Is Golf in danger of being "dumbed down"

[alexgolf]

Afternoon all. Had a bad chest infection today so no golf this weekend. Lets see is we can get some chat going....

Along with POWERPLAY golf, there is a thread on here that i have just read about Jack N. advocating 12 hole comps, and bigger holes etc......

Now i am not a stick in the mud person and i love playing different formats. but for me golf should always be 9 or 18, and to one flag.

I just dont get the point of POWERPLAY. We have played this for years by nominating at the start of a round 3 holes on a 9 that you can "play a joker" at and get double points, but we keep to the course as we see it.

What i do think is that we all dont do enough fun comps, but all this it just like "tour pressure" hype turns me off.

Thoughts boys and girls......

 

[HawkeyeMS]

I just dont get the point of POWERPLAY. We have played this for years by nominating at the start of a round 3 holes on a 9 that you can "play a joker" at and get double points, but we keep to the course as we see it.

Isn't that a contradiction? You don't get the point if powerplay but have been doing something similar yourself for years? The only reason you don't use two holes is, dare I say, because you don't have the option.

I wouldn't want to play PPG all the time but every now and then it's fine, a bit like Texas scramble or greensomes and to a certain extent, stableford.

Personally I think Jack's idea about 12 holes and bigger holes are nonsense and will never get anywhere but you can't fault him for trying to introduce people to the game.

However, there are different formats that we play from time to time that mean we aren't always playing medal but if you don't want to play them, don't enter.

 

[alexgolf]

I just dont get the point of POWERPLAY. We have played this for years by nominating at the start of a round 3 holes on a 9 that you can "play a joker" at and get double points, but we keep to the course as we see it.

Isn't that a contradiction? You don't get the point if powerplay but have been doing something similar yourself for years? The only reason you don't use two holes is, dare I say, because you don't have the option.

Sorry Hawkeye...i didnt expline myself very well there did i.

What i dont get the point about is that it is being touted as the thing that will save golf from being boreing, and is a NEW format, when all i can see is that you can run one of these events without signing up to the PPG company

 

[jammag]

I think the reason why these ideas are being floated about are to just try and create a wonder idea that will get numbers up and be a big money maker, as this is what most sports have a variation game as such.

Golf is a sport which takes a fair amount of time to complete a game. Now someone new to the sport flicking through the channels are unlikely to watch 6hours plus of golf coverage. Where as a rugby 7s match over and done with quickly you may watch it just to see what it is. Crickets 20/20 you can turn on and if its bish bash bosh you may sit there and keep watching, where as golf is take 1 shot wait 5minutes then see the next players shot which would become tedius if you was a newbie to the game.

Now powerplay golf for example you turn it on and see theres 2 flags and it just gets in your mind hang on what on earth is this 2 flags. So you stay tuned because your intrigued by it, then you hear them say they are going for double points and again it will intrigue people.

These ideas are not for the player who has played it for years its for getting people into the game and get people watching sport. You see it with cricket those who have followed it for years on end will see test cricket as the truest form of the game yet a new person 20/20 is the bees knees and wouldnt care less for a test match.

I think these ideas just have to be taken with a pinch of salt for those of us who have played the 18 hole game and love it.

On Jacks idea though a purpose built 12 hole course wouldnt work as you wouldnt get enough members etc. Turn a 18 hole course into a 12 hole course and have the bigger holes, may work. So you have your 2 par 4s put together and it becomes a par 5. 4 shots on and then 1 putt as it has a bigger hole may just be a good way to give those who normally play the course a bit of variation just for a once a year competition?

 

[HawkeyeMS]

I just dont get the point of POWERPLAY. We have played this for years by nominating at the start of a round 3 holes on a 9 that you can "play a joker" at and get double points, but we keep to the course as we see it.

Isn't that a contradiction? You don't get the point if powerplay but have been doing something similar yourself for years? The only reason you don't use two holes is, dare I say, because you don't have the option.

Sorry Hawkeye...i didnt expline myself very well there did i.

What i dont get the point about is that it is being touted as the thing that will save golf from being boreing, and is a NEW format, when all i can see is that you can run one of these events without signing up to the PPG company

Of course you can and PPG positively encourage you to do exatly that. You don't have to sign up for anything and I don't think anyone is claiming it is the saviour of golf. For many of us it is new and different and when we played at the grove last Wednesday I thoroughly enjoyed it, but I won't be playing every week.

My own personal opinion is that PPG will become something that a lot of clubs might do once a year as a social event and will just become another format for golfers to choose to play if the wish, I can't see it becoming any more than that.

 

[alexgolf]

I think the reason why these ideas are being floated about are to just try and create a wonder idea that will get numbers up and be a big money maker, as this is what most sports have a variation game as such.

Golf is a sport which takes a fair amount of time to complete a game. Now someone new to the sport flicking through the channels are unlikely to watch 6hours plus of golf coverage. Where as a rugby 7s match over and done with quickly you may watch it just to see what it is. Crickets 20/20 you can turn on and if its bish bash bosh you may sit there and keep watching, where as golf is take 1 shot wait 5minutes then see the next players shot which would become tedius if you was a newbie to the game.

Now powerplay golf for example you turn it on and see theres 2 flags and it just gets in your mind hang on what on earth is this 2 flags. So you stay tuned because your intrigued by it, then you hear them say they are going for double points and again it will intrigue people.

These ideas are not for the player who has played it for years its for getting people into the game and get people watching sport. You see it with cricket those who have followed it for years on end will see test cricket as the truest form of the game yet a new person 20/20 is the bees knees and wouldnt care less for a test match.

I think these ideas just have to be taken with a pinch of salt for those of us who have played the 18 hole game and love it.

On Jacks idea though a purpose built 12 hole course wouldnt work as you wouldnt get enough members etc. Turn a 18 hole course into a 12 hole course and have the bigger holes, may work. So you have your 2 par 4s put together and it becomes a par 5. 4 shots on and then 1 putt as it has a bigger hole may just be a good way to give those who normally play the course a bit of variation just for a once a year competition?

Some excellent points here.

One thing i would say is that at its best the format of golf works perfectly well. I see that they are trying to find different formats for snooker to "liven it up" but all these things are doing for me, is diluting the essence of the game.

Hyping things up and/or changing things does not necessarly mean its better.

 

[Imurg]

Golf is a sport which takes a fair amount of time to complete a game. Now someone new to the sport flicking through the channels are unlikely to watch 6hours plus of golf coverage. Where as a rugby 7s match over and done with quickly you may watch it just to see what it is. Crickets 20/20 you can turn on and if its bish bash bosh you may sit there and keep watching, where as golf is take 1 shot wait 5minutes then see the next players shot which would become tedius if you was a newbie to the game.

Hold the Phone...

Golf takes a fair amount of time to complete a game? What, 3 1/2 - 4 hours...? PPG takes best part of 2!
Golf, to my mind, doesn't need a "gimmick" like PPG or Jack's nonsense. If you have the time, you can play 18.
If you don't have enough time, you can play 9.

Where's the problem?

They tried to get PPG off the ground a few years back and it didn't happen. McEvoy's got a bit of cash behind it now, with Tour Pros and sponsorship backing it up. Next televised one is to be in China I believe.....
It may work as an alternative to the Pro-Am but I just can't see it progressing further than that.

Why?

Because it's not necessary. In Cricket, a Test takes 5 (well 4 if England are playing) days, a One-dayer takes er.. 1 day and a 20/20 takes 3-4 hours (oh - about the same time as a round of Golf...).

Tv coverage could show many, many more shots than they do. 1 shot's played, then cut to another, play that and cut to another - you could get round 3 or 4 groups and then back to the first one for their 2nd shots and so on. There's always a shot being played in a Golf Tournament.

We have different formats already. Scrambles, Foursomes, Greensomes etc etc. Is there room for another?

 

[brendy]

Long 4 hour plus round of golf don't appeal to new golfers.... Isn't that what driving ranges and par 3 courses are for?
Powerplay to me is a gimmick, no more. I prefer to play 18 holes of competitive golf if at all possible, the odd 9 hole mid week competition is fine but leave the flags alone .

 

[sweatysock41]

The way I see Powerplay golf is it's a bit like 5 a side football. The skills are still required but its an alternative to the full monty.

I don't think anyone is trying to change the way golf is actually played, they're just trying to create more interest and get more people interested in playing.

Just like Hawkeye I thoroughly enjoyed the format last wednesday but would I want to play it every week - no. I like the pressure of a medal and the social 18 with my mates.

 

[jammag]

Golf is a sport which takes a fair amount of time to complete a game. Now someone new to the sport flicking through the channels are unlikely to watch 6hours plus of golf coverage. Where as a rugby 7s match over and done with quickly you may watch it just to see what it is. Crickets 20/20 you can turn on and if its bish bash bosh you may sit there and keep watching, where as golf is take 1 shot wait 5minutes then see the next players shot which would become tedius if you was a newbie to the game.

Hold the Phone...

Golf takes a fair amount of time to complete a game? What, 3 1/2 - 4 hours...? PPG takes best part of 2!
Golf, to my mind, doesn't need a "gimmick" like PPG or Jack's nonsense. If you have the time, you can play 18.
If you don't have enough time, you can play 9.

Where's the problem?

They tried to get PPG off the ground a few years back and it didn't happen. McEvoy's got a bit of cash behind it now, with Tour Pros and sponsorship backing it up. Next televised one is to be in China I believe.....
It may work as an alternative to the Pro-Am but I just can't see it progressing further than that.

Why?

Because it's not necessary. In Cricket, a Test takes 5 (well 4 if England are playing) days, a One-dayer takes er.. 1 day and a 20/20 takes 3-4 hours (oh - about the same time as a round of Golf...).

Tv coverage could show many, many more shots than they do. 1 shot's played, then cut to another, play that and cut to another - you could get round 3 or 4 groups and then back to the first one for their 2nd shots and so on. There's always a shot being played in a Golf Tournament.

We have different formats already. Scrambles, Foursomes, Greensomes etc etc. Is there room for another?

Read the context in why I mentioned the time aspect. A new golfer will take time to play a round as in any sport. Yes par 3s and driving ranges are there for practice etc but there has to be the buzz to go and try it. If they see coverage on tv its not the most exciting thing so that is why they are bringing in new ideas to try get the participation up.

You mention there are greensomes, foursomes, match play, stableford, stroke play and scrambles. How many of these are regularly shown on tv? just strokeplay that is a regular to how are new people to the game going to know about these different formats?

There has to be progression in sport, now whether you get excited by powerplay and go that looks good I want to try that then you go do it you enjoy it then you progress further onto full 18 hole golf etc. Its the same in cricket you see 20/20 you like it you try it you move onto a club where they play all day games then you get into watching test cricket etc.

I dont think anyone is trying to say 18 hole golf needs a revamp because it doesnt it always will be the top game to play. It just maybe needs a format that is a bit more exciting to new members as I dont think my local crazy golf is encouraging many people to take up the full game

 

[pokerjoke]

I am all for new ideas and scoring formats.
PPG is a good idea for every now and then,and i believe it is especially a good format for the winter,when nights are closing in.
I cant see it taking off professionally,nor the idea of bigger holes,or 12 hole golf courses.

 

[alexgolf]

Hi everyone

Sorry i went away.....had a domestic....thats what being at home instead of being out on the golf course does for you!!!

I suppose my other fear is that TV companys will press for changes to golf as they hate overuns (i hear the SKY boys were screaminmg for someone to win last week in Scotland)

They see what 20/20 has done for cricket and want a quicker format.

 

[HomerJSimpson]

My club holds a social nine hole event once a month from April through to September and a PP event would be an ideal change from the usual formats so I think it has a place in the amateur game. I would definitely like to try it again particularly on a course I'd played before so I'd have a better knowledge of which flags could and shouldn't be attacked

I think PP is here to stay at least in the short-term and the committment and investment means it will become a global brand. Is it good for the game? Time will tell.

I really don't think Jack's ideas have any legs and won't be taken up or ultimately encourage more people to take the game up. For that, memberships need to be more accessible and cheaper, juniors need great access to decent tuition and equipment and golf needs to lose its elitist tag.

 

[sev112]

Love all these "modern approaches" to golf


Don't change any of our 18th century dress codes though or there will be trouble ...