Golf balls collide - unusually, ! Anyone know the rule?

[Swinglowandslow]

Hi
Playing a match -pairs- yesterday.
Player A on the green considers he is away. So he putts.
Player B just off the green - may have thought likewise. So he putts
At the same time.
Each is unaware the other is putting.
Each ball is moving when they collide!

Over to you??

 

[rulie]

Player A's stroke is cancelled and must be replayed - Rule 11.1b, Exception 2.
Player B's ball must be played from where it came to rest - Rule 11.1b.

 

[Imurg]

I assume if both were on the green then both shots would be cancelled and replayed..?

 

[nickjdavis]

If player B was subsequently determined to have played out of turn, can A (I'm assuming they were on different teams) request that B replays the stroke?

Normally in matchplay, the request for an opponent to replay a stroke must be made before anyone makes another stroke at a ball...but in this case A wouldn't have had that immediate opportunity....I assume he still has the right to ask B to replay?

 

[Swinglowandslow]

If player B was subsequently determined to have played out of turn, can A (I'm assuming they were on different teams) request that B replays the stroke?

Normally in matchplay, the request for an opponent to replay a stroke must be made before anyone makes another stroke at a ball...but in this case A wouldn't have had that immediate opportunity....I assume he still has the right to ask B to replay?

Interesting point.
However, I have since seen reference to 19.5 rule which says that if a player's ball in motion hits another player's ball in motion-on the green- then the player cancels his stroke and plays again from the same position as before.
It refers to "if this occurs on the green" . If this means the collision ( as opposed to the stroke) then I imagine both players play again.?

It happened to us yesterday.
Yes, players were opponents.Caused a head scratch??

Edit- as you were. This was old rule it seems.
My take now is?
Rule 11 now appropriate, I think.
Player A plays again from original place on green
Player B plays ball where it lies##. However, being match play, if player A wishes he can get player B to play shot again ( if Player B is determined to have played out of turn)

This bit subject of further edit ? Getting there,,!

 

[Colin L]

For a stroke to be cancelled it has to have been played from on the green and the collision must take place with the other moving ball on the green. Where the latter ball was played from doesn’t affect that but if it was played from off the green, it is then played from where it comes to rest after the collision.

 

[salfordlad]

If player B was subsequently determined to have played out of turn, can A (I'm assuming they were on different teams) request that B replays the stroke?

Normally in matchplay, the request for an opponent to replay a stroke must be made before anyone makes another stroke at a ball...but in this case A wouldn't have had that immediate opportunity....I assume he still has the right to ask B to replay?

That's one for upstairs I think.

 

[rulie]

That's one for upstairs I think.

But I would doubt that player A would retain the right to recall player B's stroke. I suppose that I just don't understand how two players in match play don't know/can't see what their opponent is doing, particularly when they are both on/next to the putting green. Edjits?

 

[salfordlad]

But I would doubt that player A would retain the right to recall player B's stroke. I suppose that I just don't understand how two players in match play don't know/can't see what their opponent is doing, particularly when they are both on/next to the putting green. Edjits?

I agree, I would not be making any such assumption (that a recall is legitimate in this situation) as it is not supported by the published words. But RBs can surprise you from time to time.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

But I would doubt that player A would retain the right to recall player B's stroke. I suppose that I just don't understand how two players in match play don't know/can't see what their opponent is doing, particularly when they are both on/next to the putting green. Edjits?

Why does a legit question bring out the abnoxious?

 

[Deleted member 23270]

How do you decide who is player A and who is player B?

 

[Colin L]

But I would doubt that player A would retain the right to recall player B's stroke. I suppose that I just don't understand how two players in match play don't know/can't see what their opponent is doing, particularly when they are both on/next to the putting green. Edjits?

Seniors, maybe.
I stood on our 13th tee on Friday in a fourball with driver (uncovered), ball and tee in hand, ready to play after the other three. A few moments later, I am standing beside my trolley, putting the cover back on my driver and returning it to my bag when I noticed the others were still standing around looking at me. I wondered why.... but not for long. My how they laughed as I went back up on to the tee to play my shot.

With such masterly skill in eejiitry, I am more than well qualified to putt at the same time as my opponent in a match.

 

[nickjdavis]

How do you decide who is player A and who is player B?

See post #1.

 

[backwoodsman]

See post #1.

But in post #1, "A" and "B" are only "identifiers" - it doesnt give any info on which of A or B had the actual honour. (Which I think was the point of DaveR's post)

 

[Colin L]

I can't see any way of resolving the situation other than A who was on the green cancels and replays his stroke and B who was off the green plays his ball as it lies, unless it can be established
a) which player played from nearer the hole, and
(b which player played first.

Since both thought they were away they can't establish a) and since neither player was aware of the other putting, they can't establish b). Faced with this on the course and to keep it fair and simple, I'd take it that they played simultaneously from the same distance from the hole.

 

[Swinglowandslow]

I can't see any way of resolving the situation other than A who was on the green cancels and replays his stroke and B who was off the green plays his ball as it lies, unless it can be established
a) which player played from nearer the hole, and
(b which player played first.

Since both thought they were away they can't establish a) and since neither player was aware of the other putting, they can't establish b). Faced with this on the course and to keep it fair and simple, I'd take it that they played simultaneously from the same distance from the hole.

Yes. To clarify. I was player A. It was resolved in ignorance of the rule.We just left the balls as they came to rest. It was clear that we couldn't say definitely who was further from the hole, nor who putted his ball first.
We all got it merrily wrong and continued a lovely match. ?

 

[salfordlad]

Yes. To clarify. I was player A. It was resolved in ignorance of the rule.We just left the balls as they came to rest. It was clear that we couldn't say definitely who was further from the hole, nor who putted his ball first.
We all got it merrily wrong and continued a lovely match. ?

Which, given the joys of match play, means you got it right.

 

[rulie]

But in post #1, "A" and "B" are only "identifiers" - it doesnt give any info on which of A or B had the actual honour. (Which I think was the point of DaveR's post)

A pedantic point, but "honour" only exists on the teeing ground.

 

[backwoodsman]

A pedantic point, but "honour" only exists on the teeing ground.

Fair point

(but I'd hazard a guess you know the point I was making ?)