European seniors tour

[slicer79]

Guy from a neighbouring club here in Ireland is going to be taking part in the qualifying stages for the seniors tour in January
52 years old. His handicap has drifted between scr and 1 over the past 3/4 years.
Has not achieved anything of note in amatuer comps locally.

What are the standards like at this level?

I would have assumed even at seniors level an amatuer trying to make it would want to be about +3 h/cap or achieved a high level of success over the years

 

[In_The_Rough]

Would have thought HCP needed is lower than that to be a success on there

 

[Deleted member 15344]

Very good standard

The pro we normally play with in Pro Am's is over in Portugal currently do the qualifying stage.

Got to be a solid scratch player over a good number of years. Also need to be able to travel with the scratch handicap.

 

[JCW]

Guy from a neighbouring club here in Ireland is going to be taking part in the qualifying stages for the seniors tour in January
52 years old. His handicap has drifted between scr and 1 over the past 3/4 years.
Has not achieved anything of note in amatuer comps locally.

What are the standards like at this level?

I would have assumed even at seniors level an amatuer trying to make it would want to be about +3 h/cap or achieved a high level of success over the years

If you look deeper you will see many unknown players have done well , better then they did in the regular tour , fitness and putting are big factors ..............................EYG

 

[slicer79]

I'll be very interested to see how he does. As far as I know there is very few cards availible each year for the seniors tour

 

[williamalex1]

Do all PGA pros qualify for the seniors tour when they turn 50. Is there a limit on the numbers allowed ??.

 

[Deleted member 15344]

They are eligible to join and some have exemptions I understand but most will need to qualify

The champions tour in the US is a lot bigger and very lucrative

 

[pigmeister]

Mark Wharton from JOG tried to qualify last year. He played off +2 and had a very good amature record. He only just missed out having been under par in the first round but had a couple of bad holes on the front nine in round two. He said the main differance is the short game, they get up and down a lot of the time. Its a bit of a closed shop with only a few cards up for grabs, can`t have some younger upstart getting his nose into their trough.

 

[Deleted member 17920]

I think he will need to be lower than scratch to do any good and he would also have had a good few wins to see him through the pressure of playing in tour events. It's a different league to the amatuer game.

 

[Ethan]

If he is financially comfortable, why not? Nothing ventured, nothing gained etc.

But he hasn't a hope.

 

[JCW]

If he is financially comfortable, why not? Nothing ventured, nothing gained etc.

But he hasn't a hope.

Its like the lottery , if he has a ticket he has a chance , slim one but a chance it is ................EYG

 

[Foxholer]

What are the standards like at this level?

I would have assumed even at seniors level an amatuer trying to make it would want to be about +3 h/cap or achieved a high level of success over the years

Standards for qualifying are very high.

Several 'untouchables' in the actual Tour are pretty rubbish, but stay in because of other criteria (All time Money List etc) and that gets up a few of the 'nearly qualified' guys noses - including a Pro mate of mine, who qualified for Seniors Open in 2012, who missed out by 2 strokes last year and, I think, the year before!

 

[Wildrover]

Standards for qualifying are very high.

Several 'untouchables' in the actual Tour are pretty rubbish, but stay in because of other criteria (All time Money List etc) and that gets up a few of the 'nearly qualified' guys noses - including a Pro mate of mine, who qualified for Seniors Open in 2012, who missed out by 2 strokes last year and, I think, the year before!

The problem for the guys on the cusp is that people want to see the "Untouchables" and aren't that interested in watching people they've never heard of. It's the bigger names that bring in the sponsors. Not saying it's right, just the way it is.

 

[davidy233]

The problem for the guys on the cusp is that people want to see the "Untouchables" and aren't that interested in watching people they've never heard of. It's the bigger names that bring in the sponsors. Not saying it's right, just the way it is.

Just ready Gary Wolsenholme's book - in it he says that there are just six places up for grabs at Seniors Tour qualifying and that once in you can't lose your card by having a bad year

 

[Foxholer]

The problem for the guys on the cusp is that people want to see the "Untouchables" and aren't that interested in watching people they've never heard of. It's the bigger names that bring in the sponsors. Not saying it's right, just the way it is.

Maybe the likes of Darcy, Johnstone, Rocca or Rivero maybe, but not Maurice Bembridge or Antonio Garrido - nice guys/ambassadors but embarrassingly bad at that level. A quick check of Garrido's rounds...17 rounds, 4 in the 70s (2 low-ish 70s at one tournament still left him 70th!), 2 in the 90s! Find another role for these guys please!

Senior Q-School is tough 180 playing for 6 Full places and 14 conditional ones. And expensive too, as the guys scratching around at the level required aren't usually earning big money - though met a very comfortably placed guy a while ago - at the Travis Perkins at Wentworth -who was a Banker for 5 months a year, played Seniors Golf for 5 months a year and had 2 months 'holiday'!

 

[shivas irons]

Ive caddied on The European Seniors Tour and yes the standard is high.As with the regular tour theres a group of elite players who frequent the top of the leader board and the order of merit.Guys who gain their card tend to do quite well as they still have game and are eager compered to the Euro tour past good money earners that can come back year after year and play but to be honest dont have much game anymore.Ive seen quite a few guys qualify for the tour and hit some good form and do very well but there does seem to be a small window where players have most success and then age and the lack of hunger gets the better of them.As for the US champions tour the standard is very high, its not unusual to see those guys still do well on the USPGA when they play, take Couples for example at The Masters!

 

[Birchy]

Ive caddied on The European Seniors Tour and yes the standard is high.As with the regular tour theres a group of elite players who frequent the top of the leader board and the order of merit.Guys who gain their card tend to do quite well as they still have game and are eager compered to the Euro tour past good money earners that can come back year after year and play but to be honest dont have much game anymore.Ive seen quite a few guys qualify for the tour and hit some good form and do very well but there does seem to be a small window where players have most success and then age and the lack of hunger gets the better of them.As for the US champions tour the standard is very high, its not unusual to see those guys still do well on the USPGA when they play, take Couples for example at The Masters!

What was it like caddying?

Did you just offer up your services for free or do you know somebody who plays on there?

 

[cleanstrike]

I think he will need to be lower than scratch to do any good and he would also have had a good few wins to see him through the pressure of playing in tour events. It's a different league to the amatuer game.

I don't quite understand this handicap lark what with me being fairly new to this. Am I right in saying that scratch is effectively zero in handicap parlance? Is it possible to go lower (I suppose into minus figures). How does that work exactly? Humour me ... I'm an idiot.

 

[Foxholer]

The actual existence of the EST has actually been quite marginal for the last couple of years.

While it's seemingly solid/organised for Qualifying and The Seniors Open, the actual events seem to be getting harder and harder to find sponsors for - a reflection of the times.

Certainly last year's schedule was not fully published (meaning sponsors hadn't been finalised) until very late/part way through the proposed schedule!

ISPS HANDA is propping up a huge amount of 'non-US' Golf!

 

[Foxholer]

I don't quite understand this handicap lark what with me being fairly new to this. Am I right in saying that scratch is effectively zero in handicap parlance? Is it possible to go lower (I suppose into minus figures). How does that work exactly? Humour me ... I'm an idiot.

Possibly worth creating another thread for this....but, yes that's correct. And lower than Scratch is actually a 'Plus' handicap, working exactly the same way. A handicap of +2.5 would play off +2; a +2.6 would play off +3. In a Stableford comp, a Plus-capper 'gives strokes to the course' (so Par = 1 point) on SI 18, 17... etc according to their handicap.

Scratch/0 is only a significant 'marker' for (Assistant) PGA Professionals. Expected to be handicap of 4 or less to become one. As Handicap is only for Amateurs, a Pro has no handicap and plays tournaments with no reference to handicap.