have many 22 + handicappers playing in them in the days gone by, or were there a field of 50+ players in those comps on any given Sat / Sun for a monthly medal or stableford?

I only started playing properly in 2009 so I only know what I know.

I also think that different courses, levels of difficulty, players, handicaps, willingness to break the odd rule here and there etc means that everyone plays at a different pace and there will always be those who decide anything more than 3 hours is a crime.

Let them!

its not 22 handicapers holding up my course on comp days, its a couple of 7 handicaps and a 9. one of them takes 20 practice swings and the putting is even slower

 

[fundy]

Maybe it's to do with comps and rules and generally people are more stricter on themselves?

I can play a round at my club with a PP which is a tough course in 3 1/2 hours if the course is clear, we don't look for lost balls (knee deep rough across the course) and break a few rules in respect to proper 2 club length drops etc etc.

However, when you put a 3 ball in a medal off our back tees at 9am on a Sunday, like it was last week, it took nearer 5 hours.

Maybe the idea of competitions were only for the elite players... did club champs have many 22 + handicappers playing in them in the days gone by, or were there a field of 50+ players in those comps on any given Sat / Sun for a monthly medal or stableford?

I only started playing properly in 2009 so I only know what I know.

I also think that different courses, levels of difficulty, players, handicaps, willingness to break the odd rule here and there etc means that everyone plays at a different pace and there will always be those who decide anything more than 3 hours is a crime.

Let them!

We used to play 3 balls in the medal off back tees and go round in 3 hrs with fields of over 100 regularly, just because its a comp in itself neednt add any time at all, its peoples attitude because its a comp that has changed and hence the time it takes nowadays

Do you really think any of the things in your last paragraph didnt used to exist?

 

[Deleted member 1147]

Maybe it's to do with comps and rules and generally people are more stricter on themselves?

I can play a round at my club with a PP which is a tough course in 3 1/2 hours if the course is clear, we don't look for lost balls (knee deep rough across the course) and break a few rules in respect to proper 2 club length drops etc etc.

However, when you put a 3 ball in a medal off our back tees at 9am on a Sunday, like it was last week, it took nearer 5 hours.

Maybe the idea of competitions were only for the elite players... did club champs have many 22 + handicappers playing in them in the days gone by, or were there a field of 50+ players in those comps on any given Sat / Sun for a monthly medal or stableford?
I only started playing properly in 2009 so I only know what I know.

I also think that different courses, levels of difficulty, players, handicaps, willingness to break the odd rule here and there etc means that everyone plays at a different pace and there will always be those who decide anything more than 3 hours is a crime.

Let them!

Back in the day there were certainly more than 50 players in a weekend medal/stab'.
Competitions were not just for better players, but, you certainly don't normally get 22+ handicappers in Club Championships at any club I know - that is only for the clubs elite players.

 

[turkish]

It's an interesting debate as people always seem to moan about slow play recently- in this months issue speith gives 5 top tips on lowering you're score- on the putting and reading the line he said players should take more care and read it from several different points- behind the ball, walk down the low side, behind the flag then back up the low side and choose break when behind the ball- I never do this and most people I play with don't either but if everyone done this it would slow things even further....

My point is with everyone wanting to improve and take care with their stroke that's undoubtedly gonna slow things.

Personally I'm too fast with a lot of things and need to slow down everything; my pace, my swing, not practice swinging enough etc so I wouldn't say I'm a culprit of slow play- always conscious of others so leave bag at right place, ready at my turn etc too but if a round last 4 hours+ it really doesn't bother me I'm out to enjoy and savour the round!