Gimme shelter

[Sid Rixon IV]

In the event of a sudden torrential downpour is it permissible to stop play and take shelter - even if for just a few minutes and without holding up play of group behind?

 

[rulefan]

In the event of a sudden torrential downpour is it permissible to stop play and take shelter - even if for just a few minutes and without holding up play of group behind?

Only in match play by agreement between opponents.

[h=3]6-8. Discontinuance of Play; Resumption of Play[/h]Bad weather is not of itself a good reason for discontinuing play.


[h=2]6-8a/2[/h][h=4]Taking Shelter While Waiting to Play[/h]Q.In stroke play, a group preparing to start a hole is waiting for the group ahead to get out of range. May the group take shelter from the rain in a rain shelter close to the tee?
A.Yes, but the group must leave the shelter and resume play as soon as the group in front is out of range.

 

[CMAC]

and just to add purely for clarity, if it's a bounce game you can stay in the shelter as long as you want

 

[Sid Rixon IV]

We were a two ball in the weekly medal.
We were in the middle of the fairway when the heavens opened.
We ran for shelter to get out and put on our waterproofs and waited a very short while for it to ease.
No one immediately following.
In the clubhouse the weather was discussed in a group and I said "We had to run for shelter".
My partner hastily added "Only to get the waterproofs on" and then said to me quietly "Not allowed".

 

[Fyldewhite]

Don't know why but there always seems to be a rumble of thunder around in these circumstances

6-8 - Discontinuance of Play; Resumption of Play
a. When Permitted
The player must not discontinue play unless:
(i) the Committee has suspended play;
(ii) he believes there is danger from lightning;

 

[chrisd]

If the green was deluged, making putting impossible, but the rain was stopping - what then?

 

[nemicu]

If the green was deluged, making putting impossible, but the rain was stopping - what then?

See "casual water" and it's associated rulings. If putting is impossible (i.e. the hole is surrounded by casual water) the committee is within rights to suspend play (stroke play only) or relocate the hole (matchplay).

 

[Colin L]

The Committee should suspend play. See Decision 33-2d/2

http://www.usga.org/Rule-Books/Rules-of-Golf/Decision-33/#d33-2d-2

 

[backwoodsman]

I'd have thought that running for the trees for shelter whilst putting on waterproofs would not constitute "discontinuing play" - especially since the note to rule 8 says leaving the course does not of itself constitute discontinuing play. And given that you are not forbidden from donning waterproofs, I'd suggest sheltering whilst doing so is also not forbidden.

And although hanging around under the trees, waiting for rain to stop, may well might count as undue delay, I'd suggest there are fine lines somewhere which are drawn between the various stages of "playing", "due delay", "undue delay", and finally "discontinuance" (And I know that "due delay" is not a term in the rules but the fact the the rules refer to undue delay indicates there is, or could be, delay which is not undue). Anyone know what those fine lines are?

 

[nemicu]

I'd have thought that running for the trees for shelter whilst putting on waterproofs would not constitute "discontinuing play" - especially since the note to rule 8 says leaving the course does not of itself constitute discontinuing play. And given that you are not forbidden from donning waterproofs, I'd suggest sheltering whilst doing so is also not forbidden.

And although hanging around under the trees, waiting for rain to stop, may well might count as undue delay, I'd suggest there are fine lines somewhere which are drawn between the various stages of "playing", "due delay", "undue delay", and finally "discontinuance" (And I know that "due delay" is not a term in the rules but the fact the the rules refer to undue delay indicates there is, or could be, delay which is not undue). Anyone know what those fine lines are?

The current buzz word on tour is "out of position" or not being where you should be as per the discretion of the referee. Once you you have been witnessed being "out of position", then the culprit is usually put on the clock and given a warning to get back "up to pace" or penalties will be given.
At club level, that decision lies fairly and squarely with the committee who will make a judgement on the evidence given (should there be any). I very much doubt taking brief shelter with nobody behind the group constitutes undue delay, but if the group subsequently came into the clubhouse a sizeable time after everybody else in the competition, then questions would be asked. Since it's always in the best interests of the player to play in a timely manner with a good pace, then the fine line lies with the player themselves I would think.

 

[Colin L]

Being out of position should be a matter of fact and not something at the discretion of a referee. The Scottish Golf Union pace of play rules are based on there being a schedule of maximum completion times for each hole. The first group out is out of position if it has taken longer at any point than the total time allowed for the holes played. Subsequent groups are out of position if they are more than their starting interval behind the group in front and have taken longer than the total time allowed at that point. I would find it difficult to apply any pace of play warnings and penalties if it were at my discretion rather than based on measurable factors like these.

But that's not about sheltering from the rain. Given that discontinuation of play to shelter from the weather is explicitly against the rules, it does not matter whether there is a group behind you or not nor whether by doing so you end up out of position. You stop playing to shelter from the rain and you have breached Rule 6-8a. Again that is a matter of fact.

Stopping to put on waterproofs is another matter. The players' purpose is not to shelter from the weather even if they use a conveniently placed shelter to put on the waterproofs (i.e. one that does involve additional time to go to). In the match I was refereeing this week, the players stopped to put on waterproofs. Now, guess what I was doing at the same time.

 

[rulefan]

Being out of position should be a matter of fact and not something at the discretion of a referee. The Scottish Golf Union pace of play rules are based on there being a schedule of maximum completion times for each hole. The first group out is out of position if it has taken longer at any point than the total time allowed for the holes played. Subsequent groups are out of position if they are more than their starting interval behind the group in front and have taken longer than the total time allowed at that point. I would find it difficult to apply any pace of play warnings and penalties if it were at my discretion rather than based on measurable factors like these.

But that's not about sheltering from the rain. Given that discontinuation of play to shelter from the weather is explicitly against the rules, it does not matter whether there is a group behind you or not nor whether by doing so you end up out of position. You stop playing to shelter from the rain and you have breached Rule 6-8a. Again that is a matter of fact.

Stopping to put on waterproofs is another matter. The players' purpose is not to shelter from the weather even if they use a conveniently placed shelter to put on the waterproofs (i.e. one that does involve additional time to go to). In the match I was refereeing this week, the players stopped to put on waterproofs. Now, guess what I was doing at the same time.

I fully agree

 

[chrisd]

. Now, guess what I was doing at the same time.

Er .............. I give up!

 

[bladeplayer]

Being out of position should be a matter of fact and not something at the discretion of a referee. The Scottish Golf Union pace of play rules are based on there being a schedule of maximum completion times for each hole. The first group out is out of position if it has taken longer at any point than the total time allowed for the holes played. Subsequent groups are out of position if they are more than their starting interval behind the group in front and have taken longer than the total time allowed at that point. I would find it difficult to apply any pace of play warnings and penalties if it were at my discretion rather than based on measurable factors like these.

But that's not about sheltering from the rain. Given that discontinuation of play to shelter from the weather is explicitly against the rules, it does not matter whether there is a group behind you or not nor whether by doing so you end up out of position. You stop playing to shelter from the rain and you have breached Rule 6-8a. Again that is a matter of fact.

Stopping to put on waterproofs is another matter. The players' purpose is not to shelter from the weather even if they use a conveniently placed shelter to put on the waterproofs (i.e. one that does involve additional time to go to). In the match I was refereeing this week, the players stopped to put on waterproofs. Now, guess what I was doing at the same time.

A rule that is often broken i would imagine .. on reflection id say i have been guilty on a couple of occasion of crouching under an umbrella to allow a heavy shower ease or a shower of hail ease , i have noticed others doing the same

 

[MashieNiblick]

Always felt it was rather a harsh rule, especially for us mere club golfers who are playing for fun.

By the way, best thread title ever on the Rules Forum! :thup: