GUR ruling

[Axel]

At a society match at Aspley Guise GC all bunkers were declared GUR because of the deluge of rain deposited on the course the night before. On the dog-leg right 16th I drove my ball to the very edge of the right hand bunker protecting the dog leg. To play a shot at the green, I would have had to stand in the GUR bunker. I asked my competitor if I could take relief from the GUR but he declined my request saying that I had a shot sideways with a stance on the fairway. Was he right?

 

[doublebogey7]

No, unless the commitee have specified that interference to the players stance is not deemed as interference under rule 25-1a. http://www.randa.org/Rules-of-Golf/...les/1-Abnormal-Ground-Conditions#alldecisions

I think your fellow competitor is confusing relief from an abnormal ground condition when interference from another condition does not allow a normal stroke to be made.

 

[duncan mackie]

At a society match at Aspley Guise GC all bunkers were declared GUR because of the deluge of rain deposited on the course the night before. On the dog-leg right 16th I drove my ball to the very edge of the right hand bunker protecting the dog leg. To play a shot at the green, I would have had to stand in the GUR bunker. I asked my competitor if I could take relief from the GUR but he declined my request saying that I had a shot sideways with a stance on the fairway. Was he right?

Putting aside the issue of declaring all bunkers GUR (it's not a Q competition so probably a sensible decision to enable people to play the game) the principle that governs you question is that interference is from a 'reasonable' shot, or more specifically it is not interference if it only occurs when setting up for a clearly unreasonable shot.

So, as already said, the answer is no - he was wrong.

doublebogey's second sentence is slightly confusing in the use of another condition - generally this is covered by the principle above, but stated more specifically in a general exception to relief. If you can't play the shot you are setting up to then it's not a reasonable shot! Note here that this deals with extreme situations and that the ability to get a club on the ball legally and move it in the general direction of the fairway or hole is enough to make it reasonable. A ball in a gorse thicket you can't even get to with a club that can be seen to be sitting in a puddle would be the sort of thing.

 

[woody69]

No, he wasn't right. Did you proceed with playing 2 balls, take relief anyway, or accept what he said?

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Putting aside the issue of declaring all bunkers GUR (it's not a Q competition so probably a sensible decision to enable people to play the game) the principle that governs you question is that interference is from a 'reasonable' shot, or more specifically it is not interference if it only occurs when setting up for a clearly unreasonable shot.

So, as already said, the answer is no - he was wrong.

doublebogey's second sentence is slightly confusing in the use of another condition - generally this is covered by the principle above, but stated more specifically in a general exception to relief. If you can't play the shot you are setting up to then it's not a reasonable shot! Note here that this deals with extreme situations and that the ability to get a club on the ball legally and move it in the general direction of the fairway or hole is enough to make it reasonable. A ball in a gorse thicket you can't even get to with a club that can be seen to be sitting in a puddle would be the sort of thing.

So just on the abnormal ground conditions point - if my ball is at the base of a tree that has very low branches and is sitting on abnormal ground or in a rabbit scrape - but if I knelt down and one-handed could swish the ball out with a club - can I claim relief from the AGC or rabbit scrape?

 

[Colin L]

So just on the abnormal ground conditions point - if my ball is at the base of a tree that has very low branches and is sitting on abnormal ground or in a rabbit scrape - but if I knelt down and one-handed could swish the ball out with a club - can I claim relief from the AGC or rabbit scrape?

Yes - provided your one-handed "swish" met the definition of a stroke.

 

[duncan mackie]

Yes - provided your one-handed "swish" met the definition of a stroke.

:thup:

 

[Axel]

Great info guys, so thank you! No, I did not take relief but played out sideways onto the fairway. Interesting point though, because I did not know that I could play a 2nd ball, as you infer, nor have I ever come across that, other than in a typical 'provisional ball' scenario.

I came 2nd on count-back, so you can imagine I am very keen to get the correct ruling for a bit of a banter at next month society outing!

 

[atticusfinch]

Great info guys, so thank you! No, I did not take relief but played out sideways onto the fairway. Interesting point though, because I did not know that I could play a 2nd ball, as you infer, nor have I ever come across that, other than in a typical 'provisional ball' scenario.

I came 2nd on count-back, so you can imagine I am very keen to get the correct ruling for a bit of a banter at next month society outing!

See rule 3-3. There are conditions for a second ball. (it is not a provisional.)

 

[woody69]

Great info guys, so thank you! No, I did not take relief but played out sideways onto the fairway. Interesting point though, because I did not know that I could play a 2nd ball, as you infer, nor have I ever come across that, other than in a typical 'provisional ball' scenario.

I came 2nd on count-back, so you can imagine I am very keen to get the correct ruling for a bit of a banter at next month society outing!

It's worth remembering this rule 3-3

[h=3]3-3. Doubt as to Procedure[/h][h=4]a. Procedure for Competitor[/h]In stroke play only, if a competitor is doubtful of his rights or the correct procedure during the play of a hole, he may, without penalty, complete the hole with two balls. To proceed under this Rule, he must decide to play two balls after the doubtful situation has arisen and before taking further action (e.g., making a stroke at the original ball).

The competitor should announce to his marker or a fellow-competitor:

• that he intends to play two balls; and
• which ball he wishes to count if the Rules permit the procedure used for that ball.

Before returning his score card, the competitor must report the facts of the situation to the Committee. If he fails to do so, he is disqualified.

If the competitor has taken further action before deciding to play two balls, he has not proceeded under Rule 3-3 and the score with the original ball counts. The competitor incurs no penalty for playing the second ball.

 

[SwingsitlikeHogan]

Yes - provided your one-handed "swish" met the definition of a stroke.

cool - once had an opponent take that relief in a match. On 17th and I was one up. I was in middle of fairway - he was stuffed and under this tree and claimed relief from a rabbit scrape that was close to the against base of the tree - no proper shot but he could reach the ball with a club if he knelt down and could take a swish and could have knocked it out. And so he took a free drop that took him from under the tree to a position where he could play a shot - he hit the green; holed the putt, and won the hole. And then won the 18th